[Football] Saudi consortium to take over Newcastle

[BN41Albion]

Your fans protested against Ashley for sure. Was it enough, I really don't know, but simply having an unscrupulous owner is never likely to arouse a huge amount of sympathy in the football community and elsewhere. When we hear about the 'plight of the poor Newcastle fans' we need to think about fans who really have a hard time, Bury for instance, clubs who have never graced the second tier let alone the top league.

There are always plenty of reasons not to protest. If it was an issue to most Geordies, you can bet that change would occur, but just to quote my friend again, he hated Ashley so much simply due to perceived lack of funding. However he could not care one jot that a murderous regime was taking control simply because he thought they would splash the cash. Whilst that kind of attitude prevails, then maybe you're right and it's a lost cause. It's a massive shame for how Newcastle are thought of. In the past, unless one was a Mackem, people usually held a soft spot for the club. I don't think this is the case any longer.

Considering the supposed passion of the geordie fans, I'd say the protests against Ashley were largely really weak and a poor effort from the fans considering also how much they apparently despised him.

As for the Saudi take over, I can't comment on how our fans would react overall but it's pretty depressing that seemingly the sum total of F all Newcastle fans seem bothered at all by it. In fact the other day when we played them if anything it was the opposite - lots of groups of fans at the station singing 'we're rich, and we know we are' etc.

Gonna be really shit for football and society in general when they do start getting their blood soaked hands on trophies, but by then the takeover and source of money will have all been forgotten I guess, just like with Man City. Depressing stuff, sportswashing, but it seems to work due to the fickle nature of folk on the whole, especially in this country. (I'd love to see the difference in reaction from fans in Germany, for example)

 

[Guinness Boy]

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https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...blood-money-the-new-normal-for-newcastle-fans

I’m genuinely shocked that this kind of protest has just evaporated rather than gained any form of traction.

Considering the ongoing level of outrage seen on most fans forums, I find this odd.

As admirable as the sentiments are (and as much as we didn't even do a banner) it's just virtue signalling at the end of the day. The Saudis are hardly going to think "do you know what, we ought to get out of sports washing because Crystal Palace have done a banner". And the fit and proper test isn't worth the paper it's written on and never will be. The ship sailed years ago. It's the City takeover that should have been stopped.

The answer (which will also never happen) is alluded to by [MENTION=36011]BN41Albion[/MENTION] and would be German style ownership rules. No chance of that here though. It would probably take a mass boycott of every game and merchandise and TV before anyone would consider it. Well meaning banners won't cut it.

 

[Wardy's twin]

Not sure we need them buying our football clubs though, do we? Or is that part of the deal?

But its ok to get to the ground in transport powered by saudi oil?

To answer your question the answer is no a) because of source of the money b) because of the amount of money they will pump in making PL even more unfair but to be fair the same can be said outa number of the clubs in PL for one or both of teh reasons.

If Brighton fans wanted to send a message then best option would for us not to turn up , it would have sent a very clear message playing in a ground with empty stands. Didn't happen here or elsewhere.

 

[The Fish]

But if they put all the money in from the murderous regimes for you to win some trophey or another you'll have to to prened it is not related so you can enjoy it. It would be like us saying Tony Bloom has no impact on where we are today.

It's is delusional

You seem a decent person and I believe this is difficult for you, but the images that have been shown is that the majority of Newcastle fans have sold their soul for success.

I remember having similar thoughts when Man City were bought by Sheikh Mansour, in the very nascence of sportswashing in the PL. "How can they tolerate this? Why are they wearing tea towels on their heads?" Unfortunately, it's the nature of modern football. Everything is for sale. And when you're not the one in control of who's doing the buying or selling, protests feel toothless. The Saudis bought my club from Ashley because there's great opportunity to improve the club, there's significant opportunity to invest in the region (and see returns on that investment), and like Man City, it's a club with a large fanbase who've not tasted success in any real way for decades. I'm sure were the Saudis aimed to buy Man Utd, there would have been a greater resistance to it. They've enjoyed recent success, they're already a major player in football. So what would they gain as a fanbase from this kind of takeover?

We, as fans of the club, stand to gain a great deal and we won't see the cost for a while yet, if ever.

I don't think it's realistic to expect fans of Newcastle to collectively rail against these new owners, yet. It's like, if your boat is sinking and an actual Nazi rows by and offers you help. You could wait, and hope that a good Samaritan will come by, or get in the SS SS and worry about what that means later.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

It's like, if your boat is sinking and an actual Nazi rows by and offers you help. You could wait, and hope that a good Samaritan will come by, or get in the SS SS and worry about what that means later.

Or you get in the boat, wait until he's not looking then choke him out and throw him into the sea.

That's what I'd do in that instance.

 

[FatSuperman]

I remember having similar thoughts when Man City were bought by Sheikh Mansour, in the very nascence of sportswashing in the PL. "How can they tolerate this? Why are they wearing tea towels on their heads?" Unfortunately, it's the nature of modern football. Everything is for sale. And when you're not the one in control of who's doing the buying or selling, protests feel toothless. The Saudis bought my club from Ashley because there's great opportunity to improve the club, there's significant opportunity to invest in the region (and see returns on that investment), and like Man City, it's a club with a large fanbase who've not tasted success in any real way for decades. I'm sure were the Saudis aimed to buy Man Utd, there would have been a greater resistance to it. They've enjoyed recent success, they're already a major player in football. So what would they gain as a fanbase from this kind of takeover?

We, as fans of the club, stand to gain a great deal and we won't see the cost for a while yet, if ever.

I don't think it's realistic to expect fans of Newcastle to collectively rail against these new owners, yet. It's like, if your boat is sinking and an actual Nazi rows by and offers you help. You could wait, and hope that a good Samaritan will come by, or get in the SS SS and worry about what that means later.

Your analogy isn't a very good one, since that is a life or death situation. I think a more reasonable one would be "if you had a decent house, but there were other people on the street with better houses, would it be ok to let Harold Shipman and Jimmy Saville give you money to build the best house on the street? Whilst wearing clothing to show your glee and support for Harold and Jimmy"

I think you are just ignoring / excusing all of it because your team gets investment. I'm not saying any other club's fans would be much different, as I do agree with your point that fans mainly just want to watch football, and they don't have anywhere near the leverage they used to. The only way you'd get them out (and get MASSIVE respect from everyone) would be to all stop going to matches, and endlessly protest instead.

 

[The Fish]

Considering the supposed passion of the geordie fans, I'd say the protests against Ashley were largely really weak and a poor effort from the fans considering also how much they apparently despised him.

As for the Saudi take over, I can't comment on how our fans would react overall but it's pretty depressing that seemingly the sum total of F all Newcastle fans seem bothered at all by it. In fact the other day when we played them if anything it was the opposite - lots of groups of fans at the station singing 'we're rich, and we know we are' etc.

Gonna be really shit for football and society in general when they do start getting their blood soaked hands on trophies, but by then the takeover and source of money will have all been forgotten I guess, just like with Man City. Depressing stuff, sportswashing, but it seems to work due to the fickle nature of folk on the whole, especially in this country. (I'd love to see the difference in reaction from fans in Germany, for example)

I thought the protests were proportionate. We did the banners, the boycotts, ditching tickets all that stuff. But short of an empty stadium for several games, I'm not sure what else we could have done.

re: sports washing. Does it work? Like, do you think UAE are a modern, pluralist, liberal country just because Man City are really good at football? What about Qatar because of PSG? Or Saudi Arabia because of us?

It seems to me, every article on Saudi Arabia in the press because of us, and the Golf and the boxing references the regime, or sportswashing. Doesn't feel like they're benefiting much from it, yet. Especially when atrocious crimes like jailing a woman for 35yrs for daring to voice an opinion on twitter is widely and rightly vilified.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Your analogy isn't a very good one, since that is a life or death situation. I think a more reasonable one would be "if you had a decent house, but there were other people on the street with better houses, would it be ok to let Harold Shipman and Jimmy Saville give you money to build the best house on the street? Whilst wearing clothing to show your glee and support for Harold and Jimmy"

I think you are just ignoring / excusing all of it because your team gets investment. I'm not saying any other club's fans would be much different, as I do agree with your point that fans mainly just want to watch football, and they don't have anywhere near the leverage they used to. The only way you'd get them out (and get MASSIVE respect from everyone) would be to all stop going to matches, and endlessly protest instead.

Very well put. You could have added, "spent a lot of time on the internet justifying the actions of Harold and Jimmy because there are a lot of other perverts and murderers out there and claiming that their actions are just a normal part of the modern world which we have to tolerate"

 

[Seagull27]

I don't think it's realistic to expect fans of Newcastle to collectively rail against these new owners, yet. It's like, if your boat is sinking and an actual Nazi rows by and offers you help. You could wait, and hope that a good Samaritan will come by, or get in the SS SS and worry about what that means later.

Your boat wasn't sinking though, was it. It just hadn't been painted in a while and didn't have all the fancy features that other boats have.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I thought the protests were proportionate. We did the banners, the boycotts, ditching tickets all that stuff. But short of an empty stadium for several games, I'm not sure what else we could have done.

re: sports washing. Does it work? Like, do you think UAE are a modern, pluralist, liberal country just because Man City are really good at football? What about Qatar because of PSG? Or Saudi Arabia because of us?

It seems to me, every article on Saudi Arabia in the press because of us, and the Golf and the boxing references the regime, or sportswashing. Doesn't feel like they're benefiting much from it, yet. Especially when atrocious crimes like jailing a woman for 35yrs for daring to voice an opinion on twitter is widely and rightly vilified.

Really? Surely that's complete bollocks? There were wild scenes of celebration on the streets of Newcastle with thousands of people there. Your celebrity fans are unequivocally enthusiastic. That's why all right thinking football fans are disgusted at the behaviour of your fan base and those surrounding your club.

The stadium has been packed since the Saudi's took over. What boycotts have their been?

 

[FatSuperman]

I thought the protests were proportionate. We did the banners, the boycotts, ditching tickets all that stuff. But short of an empty stadium for several games, I'm not sure what else we could have done.

re: sports washing. Does it work? Like, do you think UAE are a modern, pluralist, liberal country just because Man City are really good at football? What about Qatar because of PSG? Or Saudi Arabia because of us?

It seems to me, every article on Saudi Arabia in the press because of us, and the Golf and the boxing references the regime, or sportswashing. Doesn't feel like they're benefiting much from it, yet. Especially when atrocious crimes like jailing a woman for 35yrs for daring to voice an opinion on twitter is widely and rightly vilified.

Obviously we don't, but it definitely, 100% legitimises these nations to a huge number of people. The Romans did it for decades to great effect, as have every disgusting regime since. Man City fans boo the Champions League theme because UEFA imposed mild sanctions on City. They should be booing their owners.

Sportwashing over time changes people's perceptions of these nations. It's not an instant thing, it's a long term play and they know it.

I would say it feels like it's getting less successful, but if it had almost the opposite effect that you seem to suggest, they'd probably stop spending the billions.

 

[The Fish]

Your analogy isn't a very good one, since that is a life or death situation. I think a more reasonable one would be "if you had a decent house, but there were other people on the street with better houses, would it be ok to let Harold Shipman and Jimmy Saville give you money to build the best house on the street? Whilst wearing clothing to show your glee and support for Harold and Jimmy"

I think you are just ignoring / excusing all of it because your team gets investment. I'm not saying any other club's fans would be much different, as I do agree with your point that fans mainly just want to watch football, and they don't have anywhere near the leverage they used to. The only way you'd get them out (and get MASSIVE respect from everyone) would be to all stop going to matches, and endlessly protest instead.

I didn't say where the boat was No, I take your point, and I don't expect any sympathy from opposition fans when discussing Mike Ashley. From the outside he appeared fine, we were in the PL for all but 2 years, we bought some good players, we were finishing around mid table etc. etc. But everyone's battles are their own, I've Man Utd mates who are furious with how their owners are 'ruining' their club.

So, no, we weren't dying in the same way Bury were, but maybe we were in a coma? We weren't a football club any more, we were an advert for Sports Direct. How could you get excited about that? So these owners, these murderous, awful owners, saw how easy it would be to get the fans largely on side. The idea that you could convince tens of thousands of Newcastle fans to stop going to the football, at the very point their football club becomes a football club once more, is fanciful at best. Especially when all we'd get for it is at worst the owners severing any and all interest in us and at best some nebulous 'massive respect' from opposition fans? Nah, you're all right thanks.

I say, the better approach is to use our flag displays to promote inclusivity, to promote freedoms, to promote plurality. I'd love to see a display celebrating LGBTQ+ fans beamed straight into the homes of the Saudis.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

I say, the better approach is to use our flag displays to promote inclusivity, to promote freedoms, to promote plurality. I'd love to see a display celebrating LGBTQ+ fans beamed straight into the homes of the Saudis.

If there was some genuine activism on display, then fair play.

If for example, I'd watched your game yesterday, and I'd seen a big banner or tifo, decrying the disgusting sentencing of the UK-based student (that you rightly flag as such, in an earlier post today) then that would have been most excellent.

But I didn't. I just saw a load of geordies wearing Saudi Arabia kits, holding banners idolising the Brazilian baubles the scum owners have bought you off with.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I didn't say where the boat was No, I take your point, and I don't expect any sympathy from opposition fans when discussing Mike Ashley. From the outside he appeared fine, we were in the PL for all but 2 years, we bought some good players, we were finishing around mid table etc. etc. But everyone's battles are their own, I've Man Utd mates who are furious with how their owners are 'ruining' their club.

So, no, we weren't dying in the same way Bury were, but maybe we were in a coma? We weren't a football club any more, we were an advert for Sports Direct. How could you get excited about that? So these owners, these murderous, awful owners, saw how easy it would be to get the fans largely on side. The idea that you could convince tens of thousands of Newcastle fans to stop going to the football, at the very point their football club becomes a football club once more, is fanciful at best. Especially when all we'd get for it is at worst the owners severing any and all interest in us and at best some nebulous 'massive respect' from opposition fans? Nah, you're all right thanks.

I say, the better approach is to use our flag displays to promote inclusivity, to promote freedoms, to promote plurality. I'd love to see a display celebrating LGBTQ+ fans beamed straight into the homes of the Saudis.

This has come up as a quote from me in my notifications, and it seems to address some things I said directly e.g. Ashley and Bury but it's not my quote appearing. @mods? And there's a second notification for a post quote that is also not mine, any ideas what's going on?

 

[FatSuperman]

I didn't say where the boat was No, I take your point, and I don't expect any sympathy from opposition fans when discussing Mike Ashley. From the outside he appeared fine, we were in the PL for all but 2 years, we bought some good players, we were finishing around mid table etc. etc. But everyone's battles are their own, I've Man Utd mates who are furious with how their owners are 'ruining' their club.

So, no, we weren't dying in the same way Bury were, but maybe we were in a coma? We weren't a football club any more, we were an advert for Sports Direct. How could you get excited about that? So these owners, these murderous, awful owners, saw how easy it would be to get the fans largely on side. The idea that you could convince tens of thousands of Newcastle fans to stop going to the football, at the very point their football club becomes a football club once more, is fanciful at best. Especially when all we'd get for it is at worst the owners severing any and all interest in us and at best some nebulous 'massive respect' from opposition fans? Nah, you're all right thanks.

I say, the better approach is to use our flag displays to promote inclusivity, to promote freedoms, to promote plurality. I'd love to see a display celebrating LGBTQ+ fans beamed straight into the homes of the Saudis.

Oh come on. It was hardly 'no longer a club' but instead just an advert for Sports Direct. That's another example of the ridiculous levels of expectation you all seem to have.

I know it's not up there with the top six, but he did spend money, and you did 'ok' over his ownership. Christ, look at other similar sized clubs languishing much further down the leagues. Ashley was clearly a knob, but he's not quite the disaster that you all make out. He didn't steal your ground. He didn't saddle the club with billions of debt just to buy it.

Newcastle fans outrage was absolutely ridiculous frankly. And the fact you think Mike Ashley is worse than PIF is laughable. Of course, if the most important measure in anything is 'how much of someone else's money will be spent on Newcastle United', then fair enough, they are better. But on EVERY other thing imaginable I would suggest they are far worse.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

And the fact you think Mike Ashley is worse than PIF is laughable.

It is laughable. It is honestly what my otherwise intelligent Geordie friend believes. Very very odd.

 

[TWOCHOICEStom]

I say, the better approach is to use our flag displays to promote inclusivity, to promote freedoms, to promote plurality. I'd love to see a display celebrating LGBTQ+ fans beamed straight into the homes of the Saudis.

Like sticking your finger up at the teacher from the back of the class when he's not looking.

 

[The Fish]

If there was some genuine activism on display, then fair play.

If for example, I'd watched your game yesterday, and I'd seen a big banner or tifo, decrying the disgusting sentencing of the UK-based student (that you rightly flag as such, in an earlier post today) then that would have been most excellent.

But I didn't. I just saw a load of geordies wearing Saudi Arabia kits, holding banners idolising the Brazilian baubles the scum owners have bought you off with.

Did you? Not saying this to be ornery, but I didn't notice any. I'm sure there were a handful, but definitely not loads.

The people behind Wor Flags could do with putting a few more... provocative(?) banners, but it worth remembering, that this is all very new to us.

 

[brightn'ove]

I didn't say where the boat was No, I take your point, and I don't expect any sympathy from opposition fans when discussing Mike Ashley. From the outside he appeared fine, we were in the PL for all but 2 years, we bought some good players, we were finishing around mid table etc. etc. But everyone's battles are their own, I've Man Utd mates who are furious with how their owners are 'ruining' their club.

So, no, we weren't dying in the same way Bury were, but maybe we were in a coma? We weren't a football club any more, we were an advert for Sports Direct. How could you get excited about that? So these owners, these murderous, awful owners, saw how easy it would be to get the fans largely on side. The idea that you could convince tens of thousands of Newcastle fans to stop going to the football, at the very point their football club becomes a football club once more, is fanciful at best. Especially when all we'd get for it is at worst the owners severing any and all interest in us and at best some nebulous 'massive respect' from opposition fans? Nah, you're all right thanks.

I say, the better approach is to use our flag displays to promote inclusivity, to promote freedoms, to promote plurality. I'd love to see a display celebrating LGBTQ+ fans beamed straight into the homes of the Saudis.

You aren't a football club now, you're a sportswashing organisation for the murderous saudi regime.

But at least you're not flogging slazenger tennis balls anymore eh

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Did you? Not saying this to be ornery, but I didn't notice any. I'm sure there were a handful, but definitely not loads.

The people behind Wor Flags could do with putting a few more... provocative(?) banners, but it worth remembering, that this is all very new to us.

So you haven't got round to protesting or expressing any reservations at all because it's so recent. OK great