[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[The Clamp]

As far as Brexit etc is concerned, we are where we are. Whatever advantage the Russians have gained because of it, I have no doubt whatsoever that Europe, including Britain will assist each other, work as a combined force and not hold any grudges from either side until this mess is put to bed. This situation is now way beyond petty squabbles of nationalism or one-upmanship. In my opinion.
Conclusions can be drawn and acted upon after this has ended.

 

[vegster]

USA is the most powerful military state in the world, why are F-35's not shooting Russian aircraft out of the sky in defence of the Ukraine right now, it might send a message to Putin?

That would be because of Putin's quote that " To anyone who would be considering interfering from the outside if you do you will face consequences greater than any you have faced in history All relevant decisions gave been taken, I hope you hear me " ...effectively this is the threat to go nuclear if needed.

He is an utter madman and yet somehow he has to be opposed...interesting seeing David Davis MP's Twitter feed, he thinks we should send RAF jets in and support Ukraine because if we don't stand up to this now ......

 

[The Fits]

I know it’s more nuanced than this but it seems the world is just going to watch as troops stroll into Kiev and effectively take control of another country unopposed.

 

[peterward]

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[Springal]

I know it’s more nuanced than this but it seems the world is just going to watch as troops stroll into Kiev and effectively take control of another country unopposed.

It happened to Crimea, it happened when Russian spies came into Salisbury and unleashed a chemical attack on innocent Brits.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I know it’s more nuanced than this but it seems the world is just going to watch as troops stroll into Kiev and effectively take control of another country unopposed.

Yes, that's exactly what's going to happen

 

[Eric the meek]

So you think being out of Europe and isolated makes no difference when faced with the actions from a now proven Russian megalomaniac?

European leadership so far has come from France and Germany. The UK under Boris and Truss are a laughing stock.

I am a remainer, and am as angry as you are about Brexit. But this thread is not about Brexit, and is many times more important than Brexit. Please don't derail it.

 

[The Clamp]

I know it’s more nuanced than this but it seems the world is just going to watch as troops stroll into Kiev and effectively take control of another country unopposed.

I know it seems like that. But if you could see what is likely going on in war-rooms across the world, I very much doubt that will be the case.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

So you think being out of Europe and isolated makes no difference when faced with the actions from a now proven Russian megalomaniac?

European leadership so far has come from France and Germany. The UK under Boris and Truss are a laughing stock.

There is nothing I can say about this way of seeing everything through the prism of EU membership. We are not ‘out of Europe.’ We are leading members of NATO which is pretty significant at the moment. Rather than keep repeating the same old arguments in this thread (which is about Ukraine) why don’t you take these points into the relevant thread in the Bearpit ?
There are now reports of explosions in Kiev. Just to get back on topic.

 

[peterward]

So you think being out of Europe and isolated makes no difference when faced with the actions from a now proven Russian megalomaniac?

European leadership so far has come from France and Germany. The UK under Boris and Truss are a laughing stock.

Wind your neck in mate. This isnt the time or place. A lot of people here have family there. Right now, everthing around my mother in laws house is being bombed. A shop just ten metres away has been shelled, civilians are dying. So please take your remainer concerns to the bear pit if you still want to keep fighting what is now history, it has nothing to do with an unrovoked attack on a soverign nation or the innoncent people dying today.

We can work perfectly well with the EU (a political union) we're all part of NATO.

 

[The Clamp]

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I think it’s a forgone conclusion that the capital will fall.

 

[Pavilionaire]

As far as Brexit etc is concerned, we are where we are. Whatever advantage the Russians have gained because of it, I have no doubt whatsoever that Europe, including Britain will assist each other, work as a combined force and not hold any grudges from either side until this mess is put to bed. This situation is now way beyond petty squabbles of nationalism or one-upmanship. In my opinion.
Conclusions can be drawn and acted upon after this has ended.

When this has ended?? The last Cold War lasted for over 40 years. Russian will hold Ukraine within days, you think it will end there?

 

[The Clamp]

When this has ended?? The last Cold War lasted for over 40 years. Russian will hold Ukraine within days, you think it will end there?

Sorry, badly worded. I should probably say while we are deciding how to react to this situation.
What I mean is, I don’t think Brexit will have much impact on a cohesive response to this crisis.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Amazed at some of the posts when lives are being lost

 

[Poojah]

I know it’s more nuanced than this but it seems the world is just going to watch as troops stroll into Kiev and effectively take control of another country unopposed.

What else do you do? As Putin has already inferred, any western interference will be met with a significant, almost certainly nuclear response.

It may well come to this anyway should Russia proceed to invade a NATO member nation, but for now all the world can do is stand by and watch. Horrible for the people of Ukraine, who my heart goes out to, but any meaningful intervention at this stage would have dire consequences for Europe and the wider world.

Putin is the most influential man in the world right now, a status he is no doubt enjoying.

 

[beorhthelm]

So you think being out of Europe and isolated makes no difference when faced with the actions from a now proven Russian megalomaniac?

European leadership so far has come from France and Germany. The UK under Boris and Truss are a laughing stock.

its military issue and there is no common EU foriegn policy or military. you are grinding a politcal axe into the matter, if anything exactly the disharmony Russia would like to see. you can chose to play it up or put it aside for the duration.

 

[Pavilionaire]

its military issue and there is no common EU foriegn policy or military. you are grinding a politcal axe into the matter, if anything exactly the disharmony Russia would like to see. you can chose to play it up or put it aside for the duration.

i would have thought a good way to scare the 500m people of the EU would be to disable the UK through cyber attacks. This is not me being political, it is how I think we are now more at risk than we were.

And if it is immaterial then why were the Russians under Putin so keen for us to leave the EU?

 

[peterward]

i would have thought a good way to scare the 500m people of the EU would be to disable the UK through cyber attacks. This is not me being political, it is how I think we are now more at risk than we were.

And why cant we do cyber attacks on Russia, we can. And why cant we expose and confiscate all Russian corrupt wealth including Chelsea FC or Putins wallet, we can and we should.

You act is if we're powerless bystanders, we're not, we're a key part of the largest military defence group on the planet. people need to grow a pair

 

[The Clamp]

i would have thought a good way to scare the 500m people of the EU would be to disable the UK through cyber attacks. This is not me being political, it is how I think we are now more at risk than we were.

You know, we probably are weaker for having left the EU. My take on it is that won’t handicap us in our immediate response to the crisis. Whatever position we find ourselves in now, we are part of a larger response and Brexit, at least in principle has little bearing on where we go form here.
Having said that, I think your point is extremely valid.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

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