Show your respects...

[Gazwag]

Do YOU know who lives in the building four down the road from where you live? You see it every day.

Live near, work with, problem with most child abusers they are VERY VERY good at hiding their evil side, an example is an ex-member of a youth organisation this end of the county who for at least five years pulled the wool over many peoples eyes. He was caught and convicted of child abuse and sentenced for just three and a half years. He now owns a pig company in Pevensey.

 

[siclean]

we should bring these back...torture chambers...if they were good enough yrs gone by then why the hell are they not good enough now ??

 

[Insel affe]

I Once did a carpet fitting job in Wood Green Harringay and while me and my partner were fitting we noticed the two little boys were filthy and had several brusies on there bodies. Meantime the mother was not at the property, but the farther was and he was chatting to us and drinking cider at 11`oclock in the morning. I felt uneasey about the situation, and started to think something was not right. At the end of the job i was cutting in a new matwell near the front door, and i took out the old coir matting to be replaced. When i did i found a note someone had posted through the door maybe and slipped under the matwell it said "If we hear your children screaming again we will contact the social". Now on reading this and then looking at the kids i wanted to kick the feck outta the geezer,but my fitting partner talked me outta it as we would get nicked there and then. when i showed him the note (which i still have somewhere) and said that its best to contact social ourselves. Which i did straight after we left i phoned harringay council got through to a department and told a lady receptionist everything we had seen and that i had a note etc and the kids had brusies etc. The lady said someone would ring me back and discuss what we had seen etc..............................did they ring back.........Did they f***................HARRINGAY COUNCIL SOCIAL SERVICES.........IN MY EXPERIENCE ARE SHIT.

ps my partner saw the bloke outside wood green tube station about a month later at 11pm pissed and proceeded to kick the utter shit out of him.

 

[drew]

I Once did a carpet fitting job in Wood Green Harringay and while me and my partner were fitting we noticed the two little boys were filthy and had several brusies on there bodies. Meantime the mother was not at the property, but the farther was and he was chatting to us and drinking cider at 11`oclock in the morning. I felt uneasey about the situation, and started to think something was not right. At the end of the job i was cutting in a new matwell near the front door, and i took out the old coir matting to be replaced. When i did i found a note someone had posted through the door maybe and slipped under the matwell it said "If we hear your children screaming again we will contact the social". Now on reading this and then looking at the kids i wanted to kick the feck outta the geezer,but my fitting partner talked me outta it as we would get nicked there and then. when i showed him the note (which i still have somewhere) and said that its best to contact social ourselves. Which i did straight after we left i phoned harringay council got through to a department and told a lady receptionist everything we had seen and that i had a note etc and the kids had brusies etc. The lady said someone would ring me back and discuss what we had seen etc..............................did they ring back.........Did they f***................HARRINGAY COUNCIL SOCIAL SERVICES.........IN MY EXPERIENCE ARE SHIT.

ps my partner saw the bloke outside wood green tube station about a month later at 11pm pissed and proceeded to kick the utter shit out of him.

They f***ed up but then so did you because you didn't follow it up. So they didn't ring, did your conscience make you chase them up or did you think you had just done your bit with the first phone call. Maybe your mate, who no doubt had had a few, may have let slip during the beating that this was for the kids or something like that. What if the scum then went home and took it out on the kids! You did the right thing by ringing but you should have followed it up. If those kids died, you would have to live with that on your conscience. Not because you killed them but because you could have stopped it.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

By the very nature of the beast, those who treat children badly don't brag about it down the shops, nor do they tell social workers what's going on. They are devious, they cover up their actions by providing all sorts of explanations. You can't tell how many people are living at a house by turning up on the doorstep- there are plenty of explanations anyone could give for evidence of another person's presence.

The unpalatable fact is, an awful lot of people live in a manner and in conditions that you or I would find unpleasant, but that in itself doesn't mean they are legally unfit to be parents nor does it automatically trigger the removal of children. For social workers, it really is a fine line to tread, and a very difficult one too. Someone who lives like a total binner may well be a perfectly adequate parent, they just don't have the money to pay for niceties. Taking someone's child off them is an incredibly emotive thing at the best of times- we've all read stories where outraged individuals have gone screaming to the press because social workers have taken their kids into care because of a bruise or two, therefore every time they do it they're entering a minefield.

Clearly there were errors made in this case, with appalling consequences, but to equate the well-intended if mistaken actions of a social worker with the malicious abuse inflicted by three low-lifes is not fair in any way, shape or form.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

I honestly couldn't care less, I find it hard so pointless to seek the moral highground for cases such as this.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

I think everyone's already done the "hang them the bastards" thing on this, so maybe we should just let the poor kids involved rest now, wherever they are.

 

[Insel affe]

They f***ed up but then so did you because you didn't follow it up. So they didn't ring, did your conscience make you chase them up or did you think you had just done your bit with the first phone call. Maybe your mate, who no doubt had had a few, may have let slip during the beating that this was for the kids or something like that. What if the scum then went home and took it out on the kids! You did the right thing by ringing but you should have followed it up. If those kids died, you would have to live with that on your conscience. Not because you killed them but because you could have stopped it.

Excuse me..........I did follow it up several times,How dare you presume that i did not.Thats why i kept the note, and i still have it with the address etc and my job sheet even though it was in 1997. So please dont tell me that i did the right thing, but i should have followed it up...! Also dont in your reply suggest that i should have gone down there. After several phone calls leaving all my details there details etc etc and them not getting back to me. Maybe just maybe they had it in hand, maybe i was making something out of nothing..... I dont think so for one second that, that was the case, But thats my opinion and im not a social worker....

Another assumption you make is that the guy who beat him up outside the tube station was my mate, I did stress he was my partner who i worked with. Not through choice. However you are right that the bloke may well have gone back to his kids and dished out some treatment. But for you to suggest that
" If those kids died, you would have to live with that on your conscience. Not because you killed them but because you could have stopped it" .....How the f*** do you get that .....Was i there when he beat him up NO....did i want to yes......when it comes down to it would i have....NO, Because i know how these things work, im from a care home......YOU SIR EITHER APOLIGISE OR..............

 

[looney]

Absolutely 100% spot on.

Cant keep away from the issue of kids can you?

 

[drew]

Excuse me..........I did follow it up several times,How dare you presume that i did not.Thats why i kept the note, and i still have it with the address etc and my job sheet even though it was in 1997. So please dont tell me that i did the right thing, but i should have followed it up...! Also dont in your reply suggest that i should have gone down there. After several phone calls leaving all my details there details etc etc and them not getting back to me. Maybe just maybe they had it in hand, maybe i was making something out of nothing..... I dont think so for one second that, that was the case, But thats my opinion and im not a social worker....

Another assumption you make is that the guy who beat him up outside the tube station was my mate, I did stress he was my partner who i worked with. Not through choice. However you are right that the bloke may well have gone back to his kids and dished out some treatment. But for you to suggest that
" If those kids died, you would have to live with that on your conscience. Not because you killed them but because you could have stopped it" .....How the f*** do you get that .....Was i there when he beat him up NO....did i want to yes......when it comes down to it would i have....NO, Because i know how these things work, im from a care home......YOU SIR EITHER APOLIGISE OR..............

I apologise but perhaps next time you should make it clear that you made several phone calls as your post implies you made the one call and they never rang back. Also, I never suggested you go down there, not sure where you read that!

As for your partner, not sure where you stress he was just a partner and not a mate however apologies again.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

Hold on mate..think about that, I was listening to a discussion about the role played by social services, GP's, Police etc. in the Baby P case this morning and the representative from Social Services explained it like this;

Imagine you are reading a crime novel about a Murder which twists and turns and reveals the culprit on the very last line..now when you read the final line the plot all clicks into place and you close the book, having been kept guessing by the clever author, more enlightened than when you started to read.

Then imagine that straight after finishing the book you go back to the beginning and read it through again, now every word you read, every page you turn, leads you to the end of the story, but its tired and obvious where things are going because you know how it all turns out, the story seems tired and you tut at yourself for not having spotted who the killer was and how they did it the first time around...all the clues are right there! how stupid were you for not having seen it coming!

His point was that that is where the various professionals are now in regard to baby Peter. The public, who have read the facts in the paper or seen them on TV, cannot believe that something so obvious could have been missed. If it was them in charge this would never have happened because EVERYONE sees better through the retroscope.

If you think about it there are literally thousands of kids in London living in potentially hazardous family groups. OK so baby P was an extreme case but for Doctors, experienced Social Workers and other responsible parties to ALL miss the thing that now seems so obvious..well I suggest that these lowlifes were extremely adept at playing the game with overstretched and, sometimes, naive caregivers. Is that really a reason to flay the caseworkers and their Managers?

I accept that SOME of the individual performances, in relation to the monitoring of little Peters situation, was exremely poor but behind that there was a cunning sociopath and two willing accomplices going out of their way to hide the truth. Hand on Heart I cannot say that I would have performed any better in those circumstances and I was a senior Nurse in Accident and Emergency trained to look for signs of abuse when children presented as casualties.

The witch hunt is perfectly understandable given the utter hatefulness that Peter was forced to endure and the desire to punish anyone involved in any way, whether it be the vile bastards that hurt him physically, or the lazy roll-up smoking hippy Social Workers,or the foreign sounding so probably no good GP. In my experience Social Services do an outstanding and extremely difficult job in sometimes impossibly complicated decietful and mean side of life that,thank God, most of us cannot even imagine.

I have read a lot of the findings from the case and can see that some basic checks were done incorrectly or missed, I can sympathise with the finding that the Doctor who was the last to examine Peter missed, what must have been obvious, serious injuries and I have read her defence that she allowed herself to be less thorough than she should have been because of parenteral pressure and distraction tactics. She has been struck off because she did not honour her role in protecting Baby P. Any more than that I think is inappropriate.

The other dismissals among Social Services personell is also proportionate. None of those individuals wil ever work in Social Care again believe you me.

Lets just learn and learn well and move on.

Insightful post

 

[Insel affe]

I apologise but perhaps next time you should make it clear that you made several phone calls as your post implies you made the one call and they never rang back. Also, I never suggested you go down there, not sure where you read that!

As for your partner, not sure where you stress he was just a partner and not a mate however apologies again.

cheers