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Shirley this cannot be right !
- Thread starter ditchy
- Start date
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
#fakenews
ROSM
Well-known member
I believe they were offered at 26% pay rise to take over control of safety on the train from tge now defunct guard (and also to allow trains to run without an on board supervisor) which for those on the highest pay levels would take them to jusg under 75k
Now all joking aside. For people to turn down that much money must mean they are really worried about safety and the implications on them
Now all joking aside. For people to turn down that much money must mean they are really worried about safety and the implications on them
Papa Lazarou
Living in a De Zerbi wonderland
Is this the RMT or Aslef drivers?
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
All paid the same, the 75k is made up if they do a load of overtime, which of course nobody wants to do
Exactly that - no amount of money will make me agree to a less safe method of working. Now, more than ever, perhaps it's the time to listen to the people who know a bit about what they are talking about rather than MPs/Dft etc with vested interests or anti-union keyboard warriors on here. At some point there will be a major incident as a direct result of DOO - it may not be this year or next but it will happen. I suspect we will ultimately lose the battle (especially now that somehow GTR are trying to tie a pay deal and DOO together) but when the inevitable happens, fingers crossed it's not someone you know who's involved and fingers crossed it's not me driving.
Oh and the deal is £60K by October 2019 (which financially is great) but it could be 100K and I still wouldn't agree if it means safety (and service) is compromised.
Sussex Nomad
Well-known member
What I don't get is, the London Underground runs fine without guards as does the Light Railway. I really have no idea about rail systems around Europe or the world and whether they run OMO/DOO systems? If they do, why can't we drag ourselves into the 21st century? It all confuses me a bit.
mxs_harrow
New member
There is enough money in the franchise to pay a conductor ( or two), especially when taking into account the stratospheric cost of rail travel in this country.
Was in Italy last year and caught a local train out of Bologna into the mountains. It cost just over 5 euros, it was a slow stopping train and was doing no more than 40-60 km/hour, but it still had a conductor to carry out tasks familiar to non-millenials, like checking tickets, stepping off and checking the platforms at stops and generally taking care and paying attention to the passengers, i.e. the fare-paying customers..
After the Paddington rail disaster, I remember a colleague working in the engineering industry in health and safety saying to me that no safety decisions should be left in the hands of a single responsible person without fail-safe backup in place.
We worked in a consultancy that had done a lot of business off the back of regime-changing disasters such as Piper Alpha and Kings Cross..
With all the back up and safety systems in the world, you still need conductors/guards/whatever on the train and it has got to be cheaper than the last 12 months plus of business/lifestyle damaging chaos.
It's a pity that the interested parties aren't locked in together at ACAS ( or wherever) and a binding decision has to be made/imposed within 48 hours by the arbitration body, after which no strikes or work to rule can occur from the union side, or from the employer's perspective, the franchise can be immediately withdrawn for non-compliance.
This is still a democracy, it's about time people started being more even-handed and started pulling in the same direction
Was in Italy last year and caught a local train out of Bologna into the mountains. It cost just over 5 euros, it was a slow stopping train and was doing no more than 40-60 km/hour, but it still had a conductor to carry out tasks familiar to non-millenials, like checking tickets, stepping off and checking the platforms at stops and generally taking care and paying attention to the passengers, i.e. the fare-paying customers..
After the Paddington rail disaster, I remember a colleague working in the engineering industry in health and safety saying to me that no safety decisions should be left in the hands of a single responsible person without fail-safe backup in place.
We worked in a consultancy that had done a lot of business off the back of regime-changing disasters such as Piper Alpha and Kings Cross..
With all the back up and safety systems in the world, you still need conductors/guards/whatever on the train and it has got to be cheaper than the last 12 months plus of business/lifestyle damaging chaos.
It's a pity that the interested parties aren't locked in together at ACAS ( or wherever) and a binding decision has to be made/imposed within 48 hours by the arbitration body, after which no strikes or work to rule can occur from the union side, or from the employer's perspective, the franchise can be immediately withdrawn for non-compliance.
This is still a democracy, it's about time people started being more even-handed and started pulling in the same direction
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
If SASTA/DfT released the Gibb report then it might educate people, that they won't presumably means they don't like the findings
franks brother
Well-known member
How many hours can a train driver drive? being a lorry driver I can only drive no more than: 9 hours in a day - this can be extended to 10 hours twice a week. 56 hours in a week. 90 hours in any 2 consecutive weeks
mxs_harrow
New member
Not for want of trying by somebody....
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/chris_gibbs_southern_rail_resili#incoming-965724
murciagull
Well-known member
Sorry I have to disagree here when I worked for British Rail nearly everyone wanted to work overtime!
You'd have thought the Government would think twice about cutting safety standards in the current climate
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
British Rail hasn't existed for over 20 years and people don't need to work overtime now and why should they ?
FatSuperman
Well-known member
- Feb 25, 2016
- 2,922
Well technically you cannot fail a psychometric test. I guess you just don't have the type of personality they are after. Nothing to worry about. Probably
The Large One
Who's Next?
They don't consider this to be a safety issue.
The Large One
Who's Next?
Meanwhile...
The judicial review into the government's handling of the Southern contract (among other issues) has been rejected by a single judge, as the application 'lacked interest'. No consideration was given to the merits of the application, merely that it was done by a single group (albeit financially backed by over 1,300 individuals).
The appeal is to be heard in open court at the Royal Courts of Justice on 29 June.
The judicial review into the government's handling of the Southern contract (among other issues) has been rejected by a single judge, as the application 'lacked interest'. No consideration was given to the merits of the application, merely that it was done by a single group (albeit financially backed by over 1,300 individuals).
The appeal is to be heard in open court at the Royal Courts of Justice on 29 June.
So you said on another thread. Bearing in mind we still drive 40 year old trains, we have tunnels that continually pour in water with bits falling off, a Victorian infrastructure and there are still semaphore signals down here I think you are probably at least 20-30 years out but you do seem very keen to replace us. I hope these computers will be able to spot someone about to jump off a bridge, calling for help if they are stuck between platform and train, trees falling down, debris on opposite tracks or advise passengers in an emergency miles from the nearest station etc etc
Norman Potting
Well-known member
London Underground - all stations manned with platform staff all the time trains are running I believe. Southern in my neck of the woods generally has a bod in the ticket office early shift Mon - Sat and that's it.
DLR. Designed from the ground up to be automated - all trains running at same speed and stopping all stations, believe most junctions of "flyover" type to minimise conflicting movements issues.
Southern network. Designed generally piecemeal over the past 160 years or so. Trains on lots of different routes, not all stopping at the same stations and the busiest bit drops from 4 to 2 tracks around halfway between London and Brighton - yes I know it loses some of the trains off down the Arun Valley line and off to Lewes and Eastbourne. but still busy. Should have built the Ouse Valley Line all those years ago and kept open at the very least Uckfield - Lewes.