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[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)











Poojah

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2010
1,881
Leeds
Unless sanctions work and those who hold the purse strings in Russia oust him, Putin is going nowhere for the foreseeable. Which doesn’t leave many options. The West can either keep supporting Ukraine but ultimately Putin will gain control of Ukraine. If that I have little doubt. This would likely lead to genocide. Then I imagine the options narrow even further. Do the UN go in? Could they go in?

Then we have a decision whether to engage militarily. At this point it’s very dangerous as the nuclear threat becomes real.

Or we wait and see what he does next. If he makes moves on the Baltics, it’s WW3 for certain. And then nuclear war is a very realistic outcome.

I cannot see this ending up without boots on the ground.

If, and I pray this doesn’t happen, this escalates to WW3, I cannot see it taking place without substantial use of nuclear force. And that would be the end of the world as we know it.

Who would have thought, this time two years ago, that the world would have found itself in an even graver situation than it did then. And yet here we are.
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
26,419
West is BEST
My thoughts are with you, you wife and her family. Absolutely disgusting and . . . well there are not words to describe it.

Certainly not 'exciting', that is for sure.

I think the poster probably meant that it gets his adrenaline up, and not in a good way. Poor choice of words but I don’t think he meant he was enjoying it.
 




Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
7,482
We have 11 relatives there, including 3 kids, plus many friends. It's a nightmare. May all of our relatives and friends stay safe.

May they indeed.

It's difficult to know what to say, but your support for them will help their anxiety and morale.
Perhaps you could send them a flow of positive, supportive news items from around the world?
 


jakarta

Well-known member
May 25, 2007
15,743
Sullington
USA is the most powerful military state in the world, why are F-35's not shooting Russian aircraft out of the sky in defence of the Ukraine right now, it might send a message to Putin?
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
26,419
West is BEST
We shouldnt be waiting Clamp, we shouldnt just wait for him then react and catch up..... Like taking your players off the field until they score a goal, then come on try and equalise, then sit down again and wait for their next goal.

We should take the initiative, get on the front foot, the only thing that will make him back down is military force. I'm not suggesting NATO troops on the ground and the most devasatating sanctions ever should be levied, including exposing all of Putins hidden wealth, but this will take time.

We should be giving Ukraine immediately, offensive weapons, attack Russia with Cyber, command control/military planning help, satellite technology and as many weapons as they need or require. We must also do everything to protect their leadership and economy.

Putin has launched this, this is this generations Poland moment. We cannot step back. Putin fears NATO and he is not so irrational to start a nuclear war imho. So why do we bench our key weapon. Short of putting our service people on the ground, we should use the full power of NATO covertly to assist Ukraine. Give them missile defense technology, give them precision missiles. The annexed pupper states on Ukrainian soil think they have a right to invite Russia in? The Sovereign governement of Ukraine has every right to ask NATO to assist in everything except foreign troops.

I agree. Completely. My only thought is that military action would be tempered by the threat of nuclear strike. I think at this point we have to assume Putin is capable of anything.
 




raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
7,673
Wiltshire
We shouldnt be waiting Clamp, we shouldnt just wait for him then react and catch up..... Like taking your players off the field until they score a goal, then come on try and equalise, then sit down again and wait for their next goal.

We should take the initiative, get on the front foot, the only thing that will make him back down is military force. I'm not suggesting NATO troops on the ground and the most devasatating sanctions ever should be levied, including exposing all of Putins hidden wealth, but this will take time.

We should be giving Ukraine immediately, offensive weapons, attack Russia with Cyber, command control/military planning help, satellite technology and as many weapons as they need or require. We must also do everything to protect their leadership and economy.

Putin has launched this, this is this generations Poland moment. We cannot step back. Putin fears NATO and he is not so irrational to start a nuclear war imho. So why do we bench our key weapon. Short of putting our service people on the ground, we should use the full power of NATO covertly to assist Ukraine. Give them missile defense technology, give them precision missiles. The annexed pupper states on Ukrainian soil think they have a right to invite Russia in? The Sovereign governement of Ukraine has every right to ask NATO to assist in everything except foreign troops.

This. We need to get equipment and weapons into Ukraine now, while we can FFS, probably through Poland? I hope to god our the West are cyber attaching all Russian institutions as we speak...if not, then shame on us.
 


beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
36,065
USA is the most powerful military state in the world, why are F-35's not shooting Russian aircraft out of the sky in defence of the Ukraine right now, it might send a message to Putin?

because that would be a direct act of aggression and a big escalation?
 






beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
36,065
This. We need to get equipment and weapons into Ukraine now, while we can FFS, probably through Poland? I hope to god our the West are cyber attaching all Russian institutions as we speak...if not, then shame on us.

there were reportedly several military air transports going in to Ukraine from Turkey yesturday evening.
 


Blue Valkyrie

Not seen such Bravery!
Sep 1, 2012
32,165
Valhalla
USA is the most powerful military state in the world, why are F-35's not shooting Russian aircraft out of the sky in defence of the Ukraine right now, it might send a message to Putin?
Because the no fly zone had to be imposed before invasion with F35s patrolling Ukraine skies.

Then Putin would have to make the call.


Now the dynamic has switched around.


But any Russian aircraft over NATO airspace will I'm sure get just 1 warning from now.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
63,081
The Fatherland
USA is the most powerful military state in the world, why are F-35's not shooting Russian aircraft out of the sky in defence of the Ukraine right now, it might send a message to Putin?

That would lead to an instant world war?
 






nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
18,712
Gods country fortnightly
USA is the most powerful military state in the world, why are F-35's not shooting Russian aircraft out of the sky in defence of the Ukraine right now, it might send a message to Putin?

No fly zone needs to imposed now
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
26,419
West is BEST
because that would be a direct act of aggression and a big escalation?

Agreed. We are a few hours into the invasion. Apart from anything else, it requires a huge strategic operation to get that sort of response active. There’s no point sending fighter jets in if there is no follow up plan and the forces in place to follow through. It would simply result in an air battle with no advantage gained except a load of downed aircraft.
 


Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
70,007
Withdean area
I agree. Completely. My only thought is that military action would be tempered by the threat of nuclear strike. I think at this point we have to assume Putin is capable of anything.

He’d authorise snide chemical and biological weapon attacks in London, Washington DC etc.

We saw what he orchestrated in Salisbury and elsewhere.

Politicians, members of the public here just one touch or inhale from dying a slow death.

Putin would revel in the terror caused and destruction of far superior economies.
 




raymondo

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2017
7,673
Wiltshire
Because the no fly zone had to imposed before invasion with F35s patrolling Ukraine skies.

Then Putin would have to make the call.


Now the dynamic has switched around.

Yes, why didn't 'we' I wonder? Maybe Ukraine didn't want it?? Their leadership has been rather confusing and in denial these past few weeks, IMO, I'm sorry to say.
 




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