taking the knee - what are your thoughts

[Is it PotG?]

And they say our country isn’t racist.

Who is 'they'?

 

[Dick Swiveller]

That works both ways though.

You think people should be able to convince other people to START booing?

 

[Nixonator]

Police Officer 1 "Can someone do a background check on this "person of colour" so I can assess just how violent I can be towards them?"

Despatch "I see a missed bus fare, smoking marijuana, littering and possession of curly hair*"

PO 1 "Oh a wrong 'un then? I'm on it!"

FFS

Personally I would wholly support kicking the shit out of anyone who litters

Thread full of the usual tits on both sides of the argument, refusing to move an inch out their respective camps. Accusations of racism and wokism. ****ing yawn.

 

[Swansman]

Its my column topic this week.

TO BOO OR NOT TO BOO, THAT IS THE QUESTION?



England’s final EURO 2020 warm up game was shrouded in controversy even before a ball was kicked as a number of fans at the Riverside Stadium appeared to boo the England players as they took the knee before the kick off.

No amount of condemnation of the supporters chorus can hide the fact that this issue isn’t going to go away, and that maybe the FA need to have a complete rethink?

One huge aspect is George Floyd himself, as icons go he’s certainly no Rosa Parkes or Nelson Mandela.

Yes he was murdered, which was a human tragedy in itself, and his killer has been brought to justice, however Floyd’s back story does in many peoples eyes, right around the globe, present a huge question mark over his credibility to being a ‘beacon of hope’ or a catalyst for change.

Whilst its wrong to boo the knee, perhaps now is the time to stop it?

Instead does the UK need to almost forget Floyd and what’s going on in the US and effectively start our own changes in this country?

Would Ian Wright and Harry Kane fronting a nationwide knife amnesty be better than taking the knee?

Would changing the junior and senior school curriculum to cover all the highlighted issues and that of homophobia, hate crimes, social media abuse and all the historical aspects that accompany them be better than taking the knee?

Would rolling out a nationwide government funded programme where we invest in the nations youth, from the inner cities to the countryside communities, be better than taking the knee?

Would investing in the Police , and returning to a time where they were not only a force but had the respect of the overwhelming majority of the population be better than taking the knee?

The legendary P T Barnum famously said “You can’t fool all of the people all of the time” and a large part of this country either publicly, as with the booing, or privately are of the opinion that highly paid sporting figures going down on one knee won’t change anything in the long run.

Whilst I will always have the Albion/Palace rivalry at the back of my mind, I actually think the aforementioned Ian Wright would be the ideal frontman to bring about real change, not hollow gestures but real changes to our society, I believe he already has widespread respect the length and breadth of the nation.

Post pandemic, once normality returns this will be a huge challenge for Boris and co, perhaps one of the most significant government actions of the next 20 years?

Do you get paid for this shit?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

This thread is an accident waiting to happen. Won’t take much..

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

It is funny people are unaware that “taking the knee” was an NFL issue to begin with and prior to Floyds murder.

At least it shows some level of awareness. Unlike Dominic Raab who thought it was something to do with Game Of Thrones

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Snakes alive this thread is still live !

 

[Acker79]

-Why are all the taking the knee threads being deleted/moved?
-because everyone comes in with their minds made up and we simply rehash the same entrenched positions with some coming close to or crossing the line, others making false accusation and it's just an ugly mess
-Right. Well let's continue discussing it then...

 

[BBassic]

I'm unclear.

If the players decided to use a different gesture rather than the knee would people stop booing it? What if they all did a handstand to promote tolerance and equality instead?

 

[Insel affe]

I think some people should not be too harsh on Lenny, his post is not the most thought out post he has ever posted. Many on here know Lenny personally and could confirm that he is not a racist as some are alluding to with their castication of his post. Yes it could have been written better, but there is no malice in this post, no out and out racism, he is of a generation like me where sometimes we mean well, but just don't articulate things correctly or as well as we should, this only goes to show be very careful what you post in social media. I am sure Lenny regrets not getting his point across more eloquently, and is no way a racist.

Far to easy to jump on a band wagon, and vilify them, stop think, why, what point was he trying to make, we all know Lenny has had tuff times, will this vitriol drive him into a dark place, I hope not.

Peace out people.
BLM x

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Taking the knee, and indeed the booing is keeping the issue of racism in today’s society at the front of many people’s agenda, therefore it is still achieving what it set out to do.

The more the racist knuckle draggers boo, the more relevant taking the knee becomes, but, they’re too thick to realise this.

This.

Nicky Campbell has a programme on it now. There are still people arguing that people 'rightly' object to the knee taking because the 'black lives matters movement is controversial'. Even though it has been said time and time again the knee taking has nothing to do with any political organization. Where does this shit come from?

I seem to recall Das Reich posting links to a Russian fake website that that purports to be the face of 'the black lives matters' movement, in order to support his argument that the BLM 'movement' is run by 'Trained Marxists'.

I don't know who is at the root of this wankerdom, but it is clear that goons like Das Reich, the sort of fools who subscribe to the various dodgy news feeds, and who are part of the England fans old school, are going to be booing the knee-taking for the forseeable, throughout the Euros, in the belief they are standing up against Marxism.

You couldn't make this stuff up, but there is no need - it is happening.

 

[Klaas]

I think some people should not be too harsh on Lenny, his post is not the most thought out post he has ever posted. Many on here know Lenny personally and could confirm that he is not a racist as some are alluding to with their castication of his post. Yes it could have been written better, but there is no malice in this post, no out and out racism, he is of a generation like me where sometimes we mean well, but just don't articulate things correctly or as well as we should, this only goes to show be very careful what you post in social media. I am sure Lenny regrets not getting his point across more eloquently, and is no way a racist.

Far to easy to jump on a band wagon, and vilify them, stop think, why, what point was he trying to make, we all know Lenny has had tuff times, will this vitriol drive him into a dark place, I hope not.

Peace out people.
BLM x

I don't know if you considered my post as vilifying him or not, but it was my understanding that it was an article, not just a post on here, so I was taken aback at how poor it was.

 

[BadFish]

Whatever you think of taking the knee, if you are booing or defending the booers then you are a moron.

Not sure what else needs to be said.

I hope they keep it going though, that way we can keep the issue of racism in society front and centre.

 

[cunning fergus]

When the debate is about structural racism and someone shouts "what about knife crime?", I'd say it makes them a bit of a racist. They are suggesting, unwittingly or not, that black people should get their own house in order (ie. stop stabbing each other) before they complain about anything else.

It’s a complex issue isn’t it, but I think I can accept an argument that knife crime is not itself a measure of structural racism, it’s more compelling to argue it’s a symptom.

However if you take structural racism and the changes needed in areas like (say) house ownership (given the substantial difference in house ownership by ethnicity) what are the answers?

Most likely some kind of public/private programme where lenders and/or the Government offset more favourable mortgage packages for black people. Maybe black borrowers have a more favourable interest rate than white borrowers.

Maybe those kneeling on the football pitches (being paid £10m pa bracket) could set up discrete trust funds with so monies would be available for poor black people to draw on for deposits etc.

That would be a much more practical step to reversing structural racism than 15 seconds kneeling down before a football match. Perhaps if the privileged burghers of Teeside could see the kneelers (and their supporters) gifting their money to poor black families they wouldn't have booed them.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I think some people should not be too harsh on Lenny, his post is not the most thought out post he has ever posted. Many on here know Lenny personally and could confirm that he is not a racist as some are alluding to with their castication of his post. Yes it could have been written better, but there is no malice in this post, no out and out racism, he is of a generation like me where sometimes we mean well, but just don't articulate things correctly or as well as we should, this only goes to show be very careful what you post in social media. I am sure Lenny regrets not getting his point across more eloquently, and is no way a racist.

Far to easy to jump on a band wagon, and vilify them, stop think, why, what point was he trying to make, we all know Lenny has had tuff times, will this vitriol drive him into a dark place, I hope not.

Peace out people.
BLM x

Yes, I like the man, have met him once, am friends on facebook etc.

If I can put it another way.....there are forces at work here who want anti racism to be conflated with Marxism. The knee taking has nothing to do with the political organization BLM, and certainly nothing to do with the fake organization whose web site is Russian owned, and which was used by Das Reich to support his claim that 'BLM' is run by 'Trained Marxists'.

With all that clear there is no excuses for being remotely old school about the knee taking.

The knee taking upsets some people who are not racist. Or think they are not racist. They need to ask themselves what they are objecting to.

Yes I know about the saintly prince Zaha and Sir Les Ferdinand. I happen to think they have made an error of judgement to boycott the knee taking.

The bottom line is there is nothing the likes of Das Reich want more than the knee taking to stop, or to carry on but be ridiculed. That alone is reason for it to continue and reason to not keep flirting with the 'it has run its course' narrative. Sorry Lenny, you need to think again about your position

 

[Guinness Boy]

It is quite clear that taking the knee is becoming increasly divisive and that isn't going to go away. It's only going to get more divisive as people choose their camps. We all know what happens after that.

It is time to stop it. Now. Otherwise it will end up doing the fight against racism more harm than good. In fact it's probably got to the point where it is doing exactly that.

(FWIW I support it, but it's important to recognise that just because I support it, doesn't mean it is the best thing to do in the grand scheme of things)

Good morning Neville Chamberlain

 

[Insel affe]

The bottom line is there is nothing the likes of Das Reich want more than the knee taking to stop, or to carry on but be ridiculed:

Oh I know this only too well, Das and his like minded brethren want this to continue, because they can use this to fan the flames of hate and hopefully convert more to their ideology, the neo nazis thrive on ignorance, poor education, lack of empathy division and confusion.

Have a good day.

 

[Bakero]

It’s a complex issue isn’t it, but I think I can accept an argument that knife crime is not itself a measure of structural racism, it’s more compelling to argue it’s a symptom.

However if you take structural racism and the changes needed in areas like (say) house ownership (given the substantial difference in house ownership by ethnicity) what are the answers?

Most likely some kind of public/private programme where lenders and/or the Government offset more favourable mortgage packages for black people. Maybe black borrowers have a more favourable interest rate than white borrowers.

Maybe those kneeling on the football pitches (being paid £10m pa bracket) could set up discrete trust funds with so monies would be available for poor black people to draw on for deposits etc.

That would be a much more practical step to reversing structural racism than 15 seconds kneeling down before a football match. Perhaps if the privileged burghers of Teeside could see the kneelers (and their supporters) gifting their money to poor black families they wouldn't have booed them.

It is a complex issue and I fully agree that real changes are needed, though I'm not sure your mortgage suggestion would go down too well. I don't have the answers, unfortunately. But with regard to home ownership, I'd start by taxing the **** out of second home owners.

Should millionaires do more to give back to the societies that have enriched them? Yes, and not just footballers. Does that mean that footballers shouldn't stand up/kneel down against racism unless they can display what tangible difference they're making? No.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Can we have a NS Culture War subforum for all tedious battle threads like this please ?

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

“It is from numberless diverse acts of courage and belief that human history is shaped. Each time a man stands up for an ideal, or acts to improve the lot of others, or strikes out against injustice, he sends forth a tiny ripple of hope, and crossing each other from a million different centers of energy and daring, those ripples build a current that can sweep down the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance.”
Robert F. Kennedy