[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[crodonilson]

The socially distanced QT audience seem pretty unanimous in their opinion it is high time for NATO to get further involved and thus begin WWIII.

 

[peterward]

It’s a fair question, and I won’t duck it. Of course I found what happened in Syria upsetting, but there are some differences, both in the situation itself and personally. Firstly, one way or another the war in Syria had domestic roots; Ukraine was a happy, prosperous nation which is now being ripped to shreds by its neighbour under completely false pretences.

When the war started in Syria, I was younger, more care-free and, crucially, not then a parent. I was definitely a much less sensitive and less mature person back then. Add to that, I don’t think coverage was quite as wall-to-wall as this, nor was social media such a profound medium in those days.

But let me get this out of the way, I do think there is something in the fact that I can relate better to the people of Ukraine than the people of Syria. I don’t mean because of the colour of their skin, but because our values, our lifestyles, the cities in which we live, are more similar. The photos of children lying dead in the street look like my children; they’re dressed like my children. So on an unconscious level, it hits deeper. The fact I’ve been to Kyiv makes it feel more real.

Maybe some will criticise me for that view; a life is a life is a life. I just think it’s human nature that things resonate with you more when you can associate better with the people involved.

Then, and maybe this is selfish, there is the potential for this to escalate into something much bigger. I don’t want my children to grow up (or worse still not grow up), in a war torn country. They’re way too innocent for that. But then that takes me back to the children of Ukraine, who are no less innocent, no less sensitive than mine. And so my head spins from there.

So yeah, this has affected me more than any other conflict that has taken place during my lifetime.

Great answer and exactly this. The Syrian conflict, whilst it had proxy involvement, was primarily a civil war inside Syria which srung up as part of the Arab spring.

Ukraine citizens, overthrew a corrupt Moscow puppet to gain freedom and then try to fulfill what he promised then reneged upon, EU membership.... they were invaded by another country, they've still been at peace, then have again been invaded, use disgusting lies and fabrications, just like the Jews got in WW2 and are being killed indiscriminently by a facist dictator.

 

[peterward]

The socially distanced QT audience seem pretty unanimous in their opinion it is high time for NATO to get further involved and thus begin WWIII.

get your factor 50 and marshmallows out.

I agree with them, if that loon starts WW3 we are acting with total moral integrity to stop genocide. Personally I think he'll bottle.

Right now the west is looking through the fence of Aushwitz in real time and is too worried to do anything less we get gassed as well.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

So it's impossible for a court martial to not send these soldiers to prison? That's weird.

That’s discipline.

 

[jessiejames]

"Russia do not target hospitals"

Oh, ok Vlad. Its those pesky Ukrainian Nazis shelling the shit out of their own cities, murdering men women and children, displacing millions of civilians into bunkers, cellars and then forced into the long, dark uncertainty of a homeless refugee future.

Even now, in the face of what the world is witnessing, Russia perpetuate their lies. The shite they come out with would be laughable, if the whole situation wasn't so tragic. Putin is Hitler Mk2, and the sooner someone fires a bullet in the back of his head the better.

Why was that sudden heart attack visited on Shane Warne and not this c*nt. Proves that there is no God.

Listening on radio yesterday a girl phoned in, she is Russian but living in UK. She has spoken to her parents who are in Russia, she said she has shown them videos of what is really going on but they still believe Putin is correct and that its the West that are causing a war on Russia.

Surely at some point the older Russians will wake up to the truth.

 

[A1X]

The socially distanced QT audience seem pretty unanimous in their opinion it is high time for NATO to get further involved and thus begin WWIII.

 

[Baldseagull]

To be fair, we had two parliamentary votes about whether we should bomb Syria two years apart. Each vote was whether to bomb and came up negative, even though the British Parliament voted whether to bomb the opposite side each time

But let's get back to the current issue and the current hypocrisy with Ukraine. My neighbour (who I mentioned earlier, only child with Ukrainian Parents) has been so relieved since she heard that her parents have managed to get from Kyiv to Prague after being uncontactable for 6 days.

They are now trying to get here so their only daughter can look after them, knowing no one in Prague and paying daily for a hotel. Her mum has a visa, as she was over when I last chatted to her a few weeks ago, but her father's has run out. They have been to the British consulate in Prague three times now, and my neighbours have been on the phone everyday since she got the call that were in Prague. Nothing so far, but her father has an appointment to go through the paperwork at the consulate next week.

I'm so glad that we are checking that her parents (both in their 80s and both of whom I've known for the last 8 years(ish) aren't Russian KGB agents before we let them in. After all, our Government can't be too careful about keeping KGB Agents out, even though it seems to be of no concern, when compared against humanitarian support for every other Government across the globe can

Syria was very messy, still groups fighting now, all hate Assad, and each other, almost impossible to get involved without making it worse.

Seems nuts that even someone who has recently had a visa cannot get approved quickly in this situation. Who are they doing checks with to decide anyway?

 

[Bold Seagull]

Listening on radio yesterday a girl phoned in, she is Russian but living in UK. She has spoken to her parents who are in Russia, she said she has shown them videos of what is really going on but they still believe Putin is correct and that its the West that are causing a war on Russia.

Surely at some point the older Russians will wake up to the truth.

Go and spend some time reading the Bear Pit and see whether older generations wake up to the truth or not.

 

[A1X]

I agree with them, if that loon starts WW3 we are acting with total moral integrity to stop genocide.

In this scenario I’ll make sure that my atomised remains let your atomised remains know that at least we all died for the right reasons as we drift forever across the nuclear wasteland.

 

[Dibdab]

Putins behaviour is awful …is that it?

Care to comment on his records regards human rights, oppression of any form of opposition and the murder of dissidents abroad?

The man is close to joining to the likes of Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot and Amin to name few but you thinks he’s just ‘awful’?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Why are you so desperate to be offended by something? What do you want me to say? Hes a total c*nt and the situation there is horrific. Happy? If you have to draw comparisons, and he may get there, but right now he's far from Hitler and Stalin at this stage. I suggest you check the scale of their atrocities before that sort of comparison. He's probably not even done as much damage as the Saudi Regime in Yemen at this stage, and certainly not as much damage as was done by Blair and Bush in Iraq.

Let us hope that it doesn't come close to any of those either.

 

[pb21]

This doesn't sound good...

[tweet]1501660205381259271[/tweet]

 

[peterward]

In this scenario I’ll make sure that my atomised remains let your atomised remains know that at least we all died for the right reasons as we drift forever across the nuclear wasteland.

the thing that everyone misses, is that the old world we knew a few weeks ago is over forever. Putin has gone full Hitler, invading countries, committing genocide and trying to intimidate against involvement with nukes.

There will be a day where NATO has to get involved, as he wont stop. Its now or later, not now or never

 

[A1X]

the thing that everyone misses, is that the old world we knew a few weeks ago is over forever. Putin has gone full Hitler, invading countries, committing genocide and trying to intimidate against involvement with nukes.

There will be a day where NATO has to get involved, as he wont stop. Its now or later, not now or never

I’m quite happy for NATO to wait until necessary for what NATO is setup to do. Which isn’t to counter Russian aggression against just anyone. Squeeze the Russian economy hard enough and Putin won’t be able to afford to wage war for very long. Even if a disgruntled oligarch doesn’t decide to take actions into their own hands.

By playing chicken with Putin you’re banking on the idea that when push comes to shove he’ll do the right thing and not push the red button. I sure as hell don’t. The west has spent years underestimating Putin and thinking ultimately he’ll do the right thing. No, not me.

 

[Dibdab]

He sure has been a bit naughty hasn't he.


Speak for yourself. There are billions of people who are anything other but despicable.

Was certainly is awful, but the behaviour of some leaders in war is far worse than others. That's why there are things called 'war crimes', which Putin is alleged to have committed.

While everyone else seems to be disgusted by what Putin is doing, you're just saying 'yeah it's bad, but everyone is bad, so it's no different really'. I find that quite disgusting to be honest.

What's happening now is shocking, where on earth have I said it isn't? Billions of people are certainly not despicable but they always seem to end up being led by men that continually create war and suffering. The US has been in pretty much consistent conflict somewhere since WW2. The UK has created and been in war zones for 20 years. The middle east is a shit show. When was the last generation to not know significant conflict? Humans are a mess. And when we're not blowing each other up we're killing our planet. We are essentially a plague.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

And yet we must.

We choose to.

This choice isn't in my name.

 

[Eric the meek]

What's happening now is shocking, where on earth have I said it isn't? Billions of people are certainly not despicable but they always seem to end up being led by men that continually create war and suffering. The US has been in pretty much consistent conflict somewhere since WW2. The UK has created and been in war zones for 20 years. The middle east is a shit show. When was the last generation to not know significant conflict? Humans are a mess. And when we're not blowing each other up we're killing our planet. We are essentially a plague.

But the virus we are all talking about is called Putin. And what is happening now IS shocking, but to be clear, it is Putin's actions which are shocking. No-one else's.

You are always seeking to widen the issue, and go off on various tangents, bringing in other countries, (mostly western ones) into the discussion.

I'm not buying it. And I'm not buying you.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

Why are you so desperate to be offended by something? What do you want me to say? Hes a total c*nt and the situation there is horrific. Happy? If you have to draw comparisons, and he may get there, but right now he's far from Hitler and Stalin at this stage. I suggest you check the scale of their atrocities before that sort of comparison. He's probably not even done as much damage as the Saudi Regime in Yemen at this stage, and certainly not as much damage as was done by Blair and Bush in Iraq.

Let us hope that it doesn't come close to any of those either.

I’m just very pissed of by your whataboutism. This is about putin, trying to compare to others just shifts the spotlight, which is exactly what putin is trying to do.

I’m well aware of what Stalin and Hitler are guilty off, the irony being the famine in Ukraine caused by Stalin, however he is well on the way to joining that unholy bunch of *****.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[birthofanorange]

the thing that everyone misses, is that the old world we knew a few weeks ago is over forever. Putin has gone full Hitler, invading countries, committing genocide and trying to intimidate against involvement with nukes.

There will be a day where NATO has to get involved, as he wont stop. Its now or later, not now or never

That's a very fatalistic attitude, in my opinion. If by some miracle this does not escalate into WW3, the world will slowly return to it's usual crazy 'normality',
Just as it has through every other global conflict throughout history, but there's certainly no coming back if this goes nuclear.
'Now' will (in all probability) mean 'Game Over' - 'Later' will mean 'Quite Possibly'.
Therein lies the difference, to me.

 

[A1X]

We choose to.

This choice isn't in my name.

So you’d rather put the entire future of life on earth at risk instead? It’s a bet too extreme for my liking.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Chemical weapons next from Putin.

And we'll spinelessly cower, quiver and tut from the sidelines.

Our humanity is gone. We are an empty shell.