[News] School strikes

[LamieRobertson]

I've never said on this thread that I don't have a vested interest here. My wife is a teacher, therefore i know both her and many of her colleagues.


Again i'll stick to the facts that i know of. Every teacher is different. The unions are representing all, including the most militant. My wife, and her colleagues, would accept 5% if it was additional money from the government and was not taken from existing school funs. This is the frustration of all those that i've spoken with - there is a negotiation to be had here, but both sides have to give some ground.

Erm….not sure why you came back with that reply…i just said you know a lot of teachers

 

[Normal Rob]

Erm….not sure why you came back with that reply…i just said you know a lot of teachers

It was more a case of me declaring, and being open about, my position that could be conceived as being biased, as opposed a barbed comment on your post. Apologies if it came across that way, it was not intended.

 

[Brian Fantana]

Local Primary school to me had a solitary guy outside waving a little flag.
School was fully open, staff car park full.
Both secondary schools mini GB’s attend closed to all but years 10 and 11. No online lessons provided.

No picket line at all at my daughter's primary school. Every teacher is in work. It looks like a normal school day there. I have no idea which union(s) are represented by the staff there.

 

[LamieRobertson]

It was more a case of me declaring, and being open about, my position that could be conceived as being biased, as opposed a barbed comment on your post. Apologies if it came across that way, it was not intended.

Likewise if I had posted in a way that could be misunderstood

I need to get to know more teachers

 

[timbha]

No picket line at all at my daughter's primary school. Every teacher is in work. It looks like a normal school day there. I have no idea which union(s) are represented by the staff there.

That’s interesting. I thought all teachers were out (except private schools). I wonder how the BBC will represent the schools that are open.

 

[Weststander]

Not everyone is feeling the pinch. Those rich beyond why possible need are on the whole several times wealthier then they were. The majority have suffered terms pay cuts, even before you factor in ridiculous rents and the current cost of living crisis.
You don't pay through the nose for schooling, basic per pupil funding is 3k pa for secondary, add in all possible premiums you still don't get to 6k. Basic day fees for Eton and Brighton College £45k.
We have seen low waged workers unionise and strike. More should. Corporate profits and executive pay are at record levels. The money is there. A little redistribution and those workers don't need subsidising by the state.
What is it our liberal attitude to offshore banking and failure to pursue ultra high net worth tax evaders costs us £20 trillion pa?

Bastard teachers, wanting to be paid closer to what they were fifteen years ago, wanting better for children. Yeah they're the bad guys here. Can we just check in on the country's progress under this government 90% of people poorer, public services on knees, even more services and assets sold off, most expensive power, most expensive railways, pumping record amounts of sewage into waterways, record debt (even if you factor the massive Covid grift out), record child poverty, record food bank use, record excess deaths.
But we do have a cabinet and ruling party full of multi millionaires, and a billionaire PM, surely coincidentally the category of people whose wealth has multiplied many times over, who is at least more competent than the previous PM because while he continues the vast upward transfer of wealth does at least knows that trickle down economics is complete bullshit

£7.5k per pupil per annum, is the state spend.

Separately, a 2019 comparison is:

 

[amexer]

Although completely against the strikes interested to know why have teachers got 2 unions. Isn't it a bit of a mish mash with some in and some out

 

[Brian Fantana]

That’s interesting. I thought all teachers were out (except private schools). I wonder how the BBC will represent the schools that are open.

We're in the North East, for reference. I believe the nationwide figure is that c80% of schools are experiencing varying levels of distruption.

 

[Greenbag50]

No picket line at all at my daughter's primary school. Every teacher is in work. It looks like a normal school day there. I have no idea which union(s) are represented by the staff there.

They won’t

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/education-64431992

 

[Brian Fantana]

They won’t

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/education-64431992

They won't what? Sorry, I may have missed your point on this one.

 

[Curious Orange]

3. Do you think it is fair that teachers have seen a substantial real terms pay cut over the last decade?

It is a mistake to conflate price inflation with wage inflation, as they do not go hand in hand. Nobody refuses a pay rise when prices aren't going up do they?

I'm not taking a side one way or another on whether the teachers should be striking btw, my opinion is that pay should be set at a level that is affordable within the overall budget. If paying teachers more means that we then can't afford to run them and become more reliant on PTA fundraising then that is a problem.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Since we are posting our experiences

My daughters school (where she teaches) open..although there are other factors in play I can’t discuss here

My grandsons school closed

If my grandson thought he was going to get the day off, he was wrong …he’s gone with his Mum to her school

 

[Greenbag50]

They won’t

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/education-64431992[/URL

http://

 

[Greenbag50]

They won't what? Sorry, I may have missed your point on this one.

Sorry, replied to wrong comment! Lol

 

[Notters]

Today there are figures showing there are more households who receive more net government spending than they put into the chicken on the kitchen table (bonus point on the chicken reference)
That is not sustainable

Don't think this has been challenged.
This entirely misleading headline came from the Mail or the Express (can't remember which). It includes around 10 million pensioners and so is entirely meaningless.
It is information like this that has brought us Brexit and 13 years of tory rule.

Edit: I see it has, but it's a point worth making twice.

 

[Berty23]

It is a mistake to conflate price inflation with wage inflation, as they do not go hand in hand. Nobody refuses a pay rise when prices aren't going up do they?

I'm not taking a side one way or another on whether the teachers should be striking btw, my opinion is that pay should be set at a level that is affordable within the overall budget. If paying teachers more means that we then can't afford to run them and become more reliant on PTA fundraising then that is a problem.

Can you point to when teachers have had a real term pay rise then please? Ie when they have not turned down a pay rise when no inflation. Here is a useful chart.



The teachers are not just striking over pay. They are striking because pay rises are from existing budgets ie money from elsewhere. They want more money from government so that they don’t rely on pta. People don’t seem to understand that recruitment and retention issues end up costing the economy money if standards drop. It is like “saving” money on health services only for more people to be poorly which leads to higher expense. See this for social services, education etc.

 

[Berty23]

Don't think this has been challenged.
This entirely misleading headline came from the Mail or the Express (can't remember which). It includes around 10 million pensioners and so is entirely meaningless.
It is information like this that has brought us Brexit and 13 years of tory rule.

Edit: I see it has, but it's a point worth making twice.

I think the daily Mail is championing reducing pensions or possibly introducing euthanasia? Not sure which. The problem is that lots of people are too dim to realise they are being played.

 

[Curious Orange]

Can you point to when teachers have had a real term pay rise then please? Ie when they have not turned down a pay rise when no inflation. Here is a useful chart.



The teachers are not just striking over pay. They are striking because pay rises are from existing budgets ie money from elsewhere. They want more money from government so that they don’t rely on pta. People don’t seem to understand that recruitment and retention issues end up costing the economy money if standards drop. It is like “saving” money on health services only for more people to be poorly which leads to higher expense. See this for social services, education etc.

I agree entirely with your sentiment as it happens. We absolutely should be investing in quality in our education.

I was disappointed that that graph doesn't really show anything useful unfortunately, and I suspect it makes the mistake I mentioned earlier of conflating price inflation with wage inflation. It'd be more useful to see what teachers are actually paid over time and their relative starting positions for each country. No doubt they've all had regular pay rises over the period shown, which is not something that has happened for everyone.

The point I was making is that a wage increase is always a wage increase, and a price increase is always an increase in price.

 

[Berty23]

I agree entirely with your sentiment as it happens. We absolutely should be investing in quality in our education.

I was disappointed that that graph doesn't really show anything useful unfortunately, and I suspect it makes the mistake I mentioned earlier of conflating price inflation with wage inflation. It'd be more useful to see what teachers are actually paid over time and their relative starting positions for each country. No doubt they've all had regular pay rises over the period shown, which is not something that has happened for everyone.

The point I was making is that a wage increase is always a wage increase, and a price increase is always an increase in price.

So over a 13 year that line being that far under the 0 line does not show you that they are on real term pay cut? Some get progression pay but those at top of bands won’t.

 

[Curious Orange]

So over a 13 year that line being that far under the 0 line does not show you that they are on real term pay cut? Some get progression pay but those at top of bands won’t.

I doesn't show they've had a pay cut at all, what it purports to show is that prices are increasing faster than wages.

Everyone would like their wages to increase higher than prices, or at the very least in line with them.