Swearing an oath to British values.

[Dr. No]

Could you not see unions getting involved in this, if enforced?

No.

 

[Lower West Stander]

"Swearing an oath to British values."

It sound like something you'd do in your make believe gang with your friends when you are about six years old. Painful.

Shades Gripper Stebson with his mates at Grange Hill in the 80s?

I do seriously remember an episode where they did this.......

 

[soistes]

Pathetic and stupid idea, with not a chance of having any impact other than hugely irritating lots of law-abiding, hard-working and sensible NHS workers, public officials, school governors and whatnot.

I'm British, and as far as I'm concerned a key British value is not having anything to do with swearing oaths of loyalty to British values.

 

[Perfidious Albion]

I cannot see it making any difference to the quality of work done by those involved. It just makes it easier for the employers to sack you if you break your oath..

If it were me, my attitude would depend on what the oath actually required me to say. Chances are, it would be so ambiguous that they could find a ready excuse to discipline you on a whim if somebody complained about something you did, they could say it broke the oath.

 

[The Clamp]

I have no doubt if this ever came to pass there would be an opt out option. There would probably just be little Sanjit Patel alone every morning enthusiastically swearing his oath to The Raj while everyone else was outside having a fag and moaning about the weather.

 

[McTavish]

Being forced to take an oath in support of free speech seems beyond irony.

 

[alfredmizen]

Waste of time.

 

[alfredmizen]

Are we sure that all current British values should be embraced?

Yes.

 

[nicko31]

"Swearing an oath to British values."

It sound like something you'd do in your make believe gang with your friends when you are about six years old. Painful.

As soon as I hear this it brought back memories of Gripper Stepson on Grange Hill making Black kids swear allegiance to the British people

 

[Tom Bombadil]

I find the very idea of swearing an oath to British values to be against British values. It's the sort of thing insecure Johnny Foreigner types get up to

 

[Braggfan]

"impossible for people to play a “positive role” in public life unless they accepted basic values such as democracy and equality."

Is that the type of democracy and equality that has led us to end up with a prime minister who was neither elected and voted against gay marriage?

 

[Buzzer]

Is that the type of democracy and equality that has led us to end up with a prime minister who was neither elected and voted against gay marriage?

a) We don't elect Prime Ministers, we elect MPs. The Tory Party as a whole won the 2015 election and so it really doesn't matter who they choose to lead the party in government. They don't need to call a general election every time there's a change in leadership. There's no degradation of democracy.

b) Theresa May voted in favour of civil partnerships in 2004 and in 2013 she voted in favour of gay marriage. According to Baroness Featherstone, who constructed the equal marriage law, her very vocal support was pivotal in ensuring that it went through.

 

[Braggfan]

a) We don't elect Prime Ministers, we elect MPs. The Tory Party as a whole won the 2015 election and so it really doesn't matter who they choose to lead the party in government. They don't need to call a general election every time there's a change in leadership.

b) Theresa May voted in favour of civil partnerships in 2004 and in 2013 she voted in favour of gay marriage. According to Baroness Featherstone, who constructed the equal marriage law, her very vocal support was pivotal in ensuring that it went through.

I stand corrected on Theresa May's civil partnership votes, but she still has a chequered history on LGBT issues. She voted against repealing section 28 for example.

It's too simplistic to say we vote for MP's rather than PM's, especially given the current voting system. But we currently have a PM that not a single person outside her party members voted for to be leader, or voted for her party while she was leader. That doesn't sound very democratic.

But what it highlights is that the notion of British values are so ambiguous, how can we swear allegiance to them when we can't even agree on what constitutes democracy?

 

[Buzzer]

I stand corrected on Theresa May's civil partnership votes, but she still has a chequered history on LGBT issues. She voted against repealing section 28 for example.

I agree but there's no doubting that Theresa May has wholeheartedly supported equality for the LGBT community for many years now. She's clearly seen the light.

It's too simplistic to say we vote for MP's rather than PM's, especially given the current voting system. But we currently have a PM that not a single person outside her party members voted for to be leader, or voted for her party while she was leader. That doesn't sound very democratic.

It's not simplistic to say that we vote for MPs given the current voting system - because it IS our current voting system - we vote for MPs, that's what we do. And the general public has never ever voted for who becomes party leader of any political party. That's the sole preserve of the party members.

So Theresa May became Tory leader and therefore PM mid-term. It doesn't change a thing. For a start, it's happened 6 times already since 1945 and that spans just 14 elections, 4 times for the Tories and twice for Labour and there has never ever been a general election called on the back of it. There simply isn't a need and it's extremely clear why - because we elect MPs. It's how our democracy works. Other countries have different democracies but ours is just as democratic.

 

[essexeagle]

Great idea but rarely has there been a more apt time for the quote 'after the horse has bolted'.

But let's get real. If you're stuck in a spot in your home country and you get the chance to 'earn' an income you could hardly begin to dream about by coming over 'ere and accepting the fortnightly Government handout, then I'm sure you would pledge allegiance to the bloody BHA fan club if you had to!

Well, maybe that's taking it too far but you get the gist.....They would do anything to get in so the whole thing is a waste of time

 

[WSU Dilettante]

There's something about making people swear an oath to British values, that is decisively not British.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Rarely does an issue almost universally unite NSC. That's the one positive I can see from this ludicrous waste of time.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Should have been brought I years ago.......this is one thing the Americans have got right in respect of immigration, and we haven't. Sooner the PLP realises this, the sooner that disaffected Labour voters will come back in droves.

Oh.

 

[spring hall convert]

Great idea but rarely has there been a more apt time for the quote 'after the horse has bolted'.

But let's get real. If you're stuck in a spot in your home country and you get the chance to 'earn' an income you could hardly begin to dream about by coming over 'ere and accepting the fortnightly Government handout, then I'm sure you would pledge allegiance to the bloody BHA fan club if you had to!

Well, maybe that's taking it too far but you get the gist.....They would do anything to get in so the whole thing is a waste of time

How is it a great idea then?

In a period where the Government needs to be 100% on the ball to avoid us getting shafted in the forthcoming Brexit negotiations, that they choose to waste time on showy, meaningless, bullshit to try and placate what they think The Daily Express wants is insulting to all of us.

 

[symyjym]

I'm a bit confused to what our British values are these days?