[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Mostly when she’s interviewing Government ministers, she is very different when interviewing “victims” or people she sympathises with.

She asks a loaded question and seldom gives the interviewee time to answer in full before interrupting in what comes across to me in an aggressive manner.

Anyhoo, it seems it’s just me from the responses so far, so carry on

I think she’s extremely rude can’t stand her.

 

[beorhthelm]

anyone military care to weigh in on the images from the power plant? things seem to land in a floaty, altogether not shell like manner. have a feeling the media is ramping this up a bit.

 

[Baldseagull]

law
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk-un...n-oligarchs-like-abramovich-times-2022-03-03/


yes we can change the law, and being looked at, how far do we go? not sure if those abroad are having their assets seized without compensation, or frozen and will be returned to them once this is over.

Saw another lawyer saying that the issue is UK Government does not have this information at hand like we would have done in the past, unlike the US which still likes to know where money is coming from, even if they choose to turn a blind eye to it, they are not actually blind. The EU was not mentioned, but we have lost access to data the EU holds on criminals and suspects. Maybe this is one of those things we used to rely on the EU for to some extent, but have not picked up since leaving, or maybe there was a decision to ask few questions and then not have to deny knowledge of where donations might really originate from.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Just a tentative guess, but I think our deterrent was based on the Russians being rational and knowing they would be toast as well?

Not at all sure that applies to Putin.

Putin is allegedly paranoid about catching Covid.

That doesn't stack up with him being perfectly happy to be nuked.

First strike doesn't work with the ballistic subs and the B2 stealth spirits.

 

[danielson81]

[tweet]1499679745012871171[/tweet]

Worrying if true?

 

[schmunk]

anyone military care to weigh in on the images from the power plant? things seem to land in a floaty, altogether not shell like manner. have a feeling the media is ramping this up a bit.

Not military but, at a guess: https://www.hi-us.org/how_cluster_bombs_work

 

[Chicken Run]

This could well be my simple logic, but perhaps we do have one advantage if it gets to nuclear warfare:

If Putin decides to use just one or two in the first instance as a warning shot, he can only take out cities in one or two of the many countries who are against him. If he does that, then if the West responds tit-for-tat, we could take out Moscow and another of Russia's biggest cities, which would have a much greater impact on them. With that in mind, Putin may have to escalate to the highest level if he wants to use them, and fire multiple weapons at multiple targets. Obviously the idea of that is terrifying, but it could somewhat mitigate that he might use one as a 'warning shot'.

This is all theoretical, trying to justify that it still stands as a deterrent to Putin. Of course, even if a single nuclear weapon is used then it is a tragedy of the highest order.

The thought crossed my mind that it could be reassuring anyway, but having written it down I'm now not so sure...

My thoughts are that Hussain didn’t have Nukes and invades Kuwait and the world descends and chased his filthy arse out of there, Putin has Nukes and invades Ukraine but we don’t fancy it with him.

Edit, his deterrent is apparently better than ours.


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[Eric the meek]

https://twitter.com/HenryJFoy/status/1499679745012871171?s=20&t=UF0ktQ2jeoyTpnp-XhGiGw

Breaking: Spain’s foreign minister says
[MENTION=16563]Nat[/MENTION]O
will discuss possible intervention and no-fly zone in Ukraine during a Friday summit of the US-led military alliance

Worrying if true?

Yes.

The fact that they are planning to discuss it, means it is on the agenda at least.

It's a huge step into the unknown.

But probably inevitable. Do it now and not later, when the price may be even higher.

 

[Eric the meek]

BREAKING

'Putin: Don't impose more sanctions on us'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60532634 (scroll down to 11:34)

You know what this means? It means the current sanctions are biting hard.

 

[WhingForPresident]

BREAKING

'Putin: Don't impose more sanctions on us'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60532634 (scroll down to 11:34)

You know what this means? It means the current sanctions are biting hard.

Good.

Пу́тін — хуйло́.

 

[rippleman]

I haven't followed the UK v EU sanctions stuff closely, but the main thing I've heard is a couple of countries requisitioning large yachts that looked to be about to take off.

That's clearly a different matter than, say, expensive properties in London which aren't going to just take flight the next day.

I think the issue with Johnson's failure to impose sanctions on Abramovich is that, in theory, Abramovich could sell Chelsea FC for £3bn today and the money is his, to do with (ie hide away) as he sees fit.

I know that he has said that he will donate any profit to Ukranian refugees but I'm afraid I'm not currently minded to believe anything from Putin's pal.

Given that Ambramovich is probably the highest profile Russian oligarch with connections / investments / assets in the UK there must be some reason why Johnson has danced around imposing sanctions. Hmm. Wonder what they might be.

 

[Icy Gull]

Yes.

The fact that they are planning to discuss it, means it is on the agenda at least.

It's a huge step into the unknown.

But probably inevitable. Do it now and not later, when the price may be even higher.

A nuclear war now or in two years time will have the same end result, unless of course Putin is bluffing or his inner circle will prevent him pushing that button. It’s a hell of a gamble, maybe we should get TB involved

 

[dazzer6666]

I think the issue with Johnson's failure to impose sanctions on Abramovich is that, in theory, Abramovich could sell Chelsea FC for £3bn today and the money is his, to do with (ie hide away) as he sees fit.

I know that he has said that he will donate any profit to Ukranian refugees but I'm afraid I'm not currently minded to believe anything from Putin's pal.

Given that Ambramovich is probably the highest profile Russian oligarch with connections / investments / assets in the UK there must be some reason why Johnson has danced around imposing sanctions. Hmm. Wonder what they might be.

Hmmmmm actually it's 'victims of the war in Ukraine' - cleverly worded to allow him to give it to Russian victims I reckon

 

[rippleman]

Yes.

The fact that they are planning to discuss it, means it is on the agenda at least.

It's a huge step into the unknown.

But probably inevitable. Do it now and not later, when the price may be even higher.

If they impose a no-fly zone over Ukraine it is inevitable that NATO would attack Russian military hardware. That would be an act of war giving Putin the excuse he needs, and has probably be yearning for, to push the button.

Goading Putin into escalating the conflict to nuclear is really not a great idea.

 

[1066familyman]

It seems to me that if the point of NATO is to defend each other, only one of the countries in NATO actually needs to have nukes. Attack one, attack us all, isn't it? Maybe everyone except USA bin them off and instead contribute towards America's costs of maintaining and developing them? Hopelessly naive, I know.

That sounds like a great plan. I mean, It's not like the USA are in the habit of attacking sovereign nations to facilitate regime change.

Oh.

 

[amexer]

NSC maybe not best place to put this but very pro Boris interview on BBC with Former President of Ukraine.

 

[usernamed]

If they impose a no-fly zone over Ukraine it is inevitable that NATO would attack Russian military hardware. That would be an act of war giving Putin the excuse he needs, and has probably be yearning for, to push the button.

Goading Putin into escalating the conflict to nuclear is really not a great idea.

Nor is standing by and watching innocents get slaughtered. Sometimes we’re forced away from great ideas and toward least worst ideas. I’m not sure appeasement will help us in the longer term. Putin will still have nuclear weapons next time.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

[tweet]1499679745012871171[/tweet]

Worrying if true?

Not really worrying.

Time for humanity to step up and be counted.

Demons run when a good man goes to war etc.

Unless we want to stand by when thermobarbic weapons are used, maybe chemical weapons on civilians, Ukrainians publicly executed in public squares.

Where is the line that can't be crossed ?

Does that make humanity worth anything ?

No Russians would be targeted outside Ukraine. Up to them to leave.

 

[drew]

Whilst I don’t disagree with you about the oligarchs, I don’t think UK were responsible for banning the athletes, that was an IOC decision made under pressure from most of the other members no?


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Pedent alert. Actually think it was the IPC that banned them under pressure from other competitors/nations having previously said they could compete under a neutral flag. Bizzare as their sister organisation, the IOC were only the other day recommending sports around the world exclude the Russians and Belarusians!

 

[British Bulldog]

If they impose a no-fly zone over Ukraine it is inevitable that NATO would attack Russian military hardware. That would be an act of war giving Putin the excuse he needs, and has probably be yearning for, to push the button.

Goading Putin into escalating the conflict to nuclear is really not a great idea.

Depends how much of Ukraine Nato put under a no fly zone? I can see the western side under a no fly zone and Ukraine becoming the new Germany.