[Politics] Should Stamp Duty be scrapped altogether?

[Live by the sea]

More business savvy then.

 

[rogersix]

More business savvy then.

what would be most meritocratic?

 

[mikeyjh]

There are lots of hard working people who earn a good salary , I know plasters , plumbers etc that earn £3k a week but many are not business savvy , they spend their money on drink and enjoying themselves, rather than investing in shares / property and for their future .

People that are business savvy and grow their money should be allowed to leave it all to their children / family .

No you don't.

 

[Seagull27]

Family money should be kept in the family if that’s what the money earner wants. Not everyone is equal , hard working business savvy people should be allowed to pass their assets onto whoever they want .

You're looking at it from the point of view of the money earner, which I understand. But what about the recipient - what have they done to deserve the hand down, compared to someone else from a different family who has no inheritance? The difference between those two people's situations is purely an accident of birth.

You could make the same argument about income tax - the individual has worked hard and has been business savvy enough to earn more money than others. Why should they pay more tax? - but this situation is more accepted.

The problem with inheritance as it is, along with the housing situation as it is, means that increasingly in future, the only way most people will be able to get on the property ladder is through inheritance. That already applies to the majority of u30s I would guess.

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

People with a lot of money does not work harder than people without a lot of money so you can scrap the whole "hard working" thing.

It’s all relative. I part owned a company with 200 employees and I made sure that they were well paid according to merit and the vast majority considered me a friend as well as an employer. The stress I went through when we weren’t getting paid for works we’d carried out and already suffered the costs for was at times unbelievable, but I made sure that non of my employees suffered or lost their jobs I paid corporation tax, PAYE on my own salary and the tax when I sold my shares. I’ve paid £100’s of thousands in personal tax and never taken a penny from the state. I’ve already helped my kids get on the property ladder and will want to do the same for my grandkids. I don’t feel that I, or my estate, owe the taxman a further penny. Merry Christmas.

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

Tax the seller not the buyer. This way if people are simply moving home they are no worse off but it will tax the property speculator and those making a quick buck

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

It’s all relative. I part owned a company with 200 employees and I made sure that they were well paid according to merit and the vast majority considered me a friend as well as an employer. The stress I went through when we weren’t getting paid for works we’d carried out and already suffered the costs for was at times unbelievable, but I made sure that non of my employees suffered or lost their jobs I paid corporation tax, PAYE on my own salary and the tax when I sold my shares. I’ve paid £100’s of thousands in personal tax and never taken a penny from the state. I’ve already helped my kids get on the property ladder and will want to do the same for my grandkids. I don’t feel that I, or my estate, owe the taxman a further penny. Merry Christmas.

Not true. Unless you've never been to a doctor in your life, you weren't born in a hospital, you never used subsidized public transport, you aren't expecting a state pension when you retire etc..all these things come from taxes

 

[Mustafa II]

Tax the seller not the buyer. This way if people are simply moving home they are no worse off but it will tax the property speculator and those making a quick buck

As a result, making it even harder for young people to move up the ladder?

 

[wellquickwoody]

Scrap it, raise inheritance tax (one of the most truly progressive taxes going)

Just what is a ‘progressive tax’, other than a made up term?

 

[DJ NOBO]

the reason for no CGT on primary residence (it is paid on second homes) is it would be grossly unfair to take large cut of someones value when they need to move. its only when downsizing or moving to a cheaper area that people see a net profit from selling their inflated homes.

You can make a case for quite a few cases being grossly unfair - stamp duty and inheritance tax for two.
The non taxation of house price profits is curiously generous.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Inheritance Tax is unfair as it penalises hard working parents that wish to leave property to their children . The have every right to do so , why should children get penalised for having hard working and business savvy parents , they shouldn’t .

It always amazes me that the greatest proponents for raising inheritance tax are those with little or no prospect of inheritance. It is unfair as you say and also, why should the government take money from families - money that has already been taxed.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

No more unfair than punishing kids who don't have such parents

Not having money that is not yours is not the same as punishment. If it was, one may as well say that I am being punished for not being the son of Elon Musk.

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

Not true. Unless you've never been to a doctor in your life, you weren't born in a hospital, you never used subsidized public transport, you aren't expecting a state pension when you retire etc..all these things come from taxes

State pensions do not come from taxes, they come from separate NI contributions. You know exactly what I’m saying. I’ve never claimed anything other than that which is freely available to all citizens of this country, regardless of any contributions they’ve made.

 

[A1X]

Just what is a ‘progressive tax’, other than a made up term?

One which taxes those who can afford to be taxed more and is harder to avoid.

 

[Seagull27]

Not having money that is not yours is not the same as punishment. If it was, one may as well say that I am being punished for not being the son of Elon Musk.

That's exactly the point. At the point of his birth, Elon Musk's son did no more to deserve his inheritance than you or I - he was just lucky enough to be born into that family - so why shouldn't it be taxed to the benefit of more people?

 It's Elon Musks money and during his lifetime he should be able to spend it however he likes - including treating his son to whatever he likes - but at the point of death, I think it's completely reasonable that a considerable portion of that should go back to the public.

It is punishment because kids who do not have inheritance are already many steps behind those who have a decent inheritance. Rents taking up a huge portion of your income means you can't save for a deposit, etc. Inheritance causes that split to worsen each time that money gets handed down a generation

 

[Berty23]

It’s all relative. I part owned a company with 200 employees and I made sure that they were well paid according to merit and the vast majority considered me a friend as well as an employer. The stress I went through when we weren’t getting paid for works we’d carried out and already suffered the costs for was at times unbelievable, but I made sure that non of my employees suffered or lost their jobs I paid corporation tax, PAYE on my own salary and the tax when I sold my shares. I’ve paid £100’s of thousands in personal tax and never taken a penny from the state. I’ve already helped my kids get on the property ladder and will want to do the same for my grandkids. I don’t feel that I, or my estate, owe the taxman a further penny. Merry Christmas.

Did you benefit from the education the state provided for your 200 employees? What about the state having a health service to keep your workers healthy? What about the infrastructure put in place for your business to operate. We all benefit in lots of ways from state provision, even if we chose not to admit it.

It really isn’t as simple as some people make out.

Maybe the government should start to charge more to people who profit from anything related to state funding? It is very complicated.

The idea that someone earning minimum wage because they struggled to get an education because they were caring for a poorly parent for ten years of their childhood does not work as hard as a kid who gets out through independent school and dad gets them a good job in the city is nuts. Everyone has a different story and some people like to pretend they have not received a leg up in life which others have been hindered. It does not mean they have automatically worked harder.

For what it is worth. I come from a relatively middle class existence after my gran was very poor. She only had three grandkids and she gave us enough money each when she died to pay for a deposit on my house in 2004. Without that I would probably still be struggling to get on the property ladder. My dad got lucky with a property after divorcing mum and when he dies we will pay inheritance tax. I don’t have a problem with that one bit. He was not business savvy, he just got lucky. If people keep being able to pass on all the money then property ownership will remain a dream for many as more people buy up other properties and make easy money while someone else pays their mortgage.

 

[Husty]

Replace it with an annual property tax based on value of property, double rate for second homes.

Is the correct answer

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

Did you benefit from the education the state provided for your 200 employees? What about the state having a health service to keep your workers healthy? What about the infrastructure put in place for your business to operate. We all benefit in lots of ways from state provision, even if we chose not to admit it.

It really isn’t as simple as some people make out.

Maybe the government should start to charge more to people who profit from anything related to state funding? It is very complicated.

The idea that someone earning minimum wage because they struggled to get an education because they were caring for a poorly parent for ten years of their childhood does not work as hard as a kid who gets out through independent school and dad gets them a good job in the city is nuts. Everyone has a different story and some people like to pretend they have not received a leg up in life which others have been hindered. It does not mean they have automatically worked harder.

For what it is worth. I come from a relatively middle class existence after my gran was very poor. She only had three grandkids and she gave us enough money each when she died to pay for a deposit on my house in 2004. Without that I would probably still be struggling to get on the property ladder. My dad got lucky with a property after divorcing mum and when he dies we will pay inheritance tax. I don’t have a problem with that one bit. He was not business savvy, he just got lucky. If people keep being able to pass on all the money then property ownership will remain a dream for many as more people buy up other properties and make easy money while someone else pays their mortgage.

Their parents would’ve paid for their education through the taxes THEY paid. The company paid for training for all employees to a minimum NVQ 2. The employees, themselves, paid tax to fund the NHS. The infrastructure of the business was funded by myself and my co-owners through loans that had to be paid back.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Is the correct answer

No it's not. An annual tax on the value of a property takes no account of the abillity to pay. It would hit those that have retired forcing them to downsize ( assuming they can ). Why should they be forced to sell the family home they have owned for decades to be able to afford a property tax ? Stamp duty has it's issues but people at least can decide to not pay it by not moving. The best change to it would be to scrap it for first time buyers - up to say £500k.

As for IHT - a tax of envy is what it is. I work hard not just for myself but to provide for my family. I want to provide for them not just in my lifetime but also after it.

 

[Berty23]

Their parents would’ve paid for their education through the taxes THEY paid. The company paid for training for all employees to a minimum NVQ 2. The employees, themselves, paid tax to fund the NHS. The infrastructure of the business was funded by myself and my co-owners through loans that had to be paid back.

I will take that as a yes then. Trying to argue we all cover these different elements individually is a fantastic effort though. Well played.

What exactly was your business, if you don’t mind me asking. I am just curious how you funded the entire infrastructure. I have a friend who has a haulage firm and he used to argue he funded the infrastructure for his business when he was talking about vehicles and storage mostly. He overlooked the roads.