Scotland and Independence. Again !!

[The Merry Prankster]

Hope they do so I can get a Scottish passport.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I 'feel' (based on nothing) that people who are unhappy with their lot, for whatever reason would be more likely to vote leave, due to the grass being greener. I understand this and don't blame people for that approach!

With regards to the imbalance though, is that not true of all nations? The majority of well off people are centred around a small number of large cities? Ironically, the majority of poor people are in the same areas.

The imbalance, as you say, has always existed.

Here's a handy but somewhat simplistic pie chart that illustrates the point in the decade from 1999 to 2009. It's the long term trend.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I know you aren't targetting me with the post, but for reference I voted remain. I too try and weigh up everything I can, but in situations where we absolutely don't know what's going to happen, I make the best decision I can and make my move - in this case, based on the info, I voted remain.

However, try and play devil's advocate. What if you don't have good work prospects? What if you have no pension? What if you don't have a mortgage because house price inflation has priced you (and nearly every other person out of the market)? Near enough everything successive governments have done on this topic over the past 20 years has been aimed at increasing house prices (homeowners vote more than non-homeowners.

There are a lot of very dissatisfied people out there. I'm not personally one of them, but I sympathise with them. I think they are misguided if they chose Brexit because they weren't happy with their lot, but I absolutely understand.

It doesn't matter why any more, it matters what happens next and that we make the absolute best attempt that can be made. I have faith that the Brexit team will try their best, I'm just worried their best will fall short of where we need to be to improve upon where we are today.

My counter to that is UK unemployment is VERY low, UK tax rates are comparatively low to the extent that they encourage inward investment, the introduction of mandatory Auto-Enrolment means employers and employees MUST now make pension contributions, the government HAS taken steps tax-wise that will severely discourage buy to let investors by withdrawing higher rate tax relief of mortgage interest and hugely increasing stamp duty specifically on buy to let landlords.

The conditions to succeed in this country were (before Brexit) so good that unskilled / semi-skilled workers from all over the world with no contacts and poor English language skills could readily make a successful career here.

 

[coagulantwolf]

Why (before the Brexit vote as well), do the SNP think leaving the UK is good, but staying in the EU is good? They're conflicting arguments surely.

 

[FatSuperman]

My counter to that is UK unemployment is VERY low, UK tax rates are comparatively low to the extent that they encourage inward investment, the introduction of mandatory Auto-Enrolment means employers and employees MUST now make pension contributions, the government HAS taken steps tax-wise that will severely discourage buy to let investors by withdrawing higher rate tax relief of mortgage interest and hugely increasing stamp duty specifically on buy to let landlords.

The conditions to succeed in this country were (before Brexit) so good that unskilled / semi-skilled workers from all over the world with no contacts and poor English language skills could readily make a successful career here.

Whilst that is all true (although the comment about unskilled careers might be a bit of a reach), it doesn't change that a lot of people, whilst employed may still be very unsatisfied. Having being opted in to a likely crap pension won't have helped them cheer up.

Buy to let investors are only a small part of the problem, the legislation won't affect professional landlords, but will make things less lucrative for private landlords yep. The real issue, which I'm sure you know, is that we do not build anywhere near enough houses. Demand outstrips supply hugely, so in general, prices will always rise in that situation.

Brexit apparently will hammer house prices. But supply is dropping (house builders building less, due to Brexit fears perhaps), and the Bank are highly unlikely to raise interest by anything other than a modest amount, so the problem will still exist. We must build more houses, it's bloody simple.

 

[ack]

Cant think of a woman I detest more. If they want to then let them. She will die by either losing or not getting her way and funding via europe. Case closed either way

 

[ManOfSussex]

We must build more houses, it's bloody simple.

With the preoccupation Brexit will have on Westminster for the next x years, I don't see that fundamental problem for this country being addressed properly any time soon.

 

[cunning fergus]

How is political grandstanding? The SNP are a nationalist party who stand on an independent Scotland ticket and now the English (and Welsh) have illustrated their concerns perfectly. You're calling it grandstanding simply because you're a Brexiter, and as such, all this nonsense about nationalist lies during referendum campaigning is a bit rich. £350m to the NHS anyone? FFS...

If the Scottish electorate were voting SNP for the cause of independence then Scotland would already be independent.

They are not though, a significant proportion are voting SNP because they won't vote Labour all the while it is stacked with capitalist shills.

This sizeable constituency will be among the majority of Scots who were not sold on independence when oil prices were high, revenues were exaggerated by the SNP and the proposition was to retain sterling.

The prospect of Sturgeon, for all her political talents, arguing for independence this time around when Scottish oil revenue is low and they will join the euro is even more remote.

And before anyone mentions rising oil prices, they should remember that getting oil from the North Sea is expensive, much more expensive than (say) Iran.

Scottish oil production was and is doomed not just because of recent falling prices, it's doomed because Iran is back out of sanctions and this means the Saudis are over producing oil so that the Iranians don't get too rich. The scots would still be f@cked on this basis.

If you had any sense you would know this............i always find logical insight is better than reactionary wetpanttery.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Why (before the Brexit vote as well), do the SNP think leaving the UK is good, but staying in the EU is good? They're conflicting arguments surely.

I had a go at answering this in post 31 but I have to say I am good at being forgettable.

 

[alfredmizen]

I actually don't want BREXIT triggered as soon as possible. I want a team of capable people ready with a plan they can put into action right away. There is a hell of a lot of work to be done and it cannot be done ad hoc, it must be properly planned. Most of us working in large companies know what happens when large projects or programme are run poorly - it doesn't matter how good the idea is if you **** up the execution.

This must not be rushed. The pain we are going through at the moment is temporary, we must suffer it. If BREXIT is rushed the pain will be baked in for much longer.

This all day long.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

There's not really any comparison between the degrees of control operated within the EU and the UK is there? Countries within the UK don't have their own armies and heads of state, their tax-raising powers are limited, they can't simply decide to leave the union and they certainly can't declare war on anyone else. Countries within the EU can do all those things.

I had a go at answering this in post 31 but I have to say I am good at being forgettable.

So the idea for Scottish independence is so that they can raise taxes and go to war with whoever they like?

 

[alfredmizen]

My counter to that is UK unemployment is VERY low, UK tax rates are comparatively low to the extent that they encourage inward investment, the introduction of mandatory Auto-Enrolment means employers and employees MUST now make pension contributions, the government HAS taken steps tax-wise that will severely discourage buy to let investors by withdrawing higher rate tax relief of mortgage interest and hugely increasing stamp duty specifically on buy to let landlords.

The conditions to succeed in this country were (before Brexit) so good that unskilled / semi-skilled workers from all over the world with no contacts and poor English language skills could readily make a successful career here.

And together with their 5 kids and a wife that stays at home (social housing that they've jumped the queue for due to their kids) they are a drain on the economy
Due to their unskilled job paying minimum wage .

PS since when has car washing in sainsbury been a "career" ?

 

[NooBHA]

as i see it May doesnt want Brexit to be the only issue, its one of many that need attention, too early to say if shes dithering on direction. there's 2.5 ministries involved (Foreign Office does have other things on it plate), so leave it to them. Sturgeon leads a party with independence at its heart, i wouldnt quite call it a single issue party but it dominates. so while she's fighting for that, what is she letting slip by? as i understand there are number of problems with health, education and policing, the standard SNP tactic is to blame all ills on Westminster, taking credit for anything positive. they have failed to make use of their tax raising powers to adjust fiscal policy, instead have their hand out every time investment is made in England to ensure they get some equivalent under Barnett.

It is difficult to make use of their ta raising powers for 3 major reasons

1. Large companies with employees in Scotland and the rest of the UK would be paying different rates of tax and they don't have the powers to change tax deadline dates or rates nationally.

2. They don't have the power to agree DTAs with other countries around the world.

3. Tax Collection offices around the UK are too closely linked with the rest of he UKs computer systems

 

[jakarta]

But wait a while ... and watch what happens to the price of oil.

As I have posted elsewhere other than at an oil price of $100+ dollars a barrel the North Sea is in terminal decline.

This isn't going to happen with foreseeable Iranian & Saudi production levels, not to mention the amount of Fracked Hydrocarbons now being produced in the USA (and ironically being shipped over the Atlantic to be used at INEOS Grangemouth - that should tell you something about the economics)

I'm personally quite happy for the Scots to go, most of them clearly don't like us too much.

 

[FatSuperman]

With the preoccupation Brexit will have on Westminster for the next x years, I don't see that fundamental problem for this country being addressed properly any time soon.

True, although I don't think the reason matters. They've not dealt with it for decades, in fact most of what they do causes more problems. Help to buy is not a good thing, yes it helps give some people a leg up onto the first rung, but it's yet another thing increasing prices. Without that help, many couldn't have bought, therefore demand would be lower.

Of course, stagnating or reducing house prices would cause utter chaos amongst a very vocal group of voters.

 

[Sussexscots]

I actually don't want BREXIT triggered as soon as possible. I want a team of capable people ready with a plan they can put into action right away. There is a hell of a lot of work to be done and it cannot be done ad hoc, it must be properly planned. Most of us working in large companies know what happens when large projects or programme are run poorly - it doesn't matter how good the idea is if you **** up the execution.

This must not be rushed. The pain we are going through at the moment is temporary, we must suffer it. If BREXIT is rushed the pain will be baked in for much longer.

Absolutely this.

Time for clear heads and a well planned and executed strategy, not reactive decisions based on whichever empty vessel - and there are plenty - is making the most noise

 

[Two Professors]

My father was Scottish but I would like a vote to get rid of the scrounging,whinging,utterly useless SNP supporters.Perhaps we could do an exchange deal for the decent Scots,of which there are many,for all our whining Urophiles.Would even be happy for a tax subsidy to be paid to compensate for the waste-of-spaces.

Bye Nicky

 

[DataPoint]

The Scots should be recommended to visit 1,000 destinations in England. They would be awe struck - and learn to love, need and want us! Millions of Europeans do.

 

[beorhthelm]

And together with their 5 kids and a wife that stays at home (social housing that they've jumped the queue for due to their kids) they are a drain on the economy
Due to their unskilled job paying minimum wage .

are you referring to the local indigenous, workshy population, or those coming to seek work for a better life?

 

[nicko31]

Perhaps the Scots will learn something from the mess that is developing with Brexit, voting with your heart rather than your head isn't such a great idea.