[Politics] Sir Keir Starmer’s route to Number 10

[nicko31]

Another move on the chess board

Michelle Mone should not be in Lords, Keir Starmer says

The Labour leader says the government has "serious questions" to answer about the scandal.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Weststander]

Starmer’s doing okay, I think/hope the manifesto will propose dealing with many injustices in the UK eg a lack of new homes, food and energy poverty, NHS waits.

He can’t affect the Middle East violence from all sides. I don’t blame him at all for not falling into the trap set by the hard left and some covert antisemites of being seen to side with Hamas. It obviously occupies the minds of biased news obsessives in this country, the sort of folk who never, ever campaign/lobby against genocidal Russia or China. Weird.

 

[nicko31]

Starmer’s doing okay, I think/hope the manifesto will propose dealing with many injustices in the UK eg a lack of new homes, food and energy poverty, NHS waits.

He can’t affect the Middle East violence from all sides. I don’t blame him at all for not falling into the trap set by the hard left and some covert antisemites of being seen to side with Hamas. It obviously occupies the minds of biased news obsessives in this country, the sort of folk who never, ever campaign/lobby against genocidal Russia or China. Weird.

With respect I think we hold Israel in higher regard than China or Russia and they consider themselves a democratic western nation

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Starmer’s doing okay, I think/hope the manifesto will propose dealing with many injustices in the UK eg a lack of new homes, food and energy poverty, NHS waits.

He can’t affect the Middle East violence from all sides. I don’t blame him at all for not falling into the trap set by the hard left and some covert antisemites of being seen to side with Hamas. It obviously occupies the minds of biased news obsessives in this country, the sort of folk who never, ever campaign/lobby against genocidal Russia or China. Weird.

Like my (now former) union. When I mentioned this, I was invited to submit a motion to boycott any country of my choosing. I pointed out we were a wanky university union that represents only about 15% of the workforce, and whose condemnation of nation states is about a relevant as Lois jeans. And put them on ignore.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

With respect I think we hold Israel in higher regard than China or Russia and they consider themselves a democratic western nation

Kind of proves my point. My union does not hold Israel in higher regard than China, Russia, Zimbabwe, Yemen or Iran.

Who is 'we', incidentally.

 

[Weststander]

With respect I think we hold Israel in higher regard than China or Russia and they consider themselves a democratic western nation

Certainly not NSC. Whenever I mentioned over the years the genocide and mass rape of the Uyghurs, I was generally ignored. Lots of the lefties here never posted on the Ukraine thread.

Then Israel acts and NSC comes alive, attacks from all and sundry. Then the Coogan-esque attacks on Starmer.

Definitely an obsession with one part of the world. Why aren’t all these people here, Coogan et al championing the cause of other facing systematic extinction and rape on an industrial scale? Something’s amiss.

 

[knocky1]

Certainly not NSC. Whenever I mentioned over the years the genocide and mass rape of the Uyghurs, I was generally ignored. Lots of the lefties here never posted on the Ukraine thread.

Then Israel acts and NSC comes alive, attacks from all and sundry. Then the Coogan-esque attacks on Starmer.

Definitely an obsession with one part of the world. Why aren’t all these people here, Coogan et al championing the cause of other facing systematic extinction and rape on an industrial scale? Something’s amiss.

Not sure much support for China's Fascism either. Apart from general purchases (Amazon, Primark, m&s, etc)which you obviously don't do.

I spent 2 years teaching in Riyadh. My holidays included driving to Syria, Jordan and the West Bank to visit other teachers families.
I have had no contact with the 4 Syrian teachers for 12 years. I assume most their large family is dead.
My supervisor was Palestinian. Working away to create opportunities for his family. Lovely supportive man. Imagine his family today in Gaza.

Starmer has missed a trick on not making a humanitarian statement before Sunak.

 

[Weststander]

Not sure much support for China's Fascism either. Apart from general purchases (Amazon, Primark, m&s, etc)which you obviously don't do.

I spent 2 years teaching in Riyadh. My holidays included driving to Syria, Jordan and the West Bank to visit other teachers families.
I have had no contact with the 4 Syrian teachers for 12 years. I assume most their large family is dead.
My supervisor was Palestinian. Working away to create opportunities for his family. Lovely supportive man. Imagine his family today in Gaza.

Starmer has missed a trick on not making a humanitarian statement before Sunak.

Correcting you on point one, old school lefties bizarrely side with Putin. Reasons …. anything to be anti NATO, anti the West/US, stuck in a mindset from the Cold War. Nicky Campbell faced calls from these people when it was trendy to be interested in Ukraine. They put their lifelong loathing of the West over Putin’s illegal war.

The Uyghurs, no interest in it on nsc, ever. Why?

What a silly point about goods. In a globalised world you’ve undoubtedly used products/services from Saudi, China.

You failed to answer the question on why the obsession with Israel, and not Putin or China. We’ve a Ukrainian refugee in our family, we know the history and gory details. Now a fatigue in the UK of only a few give a damn, whilst rape, torture and genocide occur on a daily basis. Instead 100% laser focus on Gaza.

 

[knocky1]

Correcting you on point one, old school lefties bizarrely side with Putin. Reasons …. anything to be anti NATO, anti the West/US, stuck in a mindset from the Cold War. Nicky Campbell faced calls from these people when it was trendy to be interested in Ukraine. They put their lifelong loathing of the West over Putin’s illegal war.

The Uyghurs, no interest in it on nsc, ever. Why?

What a silly point about goods. In a globalised world you’ve undoubtedly used products/services from Saudi, China.

You failed to answer the question on why the obsession with Israel, and not Putin or China. We’ve a Ukrainian refugee in our family, we know the history and gory details. Now a fatigue in the UK of only a few give a damn, whilst rape, torture and genocide occur on a daily basis. Instead 100% laser focus on Gaza.

I'll judge you by having no care for my dead work colleagues or their families.

I have had no contact with the 4 Syrian teachers for 12 years. I assume most their large family is dead.
My supervisor was Palestinian. Working away to create opportunities for his family. Lovely supportive man. Imagine his family today in Gaza.

You're a weirdo. What an an answer.

 

[Weststander]

You're a weirdo. What an an answer.

No interest in Ukrainians or Uyghurs, that is weird. A selective moral compass.

 

[aolstudios]

Correcting you on point one, old school lefties bizarrely side with Putin. Reasons …. anything to be anti NATO, anti the West/US, stuck in a mindset from the Cold War. Nicky Campbell faced calls from these people when it was trendy to be interested in Ukraine. They put their lifelong loathing of the West over Putin’s illegal war.

The Uyghurs, no interest in it on nsc, ever. Why?

What a silly point about goods. In a globalised world you’ve undoubtedly used products/services from Saudi, China.

You failed to answer the question on why the obsession with Israel, and not Putin or China. We’ve a Ukrainian refugee in our family, we know the history and gory details. Now a fatigue in the UK of only a few give a damn, whilst rape, torture and genocide occur on a daily basis. Instead 100% laser focus on Gaza.

Spot on.
Where are the massive threads on Iran? Assad, who's killed way more Palestinians than Israel, let alone his own people? Myanma? The treatment & lack of rights for Palestinians in Jordan, Egypt & other Arab states? As well as the disgusting violation of the Uyghur in China.
No Jews, no news, innit.
Seriously.
People need to have a long, hard look at themselves. Particular those so certain of their permanent place on the 'right side of history'

 

[knocky1]

Spot on.
Where are the massive threads on Iran? Assad, who's killed way more Palestinians than Israel, let alone his own people? Myanma? The treatment & lack of rights for Palestinians in Jordan, Egypt & other Arab states? As well as the disgusting violation of the Uyghur in China.
No Jews, no news, innit.
Seriously.
People need to have a long, hard look at themselves. Particular those so certain of their permanent place on the 'right side of history'

No Jews No news
to quote you. Lucky you're not left wing bizarrely.

 

[Bakero]

You failed to answer the question on why the obsession with Israel, and not Putin or China. We’ve a Ukrainian refugee in our family, we know the history and gory details. Now a fatigue in the UK of only a few give a damn, whilst rape, torture and genocide occur on a daily basis. Instead 100% laser focus on Gaza.

Because Israel is a close ally of the UK and ostensibly a westernised, democratic nation. Our government has been steadfast in their support of Israel's destruction of Gaza and killing of civilians. Only now that we're approaching 20,000 dead have there been murmurings of unease.

If the UK government was backing Putin's war or China's treatment of the Uyghurs, the NSC wokerati would probably be a bit more vocal about those issues.

 

[Weststander]

Because Israel is a close ally of the UK and ostensibly a westernised, democratic nation. Our government has been steadfast in their support of Israel's destruction of Gaza and killing of civilians. Only now that we're approaching 20,000 dead have there been murmurings of unease.

If the UK government was backing Putin's war or China's treatment of the Uyghurs, the NSC wokerati would probably be a bit more vocal about those issues.

The posts don’t constantly talk about Sunak/Starmer, or Hamas/Hezbollah/Iran for that matter. It’s tunnel vision for Israel. With token passing concern for the Kibbutz rapes and slayings. I’ve had real world conversations with others recently, folk have told me that the Jews had no history with the Middle East until 1945, another disputed that Jews started arriving back to their original homeland in the 19th century after pogroms in Eastern Europe. Antisemites and also the thick are cleansing thousands of years of history to suit their tidy solution of eliminating Jews from the Middle East.

 

[Bakero]

The posts don’t constantly talk about Sunak/Starmer, or Hamas/Hezbollah/Iran for that matter. It’s tunnel vision for Israel. With token passing concern for the Kibbutz rapes and slayings. I’ve had real world conversations with others recently, folk have told me that the Jews had no history with the Middle East until 1945, another disputed that Jews started arriving back to their original homeland in the 19th century after pogroms in Eastern Europe. Antisemites and also the thick are cleansing thousands of years of history to suit their tidy solution of eliminate Jews from the Middle East.

I hope you were able to put them right on the history.

As for the NSC posts, I've just had a look at the thread and the last page is all about Biden and Cameron, with multiple references to Hamas. I'm not sure tunnel vision is the right phrase. Obviously, the focus is on Israel now due to the death toll and devastation.

Anyway, let's not derail this thread. Happy to discuss further tomorrow on the Israel/Palestine thread.

 

[Pevenseagull]

Jesus wept

 

[Zeberdi]

Antisemites and also the thick are cleansing thousands of years of history to suit their tidy solution of eliminate Jews from the Middle East.

I think you would find that the majority of people speaking out against Israel’s indiscriminate killing of innocent civilians in Gaza are neither…at least those posting on the Hamas//Gaza/Israel thread.

The posts don’t constantly talk about Sunak/Starmer, or Hamas/Hezbollah/Iran for that matter. It’s tunnel vision for Israel

Actually it started off being about the attack by Hamas on Israel but as the events on the ground has changed, the MSM and the thread have been focused on Israel’s response to it and how the British government is responding.

Clearly you feel your agenda on the Ukraine thread isn’t the getting attention on NSC or in the media you feel it deserves and I am sorry you feel that way. That is the reality of how public interest works - it wears off if people don’t feel personally connected to a war and the conflict drags on with no sign of getting worse or better.

However, judging those supporting the end of innocent Palestinians being killed in the 1,000s as having ‘no moral compass’ or being ‘anti-Semitic’ or as ‘thick’ because they are not also posting on the Ukraine thread/supporting your cause to ‘ keep it on the table’, is an unfair whataboutery attack on those of us watching the news and sickened about what’s going on in Gaza or by the atrocities that were carried out by Hamas in October. There’s no argument against what Russia is doing is attempting genocide - at least hopefully amongst NSC members, once that is said, what is there to debate? Maybe that’s why some people don’t both to comment.

Where ever people are being eliminated on the grounds of ethnicity in the world however, we should speak out. But we especially should speak out, if it is being carried out by an ally of the UK and tacitly supported by the UK as we should speak out against any form of terrorism perpetrated against others. We also should speak out if the policies of our Government or its allies are likely to lead us into a wider conflict - which is very possibly where the situation in Gaza is leading us to.

Where are the massive threads on Iran? Assad, who's killed way more Palestinians than Israel, let alone his own people? Myanma?

Why not attack a massive thread about Ukraine too? Instead of a whataboutery complaint that threads are not covering topics that concern you, why not just start one that does?

People need to have a long, hard look at themselves. Particular those so certain of their permanent place on the 'right side of history'

That goes for anyone that openly or implicitly supports the mass slaughter of innocent people and desires to see them removed from their lands - whether it be Russians against Ukrainians, Jihadist terror groups against Israel or Israel against Palestinians - the only ‘right side of history’ imo is the side that abhors ‘man’s inhumanity to man’.

 

[aolstudios]

No Jews No news
to quote you. Lucky you're not left wing bizarrely.

As it happens I am. You don't have to be an Antisemite, that was just racist grandpa & his corduroy crew

 

[papachris]

Britain's Labour leader Keir Starmer visits Estonia, warns against 'going soft' on Putin

"Going soft" on Russian leader Vladimir Putin is to be avoided, given that Russia still poses a "direct threat" to the United Kingdom, the leader of that country's largest opposition party says, as reported by The Times.

news.err.ee

Sir Keir Starmer is over here visiting the troops at Tapa base today

 

[Chicken Run]

Britain's Labour leader Keir Starmer visits Estonia, warns against 'going soft' on Putin

"Going soft" on Russian leader Vladimir Putin is to be avoided, given that Russia still poses a "direct threat" to the United Kingdom, the leader of that country's largest opposition party says, as reported by The Times.

news.err.ee

Sir Keir Starmer is over here visiting the troops at Tapa base today

I bet the girls and boys can’t wait to meet him, if any of them have any questions they’ll have to be sure the question is on the pre approved list or else….