Sh*t or bust for Poyet

[Return of the Rev]

1) you shouldn't be able to get away with letting your best player go to your rivals on a free and taking 18 months to replace him. He has. However, you can't get away with signing a player, not giving him much of a chance, then dropping him just as he comes into a bit of form and never playing him again, only for him to bang them in on loan to your arch rivals and fire them to promotion alongside the top scorer in the division that you let go. If dobbie is a roaring success at palace, it will be an absolute embarrassment from a brighton & hove albion perspective, absolutely no two ways about it. Let's hope he doesn't.

2) there are no excuses for not getting a team containing:

Kuszczak (premier/champions league/international experience)
bruno (la liga/uefa cup experience)
bridge (premier/champions league/internatinoal experience)
vicente (la liga/champions league/international experience)
lopez (la liga/uefa cup experience)
orlandi (premier league experience)
upson (premier league/international experience)
crofts (premier league, won promotion from championship)
hammond (won promotion from championship)
buckley (one of the most highly rated wingers in the championship)
ulloa and cms (£5m strikeforce)
bridcutt (one of the most highly rated players in the championship)
lualua (one of the most exciting players in the championship)
and ashley barnes into the play-offs.

No excuses whatsoever. We're underachieving as it is. Fail to make the play-offs and he can do one. Why do you think we're losing £8m a year? He's spent a small fortune on the squad, but at the moment we're being shown up by the likes of watford, millwall, burnley and p*lace. Yeah, so wolves and blackburn have spent loads and failed - that doesn't mean it won't be total a disgrace if we don't finish in the top 6.

Last chance saloon. Shit or bust.

With any luck we'll end the season with a trip to wembley and a winners medal. Although i don't hold out much hope.

a fair assessment

 

[Stat Brother]

I think to finish outside the top six would probably be construed as failure, but top 6 is not the same as promotion. My suspicion is that we'll finish 6th but actually only go up next season if we can keep the nucleus of the squad together.

I don't think we are ready for promotion.
But we are certainly good enough for top 6, because there isn't 6 teams better than us.

I think we NEED the experience of play-off football this year, to assist us and raise our profile still further ready for next year.

 

[The Merry Prankster]

I agree that this side is underachieving. Still time.

 

[Titus]

Hindsight is always 20/20. Has the OP never made a poor decision?

 

[Superphil]

Ulloa and CMS (£5m strikeforce)

Whilst I normally have you on ignore, when I saw the quoted posts I realised you made some quite valid points, however, this one in particular is a bit wide of the mark, IMO. £5M is nowhere near as much as teams normally spend on strikers to get them into the EPL. We've spent very little, over nearly 2 years, on this 'strikeforce' compared to what recent promotees to the top flight have done to get there. Our chariman, and chief executive are planning for the future with our club, trying to ensude we meet the requirements of FFP, and trying to ensure we don't end up like Portsmouth/Palace/Leeds/Wolves and other clubs who have overspent, got there, and then failed abysmally. £5M on 2 players, or £2.5 each (not actually that much), in the scheme of things, it's not a lot really, and not what we should be resting our playoff hopes on.

However, on the other hand, the skillfully/carefully assembled squad, the quality in depth we are developing (by getting shot of those who don't contribute like Dobbie) are what we should be looking to, and make for exciting times for the majority of us fans. I'll be disappointed if we don't make the playoffs, but I don't think we have a nailed on 'right' to be there.

 

[Return of the Rev]

hindsight is always 20/20. Has the op never made a poor decision?

i'm sure he has,and probably got punished for it

 

[Lawson]

Did he just say we let our best players leave on a free? he was never our best player at the time that would have to definitely fall to Elliott Bennett. Secondly he had a good season in league 1 and was overated anyway and everyone seems to forget he had a rubbish first season.. He has had a good season in the first half but if you watch his goals they are mainly form 3/4 yards with an open goal because his team do all the work. He is not a great striker who's loss we should mourn, his loyalty was weak and you do not want players who are not committed to the team. Also Dobbie doesn't seem to fit with our team so we have loaned him out to free up some wages which is a good move although questionable because its gone to rivals and a manager who likes his style of football. There is no reason of keeping a player who isn't performing or playing purely because you don't want him elsewhere, it is the same reason we let Noone go his performances just simply were not good enough and the money offered was a fair amount.
Also your way of judging the team by experience, value and how people rate them as top players does not automatically mean we should get promotion, if that was true AC Milan would have always won the serie a title with their 35 year old squad. We have a great team and hopefully it will bring success however other factors play a part including experience of playing together, the years in the league that can give you a killer edge displayed by teams such as derby, and the fact we play good football so teams line up cynically against us frequently.
As far as 8 million pounds loss nonsense you spout just look at every club, they all make a loss! Leeds have an 18 million loss?
so to sum up this is a post mainly spoken from his arse with little comprehension of how football works, best of luck to Gus and im sure he will get us where we want to be.

 

[daveyboy1973]

I agree with a lot of the op! On paper that looks a premiership team

 

[Return of the Rev]

did he just say we let our best players leave on a free? He was never our best player at the time that would have to definitely fall to elliott bennett. Secondly he had a good season in league 1 and was overated anyway and everyone seems to forget he had a rubbish first season.. He has had a good season in the first half but if you watch his goals they are mainly form 3/4 yards with an open goal because his team do all the work. He is not a great striker who's loss we should mourn, his loyalty was weak and you do not want players who are not committed to the team. Also dobbie doesn't seem to fit with our team so we have loaned him out to free up some wages which is a good move although questionable because its gone to rivals and a manager who likes his style of football. There is no reason of keeping a player who isn't performing or playing purely because you don't want him elsewhere, it is the same reason we let noone go his performances just simply were not good enough and the money offered was a fair amount.
Also your way of judging the team by experience, value and how people rate them as top players does not automatically mean we should get promotion, if that was true ac milan would have always won the serie a title with their 35 year old squad. We have a great team and hopefully it will bring success however other factors play a part including experience of playing together, the years in the league that can give you a killer edge displayed by teams such as derby, and the fact we play good football so teams line up cynically against us frequently.
As far as 8 million pounds loss nonsense you spout just look at every club, they all make a loss! Leeds have an 18 million loss?
So to sum up this is a post mainly spoken from his arse with little comprehension of how football works, best of luck to gus and im sure he will get us where we want to be.

Leeds are losing money so don't worry about our 8 million loss!

 

[glasfryn]

I opened this thread by mistake the O/P is on my ignore list and having read his op on others posts I know why he is on my ignore list.

Gus has a 5(five)year plan and up to now I am very pleased with the way its going.

 

[The Large One]

Point 1 is so full of holes, you could drive a bus through it. It's also quite hypocritical, because he has chastised Gus for keeping players who clearly aren't up to the mark. There are greater issues than Dobbie's talent at play here, but WW's analysis conveniently skirts around that.

Point 2, - so the things he is 'praising' (loosest term possible) Gus for are the things he'd want him fired for? Not only is he a very impatient young man, feeling promotion is ours by right, I think he's also very confused.

Thankfully, the Board of Directors doesn't have the same immature approach to Gus' future that he does.

 

[Lawson]

Leeds are losing money so don't worry about our 8 million loss!

no every club are losing money so it is not an issue related to Poyet it is just how football teams work, particularly in the championship for an up and coming team who have come from the wilderness in the last two seasons and suddenly aiming for promotion to the premiership. You can read it anywhere, aiming for promotion to the premiership is never profitable until you get there and even then can take a loss to stay there.

 

[yxee]

This argument doesn't make sense, the fact that we have these players is credit to Poyet in bringing them here. You can't blame him because an amazing team is, in your opinion, slightly underachieving, when it was Poyet that built the team himself!

 

[Billy the Fish]

Gus will get it right eventually, that's why we need to stick with him.

 

[Return of the Rev]

no every club are losing money so it is not an issue related to Poyet it is just how football teams work, particularly in the championship for an up and coming team who have come from the wilderness in the last two seasons and suddenly aiming for promotion to the premiership. You can read it anywhere, aiming for promotion to the premiership is never profitable until you get there and even then can take a loss to stay there.

AT WHAT POINT WILL THE LOSS BE A PROBLEM?

 

[Lethargic]

Why is it the last chance saloon, we have brought the striker we were all aware we have been missing for 2 years this is nothing new and we have loaned in a good centre back as we have1 currently availalble, yes the Dobbie to Palace is a bit annoying (why them as challengers and knobs) but if he plays well then we keep him and he could become an asset or we sell him.
This puts us in with a good chance of the play offs brilliant.

you sir are a complete bellend and I am guessing only here to try and provoke a response!

 

[Albumen]

Not getting into the play off would be seen as a failure but even getting 7th would be an improvement. The team is stronger than last year and Ulloa hasn't played in the league yet. Barnes and Ulloa could be a rather special partnership so I look forward to your thread of praise when we do make the play offs.
That said, if we make the play offs and don't win promotion, that's not a failure. There's no free ticket to promotion no matter how much you spend.
As for Upson, he's 33. Don't expect flippin miracles. I'd be suprised if we see him play more than Dobbie (which I'm not even going to go into - some transfers work, some don't - any fan should know that).

 

[Triggaaar]

Slap

 

[Hotchilidog]

Anothering witheringly tedious bit of analysis from NSC's favourite misanthrope for whom the word's patience and perspective may as well not exist.

Quality sides take to time build, just because you have the players does not mean you have a team, that does indeed take time to produce. You only have to look at the time needed by the likes of Orlandi and Lopez to fit into the team, after at first appearing to be lightweight, to see things do not happen overnight. The OP bemoans the fact that people don't debate him about football when he clearly shows no evidence of understanding the game himself. If managing a football club is so bloody simple I'm surprised he isn't running one himself.

I really pity WW as he seems utterly incapable of enjoying anything at the Albion. It's great being an Albion fan at the moment, and if we do not get promoted this season it will not be the end of the world FACT! We are finally in a position to start assembling a decent squad and we are a million miles away from being the L1 strugglers of a couple of years ago.

The championship is a very tough league to get out of, anyone who expects their team to stroll right out of it is deluded.

 

[Chesney Christ]

And who signed all these brilliant players who should get us promoted (despite spending less than most teams in this division)?

You've wrecked your own argument, pal.