[Albion] Special Buses: Negotiations Ongoing with Alternative Bus Co + "supporter contributiion"

[seagullsovergrimsby]

This sounds like a ridiculously simple idea, but how about

The club sell all season tickets at 'face value' eg no subsidy
If you don't want to use public transport, you don't pay the transport costs added on
If you use the train within certain boundary zones (could be set like London with zones 1-6), you pay for a 'football train season ticket' on top
If you want to use a bus within certain boundary zones you pay for a 'football bus season ticket on top'

Season tickets for transport issued seperately and only available for use on match days before and after game within specific zones
Club only pays a transport subsidy for those that use it
Use of 'zoned season tickets' means club and bus company know exactly how many buses/coaches they will need to maximise efficiency in each zone. Could even look at STH's specifying a pick-up location to make things even easier for routing/


General Sale ticket holders just pay for their travel as they would on any other day for any other purpose (or can pre-book at the time of booking their ticket if they want to use a 'special bus service e.g. Rottingdean'.)

It's not really rocket science, makes things cheaper for those who walk / drive, saves money for the club by no longer subisiding travel for those who don't use it.

The first season at The Amex proved that a voluntary opt in scheme doesn't work. 90% or more travelled for free once word got around there were no ticket checks on the trains to collect the travel vouchers and likewise on the buses fans just waved the season ticket card or paper ticket at the driver. Creating exemptions causes more problems than it solves.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The club needs the transport management plan or whatever it is called. All Barber needs to do is figure out how much it all costs and add it to the season ticket price. Simple. And this is what we were doing. Carving it up complicates things and contradicts Barber's previous "all in it together" reply to walkers complaining they had to pay the transport levy. If buses are now seperated out, I can see a case for Beach Hut's argument.

 

[Hotchilidog]

All good objectives led comms plans have a what if factor. What if a disgruntled party leaks the information, what if negotiations fail, what if regulators stop us from doing this etc etc. They should have planned for this and had reactive and proactive statements ready. Simply they didn't. And this isnt the first time this has happened.

I agree the communication here has been poor and the club are left reacting to a story rather than controlling it. As soon as the special bus service was going to be changed they should have made an announcement. Seeing as they fully intend to replace the B&H Bus service with something else they could have prevented the panic we saw yesterday, even if the details have yet to be finalised.

In most of the spats brewing on here recently I have been broadly in support of the club, however their communications are utterly woeful at the moment. In the internet age people are going to find out things sooner rather than later. The club need to realise that communication is key to maintaining a good relationship with fans as quite frankly we can be an incredibly touchy bunch (sometimes with justification).

 

[Brighton Breezy]

What about people with mobility problems who rely on the special buses? I assume they will essentially be forced to stump up additional cash which, however small, does not seem at all fair having been sold their season tickets on the understanding free travel was included.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

The club needs the transport management plan or whatever it is called. All Barber needs to do is figure out how much it all costs and add it to the season ticket price. Simple. And this is what we were doing. Carving it up complicates things and contradicts Barber's previous "all in it together" reply to walkers complaining they had to pay the transport levy. If buses are now seperated out, I can see a case for Beach Hut's argument.

Did you really mean to say wa*kers instead of walkers

 

[Hillian1]

What about people with mobility problems who rely on the special buses? I assume they will essentially be forced to stump up additional cash which, however small, does not seem at all fair having been sold their season tickets on the understanding free travel was included.

Surely that argument applies to everyone.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Was there a figure for how much the transport scheme costs in the latest set of annual accounts or was it hidden in that 'other' £14m or whatever it was?

 

[Greavsey]

I agree the communication here has been poor and the club are left reacting to a story rather than controlling it. As soon as the special bus service was going to be changed they should have made an announcement. Seeing as they fully intend to replace the B&H Bus service with something else they could have prevented the panic we saw yesterday, even if the details have yet to be finalised.

In most of the spats brewing on here recently I have been broadly in support of the club, however their communications are utterly woeful at the moment. In the internet age people are going to find out things sooner rather than later. The club need to realise that communication is key to maintaining a good relationship with fans as quite frankly we can be an incredibly touchy bunch (sometimes with justification).

Is Paul Camillin still head of External Comms? Or is his remit limited to on pitch matters only?? i.e. press liaison

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Surely that argument applies to everyone.

Of course. And it is one I completely agree with. However, the club COULD try and argue that a fan using, say the S, has the option to use public transport by getting bus into town then bus/train out to stadium if they don't want to pay the extra for the New S. It's not an argument I think has any weight, but the club could use it.

Where that would fall down though is in the case of fans with mobility problems for who easy access etc would have been a key part of their ticket buying decision making and who are left with no realistic alternative but having to stump up the extra.

 

[Greavsey]

The club needs the transport management plan or whatever it is called. All Barber needs to do is figure out how much it all costs and add it to the season ticket price. Simple. And this is what we were doing. Carving it up complicates things and contradicts Barber's previous "all in it together" reply to walkers complaining they had to pay the transport levy. If buses are now seperated out, I can see a case for Beach Hut's argument.

Yeah agreed, creating a special case in this instance sets a prescedent that can be used against the club by walkers, drivers or parachutists in future when they have to raise the price to cover the actual cost of the travel policy.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Was there a figure for how much the transport scheme costs in the latest set of annual accounts or was it hidden in that 'other' £14m or whatever it was?

I believe it was bundled into the "other costs" figure but personally reckon it has to be a seven figure sum incurred by the club.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

The club has previously said the old £30 contribution by fans was only about a third. So by that logic, about £90 a year per season ticket holder. Working on 22,000 of them, that's just under £2million.

 

[El Sid]

I believe it was bundled into the "other costs" figure but personally reckon it has to be a seven figure sum incurred by the club.

Maybe it's time the club stated exactly what the total bill for match day travel is and what the shortfall amounts to after we have all coughed up 30-50 quid each. I'd also like to know how much the club are charged for using the Uni and Bridge carpark. At £270 a pop this must pay for itself and some.

 

[Greavsey]

The club has previously said the old £30 contribution by fans was only about a third. So by that logic, about £90 a year per season ticket holder. Working on 22,000 of them, that's just under £2million.

Bloody hell! Now surely if the club clearly articulated this when next revising transport costs or arrangements it would cut out a lot of the moaning from fans given then earlier communicated £8m black hole?

 

[Hotchilidog]

The club has previously said the old £30 contribution by fans was only about a third. So by that logic, about £90 a year per season ticket holder. Working on 22,000 of them, that's just under £2million.

I do not think that is too far wide of the mark, from what I have heard. The transport costs for the club are massive, when you consider we have been 3million over the FFP debt ceiling you can see why the club are keen to reduce this particular cost.

 

[bobbybighead]

This is a joke if true I can't always make it due to shift work my two sons depend on the S bus they won't get home in time or will need to get the train then two buses home great this is shit!

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Bloody hell! Now surely if the club clearly articulated this when next revising transport costs or arrangements it would cut out a lot of the moaning from fans given then earlier communicated £8m black hole?

Possibly or, I imagine, some may point out that without the previously much boasted about transport plan, the club would possibly not have The Amex and therefore be up shit creek...

The transport infrastructure helped make moving to The Amex possible. The two things came very much as a package, or were certainly presented that way to planners etc.

Also, each fan already pays higher than average for tickets and makes a £50 travel subsidy.

Regardless of all that however, goalposts should not be moved once tickets have already been purchased in good faith they included what they were advertised as including...

 

[ROSM]

The club has previously said the old £30 contribution by fans was only about a third. So by that logic, about £90 a year per season ticket holder. Working on 22,000 of them, that's just under £2million.

The costs of travel in year one at the amex (based on c20k) was said to be 'well into 7 figures'. I had heard 1.3m. So with another 8k average I would say we are probably looking at 1.7m

 

[Brovion]

I agree the communication here has been poor and the club are left reacting to a story rather than controlling it. As soon as the special bus service was going to be changed they should have made an announcement. Seeing as they fully intend to replace the B&H Bus service with something else they could have prevented the panic we saw yesterday, even if the details have yet to be finalised.

In most of the spats brewing on here recently I have been broadly in support of the club, however their communications are utterly woeful at the moment. In the internet age people are going to find out things sooner rather than later. The club need to realise that communication is key to maintaining a good relationship with fans as quite frankly we can be an incredibly touchy bunch (sometimes with justification).

Good analysis, and I know we've been on opposite sides in some of the spats. As I mentioned before, communication aside, I DO have a great deal of sympathy with the club as far as transport is concerned. During the planning process we said what we needed to say to get approval, even if it was complete bollocks. Now the 'sustainable transport' chickens are coming home to roost and I have absolutely no doubt that the costs are WAY higher than anyone anticipated, even in their worst nightmares.

 

[Greavsey]

Possibly or, I imagine, some may point out that without the previously much boasted about transport plan, the club would possibly not have The Amex and therefore be up shit creek...

The transport infrastructure helped make moving to The Amex possible. The two things came very much as a package, or were certainly presented that way to planners etc. Not sure that's a valid argument as the club never said that they would provide free or subsidised travel, and could argue that if people don't want to pay to travel to the ground then they're not forced to come!!

Also, each fan already pays higher than average for tickets and makes a £50 travel subsidy. Yep, but there has to be a price above the average somewhere to maintain an mean average!!

Regardless of all that however, goalposts should not be moved once tickets have already been purchased in good faith they included what they were advertised as including... totally agree, all of this should have been communicated up front at renewal time or the club should have to swallow the cost for this year and postpone to next season

See my repsonse to your theoretical points in bold!