Support for the Public sector workers?

[London Calling]

Why the hell should public sector workers retire 5 years before I will have to just becasue they work for the government and have a cushy job for life. f*** Em I say!

Don't like it ....join the public sector and accept lower wages for doing the same job as a private sector conter part, plus no bonuses etc

The Pension has always been a attractive factor in recruiting public sector staff.

When I first left local government.....the Pension was the one factor that nearly made me stay.

If you want public sector services, something must be offered to attract staff.

 

[HampshireSeagulls]

Is now a bad time to mention that I get an immediate pension (£9K) this year at age 40, plus a tax free lump sum (£40K), and that I will still qualify for a state pension, plus the pension that I will be earning when/if I qualify as a teacher? Add to that my wife's civil service pension, EDS pension and now local government pension?


I have to support the strike as my missus is a government worker (but it's her day off anyway).

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

Don't like it ....join the public sector and accept lower wages for doing the same job as a private sector conter part, plus no bonuses etc

The Pension has always been a attractive factor in recruiting public sector staff.

When I first left local government.....the Pension was the one factor that nearly made me stay.

If you want public sector services, something must be offered to attract staff.

But you do get far better job security. I know that they sometimes go around cutting staff here and there but in reality its very hard to lose your job if you work in the public sector. In the private sector your company could lose a contract and you'll be out on your ear.

 

[HampshireSeagulls]

But you do get far better job security. I know that they sometimes go around cutting staff here and there but in reality its very hard to lose your job if you work in the public sector. In the private sector your company could lose a contract and you'll be out on your ear.

Was true in the past, but not now. Owing to a reorganisation, the civil service in Portsmouth and surrounding areas have shed 1000s of jobs in the last year by restructuring, removing posts, and making current staff reapply for their jobs. A good exercise for culling dead wood, but used to hide what is actually a cost-cutting measure (more work, less people).

 

[Lord Bracknell]

join the public sector and accept lower wages for doing the same job as a private sector counter part, plus no bonuses etc

For staff in the kind of local government job that would come with massive bonuses if it was in the private sector, the LG pension is a fairly puny alternative.

I know a planning lawyer who moved from a local authority job to a private sector firm and saw her salary jump manyfold. She can afford to buy houses just with her annual bonus.

Fundamentally, the work hasn't changed. She dealt with planning applications at the council. She deals with planning applications now.

The same is the case with other professional staff in, say, planning or transport.

What keeps people in the public sector is very often a simple commitment to public service. It sure as hell isn't the money.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

What keeps people in the public sector is very often a simple commitment to public service. It sure as hell isn't the money.

Not because they wouldn't last a month in the private sector?

Sorry to be cynical but while I see many people who do work in the public sector because of a committment to public service there an equal number (im sitting opposite one now) who are just very poor at what they do but are kept in the job because they can't get rid of them.

 

[Dandyman]

Not because they wouldn't last a month in the private sector?

Sorry to be cynical but while I see many people who do work in the public sector because of a committment to public service there an equal number (im sitting opposite one now) who are just very poor at what they do but are kept in the job because they can't get rid of them.

Funny thing is that I've read this after coming out of a meeting which decided not to confirm the appointment of someone in their probation period at the local authority I work for. It is simply not true that the incompetent or ill-disciplined can't be got rid of, it just takes the will and the knowledge of how to do it properly.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

Funny thing is that I've read this after coming out of a meeting which decided not to confirm the appointment of someone in their probation period at the local authority I work for. It is simply not true that the incompetent or ill-disciplined can't be got rid of, it just takes the will and the knowledge of how to do it properly.

During probation yes it is easier. You know of anyone going after this? I've been working in the civil service for 7 years and i don't know of anyone that has been dismissed for continued poor performance during this time.

 

[HampshireSeagulls]

During probation yes it is easier. You know of anyone going after this? I've been working in the civil service for 7 years and i don't know of anyone that has been dismissed for continued poor performance during this time.

I do! I got rid of two that worked (loose term) for me by invoking the restoring efficiency guidelines, but I was similarly stopped from getting rid of one who made the review points before dropping off again. It's not easy, but you have to persevere.

 

[Stinky Kat]

before the government start swiping at poor paid workers rights they might do well to look at their own contracts of employment and see that the taxpayer funds the most generous pension for our hard working MPS.

They are hypocrites one and all. We need a revoloution and a guillotine for Blair and his twisted spinning liars

 

[Dandyman]

I do! I got rid of two that worked (loose term) for me by invoking the restoring efficiency guidelines, but I was similarly stopped from getting rid of one who made the review points before dropping off again. It's not easy, but you have to persevere.

What he said. I have a number of discipline/attendance cases at the moment which will (probably) result in either final written warnings or dismissals. As Hants says you just persevere and make sure you handle the situation legally and appropriately.

 

[Lokki 7]

I do! I got rid of two that worked (loose term) for me by invoking the restoring efficiency guidelines, but I was similarly stopped from getting rid of one who made the review points before dropping off again. It's not easy, but you have to persevere.

I sacked a bloke last year for being a French twat. Don't you just love the flexible private labour market.

 

[Dandyman]

I sacked a bloke last year for being a French twat. Don't you just love the flexible private labour market.

It's those Finnish Lotharios you need to watch out for.

 

[Lokki 7]

It's those Finnish Lotharios you need to watch out for.

Indeed. Much harder to get rid of.

 

[London Calling]

But you do get far better job security. I know that they sometimes go around cutting staff here and there but in reality its very hard to lose your job if you work in the public sector. In the private sector your company could lose a contract and you'll be out on your ear.

Not the case anymore.

Services are tendered out. A lot of staff are brought in on fixed term contracts.

 

[Stinky Kat]

Not the case anymore.

Services are tendered out. A lot of staff are brought in on fixed term contracts.

Lots of expensive agency staff and consultants too - no savings, but big tyaxpayers bucks for the senior staff and those who woo them

 

[London Calling]

Not because they wouldn't last a month in the private sector?

Sorry to be cynical but while I see many people who do work in the public sector because of a committment to public service there an equal number (im sitting opposite one now) who are just very poor at what they do but are kept in the job because they can't get rid of them.

Myths mate.

I look at the banks in my area and the way the staff manage and managed our accounts.

Poorly trained, constant mistakes, poor sevice, rudeness, unkept offices and incompetance.

I would have got them out whilst I managed in my London Councils.

You got to compare like for like. Megalithic employers inherit the same managment problems whilst small companies cannot afford poor staff and spend a bit more time sussing out the individual.

LC

 

[Tom Bombadil]

For staff in the kind of local government job that would come with massive bonuses if it was in the private sector, the LG pension is a fairly puny alternative.

I know a planning lawyer who moved from a local authority job to a private sector firm and saw her salary jump manyfold. She can afford to buy houses just with her annual bonus.

Fundamentally, the work hasn't changed. She dealt with planning applications at the council. She deals with planning applications now.

The same is the case with other professional staff in, say, planning or transport.

What keeps people in the public sector is very often a simple commitment to public service. It sure as hell isn't the money.

I think you are perhaps confusing the issue of professional's working in the public sector with employees as a whole. It's true that Lawyers can probably earn more in the private sector, but that doesn't hold for unskilled and semi skilled workers who earn less in the private sector than comparable jobs in the public sector.

The sad truth is we are all going to have to work longer because we're living longer. In this case the real injustice is the government picking on the lower paid and eaving those who can better afford a reduction in pension entitlements alone.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

I think you are perhaps confusing the issue of professional's working in the public sector with employees as a whole. It's true that Lawyers can probably earn more in the private sector, but that doesn't hold for unskilled and semi skilled workers who earn less in the private sector than comparable jobs in the public sector.

The sad truth is we are all going to have to work longer because we're living longer. In this case the real injustice is the government picking on the lower paid and eaving those who can better afford a reduction in pension entitlements alone.

I'm very conscious of the difference between "professionals" and low paid staff.

I'm currently working for a voluntary sector organisation that does a lot of contract work for the public sector.

When I first arrived, I was horrified to discover that we employed two dozen dedicated people with responsible (and difficult) part-time jobs, and we were paying them the National Minimum Wage, with no pension provision at all.

We've now managed to raise wage levels so that this group of people is getting the minimum local government pay for staff aged 21 and over.

What I do know, though, is that the answer to the crisis in local government funding isn't to reduce people's pay and conditions to the worst that can be found in the private sector. Nor is it to tell low paid public sector staff that they should shut up, because things could be worse.

 

[Dandyman]

I'm very conscious of the difference between "professionals" and low paid staff.

I'm currently working for a voluntary sector organisation that does a lot of contract work for the public sector.

When I first arrived, I was horrified to discover that we employed two dozen dedicated people with responsible (and difficult) part-time jobs, and we were paying them the National Minimum Wage, with no pension provision at all.

We've now managed to raise wage levels so that this group of people is getting the minimum local government pay for staff aged 21 and over.

What I do know, though, is that the answer to the crisis in local government funding isn't to reduce people's pay and conditions to the worst that can be found in the private sector. Nor is it to tell low paid public sector staff that they should shut up, because things could be worse.