Southern Rail STRIKE details

[Not Andy Naylor]

Because the door business is a red herring which they are using along with the sham sickness allegations to try and win the media battle which unfortunately apart from a few idiots they've now lost. It's about staffing levels and breaking the unions to impose new working practices as Peter Wilkinson helpfully told everyone back in February

I thought as much.

 

[beorhthelm]

They already have an agreement to do that and have had so for years

interesting, though seems not to be applied, maybe my bad luck. so if they accept exceptions to the compulsory guard rule - why not a couple more?

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

I believe court is the only way to bring this to a head as GTR will continue to stick their fingers in their ears ignore everyone and carry on regardless.

This company have proven over a substantial period of time that they are unable to deliver the service for which they have already been paid and they have not been held to account for their shocking performance. For all the wailing and gnashing of teeth over the role of the RMT, the fact remains there has only been 10 days of strike thus far this year whilst the poor levels of service have been omnipresent.

This is a train operator that has published a timetable that it couldn't get with 70% of fulfilling (even on a good day), and has still failed to hit reasonable punctuality targets despite massivley reducing the number of services they have to run on MULTIPLE occasions. The company is short-staffed, poorly run and has not shown one shred of empathy towards the travelling public it inconveniences on a daily basis.

It has been explained ad naueseum that there are circumstances in which DOO could be regarded as safe, and thst there are also circumstances where this is not so. The reasons being lack of suitably equipped trains, lack of station staff and the peculiarities of some the rail infrastructure itself. The company however see fit to ignore these considerations and plough on regardless with the backing of the government.

The union could cave-in tomorrow and give in to GTR but I would not next expect any improvement in the shambolic service provided by this wretched company who seem utterly incapable of running a railway.

I hope that the court action finally reveals the full details of the franchise agreement and whether GTR have been in material breach. When taxpayers money and passenger fares are being used to fund this arrangement there should be no such thing as 'commercial confidentiality'. WE are customer and financiers of this deal and we have the right to know what is going on.

Very well said sir or madam

 

[Deadly Danson]

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...ent-of-transport-civil-servants-a7357316.html

Oh God - an article by Norman Baker I almost agree with.

 

[beorhthelm]

You better speak to Network Rail who have refused SASTA permission to run DOO trains elsewhere on the network then

actually i wnt to come back to this, is it a fact or heresay like the one about the new series trains weren't signed off to run for what ever reason, which has clearly been resolved. i really hope we arent going through all this grief for something they cant even implement.

 

[pb21]

Those points 1-3 were lifted directly from the Southern media release, the link to which I was quoting in my post. My only words were "Is this so unreasonable?"

And therein lies your mistake!

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...ent-of-transport-civil-servants-a7357316.html

Oh God - an article by Norman Baker I almost agree with.

Excellent article by the boy Baker. Gives an unequivocal kicking to both Wilkinson and Horton:

'[Department for Transport director Peter Wilkinson] suggested that drivers who opposed reform could “get the hell out of my industry” and that “we have got to break them”. And, for good measure, he added that he believed there were no rail companies “who would run services better than Southern”. His industry? Who does he think he is? He’s not even elected'.

'Southern chief executive Charles Horton must consider his position. His reign has been catastrophic and he has lost the support of staff and passengers alike.'

 

[Giraffe]

I'm heading to London, shall I bother?

 

[amexer]

was on underground yesterday. No one to close door and no driver. Mick Cash a joke just trying to justify his position..

 

[Napper]

was on underground yesterday. No one to close door and no driver. Mick Cash a joke just trying to justify his position..

Mick Cash has messed them up and they've all followed him like unimaginative lemmings.

I agree in part with what they are campaigning for and its right someone should stand up to that heinous company southern along with this Government that no one elected that is protected by the Media.

That said , I cant help thinking they could of come up with better ways of protesting rather than just striking because Mick Cash told them too.

They've not used any imagination get the public on side. This has ultimately cost them

 

[Arthur]

Is this so unreasonable?

Nope.

1. Southern has guaranteed that every train which has a conductor today will have a conductor or on board supervisor in the future. However, on trains where the driver has full control of train, if for any reason an on board supervisor is unavailable we want the flexibility to still run the train for the benefit of our passengers.

Absolutely.

2. An example of when we might run without a second person would be at times of disruption if an on-board supervisor was delayed on an inbound train and couldn’t get to his next train on time. In this circumstance we might let the train leave with the no second person, and arrange for an on-board supervisor to join part way through journey at an intermediate station. The RMT would expect us to cancel the train entirely, unnecessarily inconveniencing hundreds of passengers.

I am more than happy to travel on a service with no OBS or guard than not travel at all. Maybe that is because I have one train an hour and one being cancelled make a big difference.

3. There is a full and fair offer on the table that most workers would love to have – a guaranteed job for five years, above-inflation pay increases for the next two years and guaranteed overtime.

It seems crazy to me and judging by the commuters I speak to everyone else who operate in the real world. Yes we'd all like the trains we travel on a day to day basis to be as safe as humanly possible but we live in the real world where money makes the world go round and as long as we are not being put in danger, which I don't believe we would be as demonstrated by Thameslink and London Underground, services I have and do use regularly, it's very hard to have any sympathy with the union who feel they are entitled to bullet proof jobs. That said as part of the offer they've been given that for 5 years!!

Even the union has come out and said their members should take the deal but not after costing their members £2k each. Bonkers!! I wonder how many of their members are actually royally ****ed off with them now?

So if a disabled person requires assistance on-board or at either station during scenario 2 what should they do? Are Southern going to advise them to get another train, bearing in mind they've required 24 hours advance notice of the trains such a passenger intended to catch? If so, how?

How does a wheelchair bound person travel from Crowborough, Eridge, Ashurst, Edenbridge Town and I'm sure many other smaller stations across the network now?

Convenient excuse from the union that one....just like DOO being unsafe.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Mick Cash has messed them up and they've all followed him like unimaginative lemmings.

I agree in part with what they are campaigning for and its right someone should stand up to that heinous company southern along with this Government that no one elected that is protected by the Media.

That said , I cant help thinking they could of come up with better ways of protesting rather than just striking because Mick Cash told them too.

They've not used any imagination get the public on side. This has ultimately cost them

Think you'll find that on the whole the travelling public who express a preference are on the side of the union rather than the company. Because the travelling public aren't daft. They are fully aware that the 'service' the company provides is pretty shit, whether there's a strike or whether there isn't. Has been pretty shit ever since they've had the franchise given to them on a plate. For them it's always about a soulless search to bung more and more money into the pockets of their shareholders. The concept of providing a fit-for-purpose public transport service is alien to them.

 

[beorhthelm]

Think you'll find that on the whole the travelling public who express a preference are on the side of the union rather than the company. Because the travelling public aren't daft. They are fully aware that the 'service' the company provides is pretty shit, whether there's a strike or whether there isn't. Has been pretty shit ever since they've had the franchise given to them on a plate. For them it's always about a soulless search to bung more and more money into the pockets of their shareholders. The concept of providing a fit-for-purpose public transport service is alien to them.

the only view ive heard from fellow travellers is, in a nutshell, the service is shit, the unions making it shitter. last week i was cancelled for half an hour and delayed a couple of times by Southern's poor managment of the service. this week im cancelled 3 days in a row due to the unions poor decision to strike.

 

[Joe Gatting's Dad]

This Government was elected in 2015. It has a majority. The PM is elected by members of their party in accordance with their rules. 25% of the electorate voted for them.

The last Labour Government were elected by only 21% of the electorate and Gordon Brown became PM voted under the Labour Party rules without a GE.



"I agree in part with what they are campaigning for and its right someone should stand up to that heinous company southern along with this Government that no one elected that is protected by the Media."

 

[pearl]

Because the door business is a red herring which they are using along with the sham sickness allegations to try and win the media battle which unfortunately apart from a few idiots they've now lost. It's about staffing levels and breaking the unions to impose new working practices as Peter Wilkinson helpfully told everyone back in February

could do away with the doors altogether

 

[In The Rough]

How does a wheelchair bound person travel from Crowborough, Eridge, Ashurst, Edenbridge Town and I'm sure many other smaller stations across the network now?

They don't. No one does on that line. It is buggered pretty much constantly.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

the only view ive heard from fellow travellers is, in a nutshell, the service is shit, the unions making it shitter. last week i was cancelled for half an hour and delayed a couple of times by Southern's poor managment of the service. this week im cancelled 3 days in a row due to the unions poor decision to strike.

You must have been deaf and blind not to see the complaints about the Seaford line where just 15 trains a day ran instead of 75, which was nothing to do with the strike whatsoever but Southern's failure to provide a service for four months. It's been posted on here loads of times, been in the Argus, on the local tv news and radio.
That's just a small part of it.

 

[Arthur]

They don't. No one does on that line. It is buggered pretty much constantly.

Well you are right about the latter, sadly the not the former. I attempt to use it on a daily basis along with many others. Thankfully I have an understanding boss who is happy for me to work from home. Not everyone is so fortunate though.

But on the point I was making a lot of the stations on the Southern network aren't wheelchair friendly already so it's not really an excuse the union can trot out.

 

[beorhthelm]

You must have been deaf and blind not to see the complaints about the Seaford line where just 15 trains a day ran instead of 75, which was nothing to do with the strike whatsoever but Southern's failure to provide a service for four months. It's been posted on here loads of times, been in the Argus, on the local tv news and radio.
That's just a small part of it.

did you miss the " the service is shit" bit? is the Seaford service better on strike days, the passengers on the buses praising the unions for their stand prehaps? if you want to join with THPP and the RMT that the public is fully behind the strike action go ahead, i havent heard anyone outside this forum in favour of the action.

 

[Deadly Danson]

did you miss the " the service is shit" bit? is the Seaford service better on strike days, the passengers on the buses praising the unions for their stand prehaps? if you want to join with THPP and the RMT that the public is fully behind the strike action go ahead, i havent heard anyone outside this forum in favour of the action.

Then you REALLY haven't been listening.