[Football] Safe Standing update

[Wardy's twin]

Really don't understand the issue around safe standing , it certainly has to be safer than standing in designated seating areas as happens with most away fans and most 'kop' ends.

This is a long long way from the terracing of the my youth where you could start at one point and then quickly find yourself crowd surfed 10 yards away following a piece of action.

I think the club would favour it more if it genuinely believed there were 5-8k fans out there who would regularly attend games, as it is IMO we have reached or are very close to an optimised fans to seats ratio so why change and indeed why spend more money at this point.

 

[crookie]

Really don't understand the issue around safe standing , it certainly has to be safer than standing in designated seating areas as happens with most away fans and most 'kop' ends.

This is a long long way from the terracing of the my youth where you could start at one point and then quickly find yourself crowd surfed 10 yards away following a piece of action.

I think the club would favour it more if it genuinely believed there were 5-8k fans out there who would regularly attend games, as it is IMO we have reached or are very close to an optimised fans to seats ratio so why change and indeed why spend more money at this point.

The fact that we sell out pretty much every game and have a large waiting list for ST means IMHO the club isn't interested in pushing this. They have already said it won't increase capacity, so it is only cost-negative to them unless that cost is passed onto the fans.

I am near the back of the North and stand all game anyway, as do all those around me, so it is not something that I personally have strong feelings about. Certainly if we had thousands of empty seats every game, and the club felt it was something that would help increase attendances, they might be more keen. Can't see that happening until we are again, hopefully not for a long time, in the lower reaches of the Championship or League 1.

 

[JonnyComeEarly]

I want full on mosh pit terraces back please. Good enough for league 1 down and rugby. Whats the problem

 

[darkwolf666]

The North needs a blatant rejig and this would be the best way to do it.

Why, why does it need a "blatant" rejigt? In whose opinion is it so blatant? What are the rejiggers hoping to achieve?

 

[darkwolf666]

I want full on mosh pit terraces back please. Good enough for league 1 down and rugby. Whats the problem

People dieing at Hillsborough and Heysel, thats the problem...

 

[Wardy's twin]

Heysel was the result of crowd trouble, not sure if seats would have stopped that kicking off, it might have affected the flow of things though and perhaps there would have been less casualties.

Hillsborough is a bit more complex but the safety fences were a major part of the problem.

I don't think anyone who saw what happened then would treat this issue lightly but surely it has to be better to have safe standing rather than to tacitly allow standing in seated areas...

 

[Bob'n'weave]

Heysel was the result of crowd trouble, not sure if seats would have stopped that kicking off, it might have affected the flow of things though and perhaps there would have been less casualties.

Hillsborough is a bit more complex but the safety fences were a major part of the problem.

I don't think anyone who saw what happened then would treat this issue lightly but surely it has to be better to have safe standing rather than to tacitly allow standing in seated areas...

This.

Hysel and Hillsborough were nothing to do with standing or sitting. In the case of Hillsborough, after 27 years, this has been finally confirmed. Gone are the days of any old nutter getting into football grounds. Terraces today would be fantastic in the PL.

 

[wellquickwoody]

People dieing at Hillsborough and Heysel, thats the problem...

Neither disaster was the fault of the terraces.

 

[darkwolf666]

Neither disaster was the fault of the terraces.

Nope, but neither disaster would have happened if people had been seated...

 

[darkwolf666]

Heysel was the result of crowd trouble, not sure if seats would have stopped that kicking off, it might have affected the flow of things though and perhaps there would have been less casualties.

Hillsborough is a bit more complex but the safety fences were a major part of the problem.

I don't think anyone who saw what happened then would treat this issue lightly but surely it has to be better to have safe standing rather than to tacitly allow standing in seated areas...

Agree, standing should not be allowed in all seater stadiums. Move on, times have changed.

 

[darkwolf666]

This.

Hysel and Hillsborough were nothing to do with standing or sitting. In the case of Hillsborough, after 27 years, this has been finally confirmed. Gone are the days of any old nutter getting into football grounds. Terraces today would be fantastic in the PL.

A limited number of people say it would be fantastic. Would it?

 

[JBizzle]

It's an interesting debate, and one I've enjoyed reading this morning... My only take is that, at least for the foreseeable future, the debate at our club will only happen on here. TB & PB have made it blatantly clear that it's not going to happen on safe standing and it's only a small but understandably vocal minority that want it to be implemented. Given the cost and the perceived lack of interest, I can't see it happening.

 

[kingcole]

Safe standing has to be the way forward.

A) from a safety aspect it has be be safer than standing in seated areas
B) oddly, those who will beenfit most are those who want to sit
C) it’s what fans want. Look at how many bums are on seats in away ends or the most vocal home ends.

The club have countered this by saying it won’t increase capacity. The concourses can’t take extra people. It will cost too much. And finally by saying there is no demend based on a poorly worded and targetted sample survey.

All the reports I see suggest a 33-50% increase in capacity. More people might make the concourses busier but they can take more. Just looks at how busy other much smaller concourses are. QPR, Villa and Watford are 3 recent examples.

The only time concourses are pushed to the limit is at half time. Well open an outside smoking area. This will ease congeststion at the busiest times, oh and give some fans what they want.

I’m.a non smoker and will keep my seat on the sides whether standing happens or not so my argument is based on practical observations and have no affect on me personally.

 

[Brovion]

This.

Hysel and Hillsborough were nothing to do with standing or sitting. In the case of Hillsborough, after 27 years, this has been finally confirmed. Gone are the days of any old nutter getting into football grounds. Terraces today would be fantastic in the PL.

Agreed. I HATE it when Hillsborough is trotted out as an example of the 'dangers' of standing. If you're going to take that view you may as well say that the Bradford fire proves that sitting down to watch football is also extremely dangerous. (Far safer just to sit at home and watch football on TV). Both events, and Heysel, were products of their time.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Fans, in the Norff in particular, stand anyway. It seems to 'work' as it does at away matches.

Those that don't wish to join in, don't.

Really don't understand the need to spend all of that money when safe standing, in effect, is already in place.

By making it a finite, designated space then persons on the peripheries might have further grounds to complain, being in or out of the specified zone.

It's like then being told when to stand or not. Self-regulation works pretty well.

 

[Sea Eagle]

Does it work in Germany? Do they have better atmosphere? Any problems with it there?

 

[turienzo's lovechild]

Does it work in Germany? Do they have better atmosphere? Any problems with it there?

Yes, yes, no


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[Bodian]

Fans, in the Norff in particular, stand anyway. It seems to 'work' as it does at away matches.

Those that don't wish to join in, don't.

Really don't understand the need to spend all of that money when safe standing, in effect, is already in place.

By making it a finite, designated space then persons on the peripheries might have further grounds to complain, being in or out of the specified zone.

It's like then being told when to stand or not. Self-regulation works pretty well.

I think the problem is that there are still people who want to sit who are surrounded by those who want to stand (see away idiots thread). As you say 'those that don't wish to join in, dont' - but they don't really have a lot of choice if they can't see when they sit down. If there was designated safe standing areas, then this would no longer be an issue. And standing is safer in properly designed areas than in the current sitting areas.

 

[BeHereNow]

Nope, but neither disaster would have happened if people had been seated...

It happened because too many people got in the ground without tickets and because of the fences. The same thing could've happened if they had seats.

Bring back actual terraces. They use them in lower leagues and rugby ffs. If the government thought it was that bad, then it would've been banned outright with no exceptions. The fact that we don't have fences anymore means we won't ever get another Hillsborough.

 

[Worthing exile]

Safe standing has to be the way forward.

C) it’s what fans want. Look at how many bums are on seats in away ends or the most vocal home ends.

So because I stand at away matches I want to? No it is because everybody does that means I have to. Just like the little lad near me at Southampton who was having to stand on his seat to see. Very safe standing perched on a tip up seat.

If the club sold away tickets on the basis of a batch for sitting from the front and an batch for standing from the back, i bet you would find a lot more sitting.