[Albion] Squad Rotation 2023

[Dave the hatosaurus]

I have seen mentioned in a few threads a concern regarding the amount of changes in starting elevens so i thought i would have a look at it as we have now played 15 matches.
I have expressed the games as number of changes, result W L or D, and the number of days between matches (NOT counting the match days themselves i.e. play thursday then play sunday = 2 days)
luton W / wolves 3c W 6d / west 'am 2c L 6d / newcastle 3c W 6d / manu 6c W 13d / aek 7c L 4d / bmuff 9c W 2d / chels 7c L 2d / villa 9c L 2d / mars 5c D 4d / liver 6c D 2d / city 3c L 12d / ajax 4c W 4d / fulham 6c D 2d / everton 5c D 5d
Unsurprisingly i suppose the period with the highest amount of changes also corresponded with the shortest gaps between games but i do not think you could conclusively say that it was the cause of poor results. Our players with the most starts are Mitoma with 14 and Dunk with 13 but also worth noting that prior to injury Estupinan had started 8 out of 9 and March 9 out of 12.
There has also been discussion on the goalkeepers and i noted that the 7 games where we started with a different keeper to the previous game resulted in 2W 2D and 3L. Steele has started 9 games 4W 2D 3L conceding 17 goals and Verbruggen has started 6 games 2W 2D 2L conceding 9 goals again probably worth noting Steele's goals skewed somewhat by one game!
I sincerely hope a few of you have found my waffling of some interest.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

How does this compare with other clubs competing in Europe?

 

[Mancgull]

Perhaps what’s happened to spurs tonight shows what happens when teams don’t rotate.
It happened to us in the last quarter of last season with multiple injuries, when not rotating. The rotation will probably help us later in the season.

 

[phoenix]

I have seen mentioned in a few threads a concern regarding the amount of changes in starting elevens so i thought i would have a look at it as we have now played 15 matches.
I have expressed the games as number of changes, result W L or D, and the number of days between matches (NOT counting the match days themselves i.e. play thursday then play sunday = 2 days)
luton W / wolves 3c W 6d / west 'am 2c L 6d / newcastle 3c W 6d / manu 6c W 13d / aek 7c L 4d / bmuff 9c W 2d / chels 7c L 2d / villa 9c L 2d / mars 5c D 4d / liver 6c D 2d / city 3c L 12d / ajax 4c W 4d / fulham 6c D 2d / everton 5c D 5d
Unsurprisingly i suppose the period with the highest amount of changes also corresponded with the shortest gaps between games but i do not think you could conclusively say that it was the cause of poor results. Our players with the most starts are Mitoma with 14 and Dunk with 13 but also worth noting that prior to injury Estupinan had started 8 out of 9 and March 9 out of 12.
There has also been discussion on the goalkeepers and i noted that the 7 games where we started with a different keeper to the previous game resulted in 2W 2D and 3L. Steele has started 9 games 4W 2D 3L conceding 17 goals and Verbruggen has started 6 games 2W 2D 2L conceding 9 goals again probably worth noting Steele's goals skewed somewhat by one game!
I sincerely hope a few of you have found my waffling of some interest.

Totally agree its worth bearing in mind that with the Carrabo early exit weve only played a whole 2 extra games than a small number of the other premier teams. So imho all these changes are a bit unnecassy and even more ironic we seem to have more injuries this season i known that is just bad luck. I seem to remember Potter being called the tinker man. Funny when he stopped tinkering we became a better team. I have no problem with 3-4 changes but even RDZ said perhaps he is making too many changes. Well he needs top listen to himself. I'm sure this is why we play like a bunch of strangers and always seem to be crap in the 1st half of games recently. By the time they get to the 2nd half they have intruduced themselves and generally improve.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

My perception is that RDZ identified that much of last year's success was from using a core of 12 or 13 players that could play the way he wanted them too.
Those players were flogged to death and our results at the end of the season became increasingly patchy.

It is my belief that De Zerbi's rotation is less to do with the current schedule and more to do with working with a bigger group of players capable of playing his style.
This approach may see us well placed for the second half of the season.

He is still overly dependant on Gross/Dunk/Mitoma/Estupinan.
But hopefully as Igor/Dahoud/Fati get more and more up to speed, that won't be so much of a drop off when those players need to be rested.

 

[Littlemo]

I think that to be fair to RDZ, he didn’t rotate enough last year (I.e players like Undav, Van Hecke, Gilmour, Buonanotte even Ensico for a while) sat on the bench for most of the season and tbh, he could have been introducing them earlier and giving the others a rest.

We saw how it took its toll at the end of the season when he was forced to rest them and throw the others in.

I actually applaud him for seeing that and making changes this season. He is (I think) trying to give everyone enough minutes to get up to speed with his style and to keep them in a match-fit condition. The only downside is that it takes some time to come to the boil and work well but I still think it’s the right idea.

 

[phoenix]

I guess the more he does rotate the more it should improve but one game he changed i think it was 9 players.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

I think that to be fair to RDZ, he didn’t rotate enough last year (I.e players like Undav, Van Hecke, Gilmour, Buonanotte even Ensico for a while) sat on the bench for most of the season and tbh, he could have been introducing them earlier and giving the others a rest.

We saw how it took its toll at the end of the season when he was forced to rest them and throw the others in.

I actually applaud him for seeing that and making changes this season. He is (I think) trying to give everyone enough minutes to get up to speed with his style and to keep them in a match-fit condition. The only downside is that it takes some time to come to the boil and work well but I still think it’s the right idea.

My thoughts exactly.

In some ways, i wished he would literally have a team A and Team B and rotate the whole team.
That way the players might start developing partnerships quicker than they are at present.

The difference between this season and last is the lack of "telepathy" in the passing.
Players are frequently not in the right place for the first time passes, essential in DeZerbi ball

 

[Littlemo]

My thoughts exactly.

In some ways, i wished he would literally have a team A and Team B and rotate the whole team.
That way the players might start developing partnerships quicker than they are at present.

The difference between this season and last is the lack of "telepathy" in the passing.
Players are frequently not in the right place for the first time passes, essential in DeZerbi ball

Yeah I agree, I see this as the big thing in the wayward passing. You can see players are expecting someone to be where they have sent the ball!

I guess the only problem with A and B teams is that the B team can often feel a bit “less” than the A team. Like they get the easy games and aren’t considered good enough.

I mean if we were to say win the FA cup with the B team, how much do the A team really feel like they contributed to that if they never played? I like that nearly all the players have had some games in both the league and Europe.

It’s also the case that with injuries, they’ll all end up playing alongside each other in different variations at some point anyway.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Agree with the points that the rotation will ultimately be a benefit. A benefit currently hidden because we've not had much luck with injuries.

Also agree that we're too reliant on Gross, Mitoma and Dunk. Crucially all three are also playing international football now, which means that in December with all those games, some serious red lights on the dashboard will be going off

 

[US Seagull]

Perhaps what’s happened to spurs tonight shows what happens when teams don’t rotate.
It happened to us in the last quarter of last season with multiple injuries, when not rotating. The rotation will probably help us later in the season.

I think two red cards probably had more to do with that then anything else.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

Agree with the points that the rotation will ultimately be a benefit. A benefit currently hidden because we've not had much luck with injuries.

Also agree that we're too reliant on Gross, Mitoma and Dunk. Crucially all three are also playing international football now, which means that in December with all those games, some serious red lights on the dashboard will be going off

We aren't alone in that though.
This season a lot of clubs are having higher levels of injuries.
Newcastle/United/Palace have been particularly affected.

Probably a hangover from the extended season last year on top of longer matches, with the additional injury time.

 

[Perkino]

Bringing plenty of players up to speed by giving them game time throughout the season means we can have an injury or suspension and barely notice it. Unfortunately we have lost both Estupinan and Lamptey now from LB and since then played Liverpool, Man City, Fulham & Everton - 3 Draws and 1 Lose, not disastrous but a loss of momentum.

I personally love the fact that Verbruggen, Van Hecke, Igor, Dahoud, Gilmour, Baleba, Adingra, Pedro & Ferguson are getting regular minutes and I believe we will be better prepared in the second half of the season because of it

 

[OzMike]

According to this, Villa and we have been sussed.

Aston Villa and Brighton need to learn how to play like the heavy favourite

There can be no greater complement to the work of Unai Emery and Roberto de Zerbi than the deference now shown to Aston Villa and Brighton.

www.sportinglife.com

 

[Flounce]

After Rob Green dissing keeper rotation at the Brentford game, here’s another keeper saying the same today.

Does RDZ have a clue what he is doing?

Why Arsenal rotation would not help Raya or Ramsdale

After mistakes against Luton Town, does goalkeeper David Raya deserve to keep his starting place at Arsenal ahead of Aaron Ramsdale?

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Perkino]

I don't think it has really impacted our team by rotating the goalkeepers. I don't think results would have been very different if we had just stuck to one of them all season

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Are you not going to furnish us with any analysis of these data? Would be nice to know what it all means

 

[Littlemo]

I was watching the West Ham game the other night and it occurred to me that they rotate their keepers very effectively. Fabianski had come in for Areola as he’d been injured, but he’d played their cup games anyway, so they all looked immediately comfortable with him. I think they still have a set 1st and 2nd choice but it’s much closer than at other teams and both seem to play a good amount.

I suspect that if nobody had said anything about doing it and just did it, then I wonder how long it would be before the media said anything?