So are Reading really a better project ?

[Acker79]

Sheeeesh, a bluff is an attempt to fool someone for your own advantage, and Bloom wouldn't have known if Gus was calling his bluff or not at the time, but that'what bluffing is all about.

But people are arguing about it now, in retrospect when they "know" it was a bluff. If you know now it is a bluff, you can't now criticise him for wanting to leave then.

 

[London Irish]

It appears Barber has got it wrong. I doubt if Blackpool or Burnley are going to spend much of the payments on players this season either.

We may not be top 6 but I doubt we'd be as low as 14th.

We're probably making harder work of this budget issue than we need to - no one can dispute that in finishing 4th (and 1st in the post-Xmas form table), Gus outperformed his budget and cemented his reputation as a fine manager. Yes of course the likes of BW and others of similar mentality will claim Gus was merely matching expectations but it's fairly clear these are people out to denigrate Gus in whatever way they can, as a smokescreen to justify the extremely messy and opaque way he was removed.

The relevance of this going forward is more interesting though, because all those arguing that we had a very healthy budget will now surely have to hold Oscar to the highest results standard - we'll see if they do or they invent all manner of excuses they wouldn't have granted Gus.

 

[symyjym]

maybe it would be nice to know why he was so unsettled
before we all start jumping the gun and making assumptions

Ask Gus then, not me.

In any case why don't you address my points regarding the knock on effect in the transfer window? You need to focus on the bigger picture, not one person.

Though I supsect your only agenda is to make;

The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
round and round
round and round
The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
All day long

Give it a jump start to keep it going
keep it going
keep it going
Give it a jump start to keep it going
All month long

Can't be bothered with the third verse, but it would have ended with "All season long"

 

[symyjym]

But people are arguing about it now, in retrospect when they "know" it was a bluff. If you know now it is a bluff, you can't now criticise him for wanting to leave then.

You don't even read my posts and avoided any mention of the fact that I said a bluff is an attempt to fool someone for your own advantage. Am I wrong with that statement?

 

[Acker79]

You don't even read my posts and avoided any mention of the fact that I said a bluff is an attempt to fool someone for your own advantage. Am I wrong with that statement?

Not reading posts? That really is a bit rich coming from you.

Yes. Your definition of 'bluff' is correct. It is also entirely irrelevant to the point I was making. As is the effect of an unsettled manager on a squad. As is the ability to make signings. As is whether or not keeping gus would cost us success etc. I have mostly stopped responding you in these discussion because your responses often have little to do with the post you are quoting.

I go back to the point I made before you brought up unsettled squads, and success v keeping gus, etc. because all of that has nothing to do with the point I am trying to make and will say just one last time:

You can't now, in retrospect, argue that when Gus called Tony and asked to leave that he didn't really want to leave, that it was just a bluff, AND now argue that Gus wanted to leave at a key point in the season. They are mutually exclusive they boil down to "gus didn't want to leave" and "gus wanted to leave" those two arguments cannot co-exist.

 

[symyjym]

Not reading posts? That really is a bit rich coming from you.

Yes. Your definition of 'bluff' is correct. It is also entirely irrelevant to the point I was making. As is the effect of an unsettled manager on a squad. As is the ability to make signings. As is whether or not keeping gus would cost us success etc. I have mostly stopped responding you in these discussion because your responses often have little to do with the post you are quoting.

I go back to the point I made before you brought up unsettled squads, and success v keeping gus, etc. because all of that has nothing to do with the point I am trying to make and will say just one last time:

You can't now, in retrospect, argue that when Gus called Tony and asked to leave that he didn't really want to leave, that it was just a bluff, AND now argue that Gus wanted to leave at a key point in the season. They are mutually exclusive they boil down to "gus didn't want to leave" and "gus wanted to leave" those two arguments cannot co-exist.

So the effect of an unsettled manager on the squad and the inability to make signings under these circumstances is irrelevant?

 

[Icy Gull]

The relevance of this going forward is more interesting though, because all those arguing that we had a very healthy budget will now surely have to hold Oscar to the highest results standard - we'll see if they do or they invent all manner of excuses they wouldn't have granted Gus.

It will cut both ways though and cause even more division on NSC. You know as well as I do that people on NSC don't tend to change their standpoint, however convincing the arguments against may be.

Will Oscar be given time by fans if we struggle for a month or two? I doubt it, and there will be the inevitable comparisons with Gus. If he does well and we are up near the top with some humble post match interviews then there will be the argument that we are well shot of Gus.

I'd suggest we will need to make a few decent signings before we know if Oscar will be working with the same financial muscle Gus was given last year though.

Interesting times and guaranteed binfests whichever way it goes

 

[Acker79]

So the effect of an unsettled manager on the squad and the inability to make signings under these circumstances is irrelevant?

To the point I was making, yes.

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

You can't now, in retrospect, argue that when Gus called Tony and asked to leave that he didn't really want to leave, that it was just a bluff, AND now argue that Gus wanted to leave at a key point in the season. They are mutually exclusive they boil down to "gus didn't want to leave" and "gus wanted to leave" those two arguments cannot co-exist.

well that sounds a bit like Schrondingers cat...

 

[symyjym]

So the effect of an unsettled manager on the squad and the inability to make signings under these circumstances is irrelevant?

To the point I was making, yes.

So the bigger picture isn't important?

 

[glasfryn]

Not reading posts? That really is a bit rich coming from you.

Yes. Your definition of 'bluff' is correct. It is also entirely irrelevant to the point I was making. As is the effect of an unsettled manager on a squad. As is the ability to make signings. As is whether or not keeping gus would cost us success etc. I have mostly stopped responding you in these discussion because your responses often have little to do with the post you are quoting.

I go back to the point I made before you brought up unsettled squads, and success v keeping gus, etc. because all of that has nothing to do with the point I am trying to make and will say just one last time:

You can't now, in retrospect, argue that when Gus called Tony and asked to leave that he didn't really want to leave, that it was just a bluff, AND now argue that Gus wanted to leave at a key point in the season. They are mutually exclusive they boil down to "gus didn't want to leave" and "gus wanted to leave" those two arguments cannot co-exist.

they can in symyjym's world

 

[symyjym]

Not reading posts? That really is a bit rich coming from you.

Yes. Your definition of 'bluff' is correct. It is also entirely irrelevant to the point I was making. As is the effect of an unsettled manager on a squad. As is the ability to make signings. As is whether or not keeping gus would cost us success etc. I have mostly stopped responding you in these discussion because your responses often have little to do with the post you are quoting.

I go back to the point I made before you brought up unsettled squads, and success v keeping gus, etc. because all of that has nothing to do with the point I am trying to make and will say just one last time:

You can't now, in retrospect, argue that when Gus called Tony and asked to leave that he didn't really want to leave, that it was just a bluff, AND now argue that Gus wanted to leave at a key point in the season. They are mutually exclusive they boil down to "gus didn't want to leave" and "gus wanted to leave" those two arguments cannot co-exist.

they can in symyjym's world

The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
round and round
round and round
The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
All day long

Give it a jump start to keep it going
keep it going
keep it going
Give it a jump start to keep it going
All month long

Can't be bothered with the third verse, but it would have ended with "All season long"

 

[glasfryn]

The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
round and round
round and round
The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
All day long

Give it a jump start to keep it going
keep it going
keep it going
Give it a jump start to keep it going
All month long

Can't be bothered with the third verse, but it would have ended with "All season long"

YOU HAVE ALREADY DONE THAT ONE
are you singing that to a mirror or something

 

[glasfryn]

Ask Gus then, not me.

In any case why don't you address my points regarding the knock on effect in the transfer window? You need to focus on the bigger picture, not one person.

Though I supsect your only agenda is to make;

The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
round and round
round and round
The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
All day long

Give it a jump start to keep it going
keep it going
keep it going
Give it a jump start to keep it going
All month long

Can't be bothered with the third verse, but it would have ended with "All season long"

see you have already done that one
and you mentioned him first are you and bw doing shifts

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

YOU HAVE ALREADY DONE THAT ONE
are you singing that to a mirror or something

oh no hes stuck on a shorter loop than usual.....

 

[Seagull73]

The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
round and round
round and round
The wheels on the Gus Bus go round and round
All day long

Give it a jump start to keep it going
keep it going
keep it going
Give it a jump start to keep it going
All month long

Can't be bothered with the third verse, but it would have ended with "All season long"

Very catchy. Well done.

 

[B.W.]

And I'd suggest you and symyjym get your story straight on that one

Eh!? We are totally separate individuals posting our often similar, sometimes different opinions.

 

[B.W.]

So why did Tony Bloom refuse to accept his resignation?

You would have to know on what erms Gus was willing to leave, including payout, timing, etc.

 

[B.W.]

Erm, Tony Bloom said Gus phoned him and told him he wanted to leave in the summer and wouldn't discuss it. Are you claiming Bloom was lying, or being a pedant about what exactly constitutes a resignation?

Just to add, Gus also said he wanted to leave immediately (in March), i.e. end of season was not Gus' preference (again demonstrating his self before club persona).

 

[B.W.]

I'm not sure you're understanding my point. All other criticisms aside, the idea of him constantly threatening to walk to get his own way is irrelevant to my point. What as right for tony/the club to do or what was wrong, what was right for gus to do or what was wrong for him is irrelevant.

This is about people's arguments on here.

Simply put no one can argue "he wanted to leave at a key point" and "he didn't really want to leave". If you say he wanted to leave at that point, you have to accept that was his attempted resignation. If you believe it was another bluff, you can't say he was trying to leave at a key point in our season. They cannot logically co-exist.

I agree with what you are saying, but the key points are (a) payout Gus wanted on leaving; (b) timing of his departure.