Russell Brand - Legend or Bellend ?.

[Beanstalk]

I would imagine lots of advertisers with large budgets have told YouTube that they don't want their ads to appear in/alongside Brand's content, and that list will only get longer each day.

From their perspective, I guess it's simpler to just stop all ads for now.

I have similar issues, on a far smaller scale, on a near-daily basis with NSC and ads.

Even simpler than that, "As a YouTube creator, you should remain responsible both on and off the platform. If we see that a creator's on- and/or off-platform behavior harms our users, community, employees or ecosystem, we may take action to protect the community."

That's from YouTube's terms of use. They're a private company, and whether Brand and his followers like it or not, they are simply enforcing the rules he signed up to.

YouTube demonetize videos regularly if they pose any threat to advertiser relationships as well. This can be for copyright infringement, to something as simple as swearing. Basically, they've always been protective of their brand, they enforce it all the time, and I'm sure that whilst many think this is a targeted, almost political act, the reality is it is nothing like that and consistent across the platform.

 

[Poojah]

All our rabbiting aside, perhaps the age of consent could usefully be edited. Yes I know there are countless people who started a relationship age 16 (or younger) and it lasted a lifetime, but that isn't the point. If we are going to bleat about how 'unbalanced' a relationship between a 30 year old and a 16 year old is, then why not make it illegal? Or STFU about it. Surely? Conflating morality and legality isn't appropriate.

My wife’s sister, now 36 but the archetypal quiet introvert as a teenager, would spend a serious amount of time ‘alone’ with a family friend who was 19 years older than her and a local wedding DJ, from the age of 14 or 15.

I myself had not been with my wife very long by the time this all began, and I raised with her at the time that I found their ‘plutonic relationship’ rather uncomfortable. When I suggested, on pretty blunt terms, that he might be banging her, I was told that I was the pervert for even suggesting such a disgusting and absurd thing. As far as her family were concerned, she was quiet and had little to no social life, so this pathway to getting her out of the house could only possibly be a good thing.

Predictably, literally only a couple of weeks after her 18 birthday, she revealed that she was in fact in a relationship with “Graham”, but of course it had only been going on a few days. I’ll be honest, I felt too sick to give it the old “I told you so”.

Her dad, a somewhat stroppy, uncerebral bloke who I’ve had my fair share of run ins with over the years, was understandably apoplectic at this news and abuse of his trust, but having collected his emotions, a few days later reached the conclusion that she was an adult and could see who she wanted. Rather than risk the relationship with his middle daughter, he quickly and perhaps reluctantly accepted their relationship.

When he told me this, I nearly fell off my chair. “Of course you can fúcking do something about it”, I said to him. “Ring the police, she’s been fúcking groomed”. Yet again, it was me who was out of order, for speaking so out of turn about something so grotesque, and it was his relationship with me that soured for sometime.

I don’t doubt that it was an infinitely more difficult situation for him to grapple with emotionally than it was for me, but it staggered me how blinkered this young girl’s family could have been both before and after the revelation that in her late teens, she was seeing someone in their late 30s.

Ultimately, the best part of two decades later, the two of them are married and have just had their second child - he of course now a man in his mid-50s changing the nappies of his 4 month old daughter. Very quickly, their relationship was normalised within the family circle and remains that way today. I’ve always struggled to get my head around that, and still find the whole thing uncomfortably, even though she seems happy (and some would say that that’s all matters).

Funnily enough, though on reflection that’s probably not the most appropriate choice of words, my mate’s daughter (about 12 at the time) was groomed by a bloke who would sit directly behind us at the football (Grimsby). Though she was fortunately never subject to any sexual abuse, it got close to that, and when he was finally thwarted, some other very dark and disturbing things happened. I can’t find the story online as it’s about 15 years ago now, but he had wreaths and even an undertaker sent to their house to collect her “body” - she of course wasn’t dead. He was jailed for 5 or 6 years if memory serves.

Again though, what’s really strange about it was that my mate never saw it coming. He would leave her with this bloke while he went for a pint at half-time, even though I and other friends were very clear to point out that this fella was very clearly a perv.

It makes you wonder; if people close to those being abused don’t see it, perhaps it’s not as easy for those it is actually happening to appreciate what is happening to them; at least at the time. Both situations seemed very strange to me, and yet those directly (and / or closely) affected seemed to do anything and everything to convince themselves that what was happening was completely normal.

Incidentally, both incidents happened or at least began in the noughties. Would they have happened, or been allowed to happen, in the 2020s? Who knows.

 

[Questions]

My wife’s sister, now 36 but the archetypal quiet introvert as a teenager, would spend a serious amount of time ‘alone’ with a family friend who was 19 years older than her and a local wedding DJ, from the age of 14 or 15.

I myself had not been with my wife very long by the time this all began, and I raised with her at the time that I found their ‘plutonic relationship’ rather uncomfortable. When I suggested, on pretty blunt terms, that he might be banging her, I was told that I was the pervert for even suggesting such a disgusting and absurd thing. As far as her family were concerned, she was quiet and had little to no social life, so this pathway to getting her out of the house could only possibly be a good thing.

Predictably, literally only a couple of weeks after her 18 birthday, she revealed that she was in fact in a relationship with “Graham”, but of course it had only been going on a few days. I’ll be honest, I felt too sick to give it the old “I told you so”.

Her dad, a somewhat stroppy, uncerebral bloke who I’ve had my fair share of run ins with over the years, was understandably apoplectic at this news and abuse of his trust, but having collected his emotions, a few days later reached the conclusion that she was an adult and could see who she wanted. Rather than risk the relationship with his middle daughter, he quickly and perhaps reluctantly accepted their relationship.

When he told me this, I nearly fell off my chair. “Of course you can fúcking do something about it”, I said to him. “Ring the police, she’s been fúcking groomed”. Yet again, it was me who was out of order, for speaking so out of turn about something so grotesque, and it was his relationship with me that soured for sometime.

I don’t doubt that it was an infinitely more difficult situation for him to grapple with emotionally than it was for me, but it staggered me how blinkered this young girl’s family could have been both before and after the revelation that in her late teens, she was seeing someone in their late 30s.

Ultimately, the best part of two decades later, the two of them are married and have just had their second child - he of course now a man in his mid-50s changing the nappies of his 4 month old daughter. Very quickly, their relationship was normalised within the family circle and remains that way today. I’ve always struggled to get my head around that, and still find the whole thing uncomfortably, even though she seems happy (and some would say that that’s all matters).

Funnily enough, though on reflection that’s probably not the most appropriate choice of words, my mate’s daughter (about 12 at the time) was groomed by a bloke who would sit directly behind us at the football (Grimsby). Though she was fortunately never subject to any sexual abuse, it got close to that, and when he was finally thwarted, some other very dark and disturbing things happened. I can’t find the story online as it’s about 15 years ago now, but he had wreaths and even an undertaker sent to their house to collect her “body” - she of course wasn’t dead. He was jailed for 5 or 6 years if memory serves.

Again though, what’s really strange about it was that my mate never saw it coming. He would leave her with this bloke while he went for a pint at half-time, even though I and other friends were very clear to point out that this fella was very clearly a perv.

It makes you wonder; if people close to those being abused don’t see it, perhaps it’s not as easy for those it is actually happening to appreciate what is happening to them; at least at the time. Both situations seemed very strange to me, and yet those directly (and / or closely) affected seemed to do anything and everything to convince themselves that what was happening was completely normal.

Incidentally, both incidents happened or at least began in the noughties. Would they have happened, or been allowed to happen, in the 2020s? Who knows.

So he groomed her for marriage and babies ?

 

[Bakero]

So he groomed her for marriage and babies ?

Are suggesting it was OK as he married her in the end?

 

[Questions]

Are suggesting it was OK as he married her in the end?

No

 

[aolstudios]

It's the horseshoe again, what separates Stalin from Hitler, not a lot.

Were you aware that Brand was highly interested in theories about pure German and Dutch bloodlines being tainted by alien blood? In those online spheres, a reference to Jewish people. I wasn't until @clapham_gull pointed out that Brand had reinvented himself as a conspiracy theorist, I then had a look at what lies he peddled or supported.

*Regarding far left nut jobs in the West being anti-semitic, I think it's modern development, am I wrong? I can't recall the far left here being like that in say the 80's and 90's, many of the key folk were Jewish!*

anti-Semitism on the far left came from imported Soviet propaganda, late 70s & 80s. Much of it lifted directly from the Nazis. It was less obvious as they were on the fringes, rather than fluking the party leadership but it was definitely there. Shamefully

 

[Poojah]

Are suggesting it was OK as he married her in the end?

That would be some legal loophole.

 

[Bakero]

No

Thanks for confirming

 

[Bakero]

That would be some legal loophole.

Quite possible in a few places and several more that only decided it wasn't a great idea fairly recently.

Marry-your-rapist law - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Greg Bobkin]

That had me in danger of inhaling my coffee

Yes, perhaps the Deayton outcome would be best. Hislop and Merton took the piss out of Deayton so relentlessly that his position on HIGNFY became untenable. I don't have a problem with Brand being ridiculed for being a twat.

But I am not happy that his income (youtube) has been blocked due to allegations of illegality when a court case doesn't seem remotely on the horizon (yet). Yes, a schoolteacher would be suspended (on full pay) if there were allegations about their conduct at school. Why should Brand be denied an income? It isn't as if Brand, pontificating about 5G and space aliens is bringing youtube into disrepute. FFS.

Also, call me morbid, call me pale, but I'd quite like to hear from Alice's mum.

Made me LOL too.

To your wider point, I guess there is a danger of Brand playing the 'victim' card in his videos and them getting wider coverage – and therefore earning him more revenue – from being even more 'shocking' (possibly in every sense) than before. If, then, the allegations turn out to be true – and he is found guilty of whatever* then YouTube would look awful at allowing him to peddle his shite (IMO) and make money when he's proven to be a wrong'un.

So no, I have no issue with YouTube stopping him gaining revenue from the ads. He's not an employee of YouTube, so it is under no obligation to carry on the status quo – plus it misses out of revenue, I assume, at the same time?

*Not that his cult followers would believe the court got it right and would continue to defend him for eternity. See Johnson, B and Trump D for similar examples.

 

[schmunk]

Are suggesting it was OK as he married her in the end?

No

Yet go back 200 years or more and this was not unusual, particularly amongst the middle and upper classes.

The times they were a'changing.


Edit: but child marriage is still a thing in the US... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_marriage_in_the_United_States

 

[Weststander]

anti-Semitism on the far left came from imported Soviet propaganda, late 70s & 80s. Much of it lifted directly from the Nazis. It was less obvious as they were on the fringes, rather than fluking the party leadership but it was definitely there. Shamefully

Interesting. I wonder what Brezhnev and his mates hoped to gain from it? Their closed economy wasn’t affected by global financiers for example. Perhaps simply playing geopolitics knowing the prominence and success of people with Jewish heritage in the US?

 

[Weststander]

Made me LOL too.

To your wider point, I guess there is a danger of Brand playing the 'victim' card in his videos and them getting wider coverage – and therefore earning him more revenue – from being even more 'shocking' (possibly in every sense) than before. If, then, the allegations turn out to be true – and he is found guilty of whatever* then YouTube would look awful at allowing him to peddle his shite (IMO) and make money when he's proven to be a wrong'un.

So no, I have no issue with YouTube stopping him gaining revenue from the ads. He's not an employee of YouTube, so it is under no obligation to carry on the status quo – plus it misses out of revenue, I assume, at the same time?

*Not that his cult followers would believe the court got it right and would continue to defend him for eternity. See Johnson, B and Trump D for similar examples.

It’s inevitable.

The same huge band of idiots already disciples of:
Trump
Icke
Le Tissier
Beverley Turner
Piers Corbyn
Q Anon
Some hideously far right US Congressmen and women

 

[Crawley Dingo]

I was going to bounce the Farage thread but seeing as you brought it up, this will do.

Seriously?

Many MP fall foul of ‘politically exposed persons’ bank rules, says Chris Philp

Policing minister says case of private bank Coutts closing Nigel Farage’s account is ‘not unique’

www.theguardian.com

Lots of Non-politicians falling foul of the Politicly exposed persons rule as well.

 

[Crawley Dingo]

It’s inevitable.

The same huge band of idiots already disciples of:
Trump
Icke
Le Tissier
Beverley Turner
Piers Corbyn
Q Anon
Some hideously far right US Congressmen and women

You know theres no such thing as Q anon as its a media creation. Theres Q and then theres Anon.

 

[Weststander]

You know theres no such thing as Q anon as its a media creation. Theres Q and then theres Anon.

Of course, you would know

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

You know theres no such thing as Q anon as its a media creation. Theres Q and then theres Anon.

And there is bollocks.

QAnon - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

My wife’s sister, now 36 but the archetypal quiet introvert as a teenager, would spend a serious amount of time ‘alone’ with a family friend who was 19 years older than her and a local wedding DJ, from the age of 14 or 15.

I myself had not been with my wife very long by the time this all began, and I raised with her at the time that I found their ‘plutonic relationship’ rather uncomfortable. When I suggested, on pretty blunt terms, that he might be banging her, I was told that I was the pervert for even suggesting such a disgusting and absurd thing. As far as her family were concerned, she was quiet and had little to no social life, so this pathway to getting her out of the house could only possibly be a good thing.

Predictably, literally only a couple of weeks after her 18 birthday, she revealed that she was in fact in a relationship with “Graham”, but of course it had only been going on a few days. I’ll be honest, I felt too sick to give it the old “I told you so”.

Her dad, a somewhat stroppy, uncerebral bloke who I’ve had my fair share of run ins with over the years, was understandably apoplectic at this news and abuse of his trust, but having collected his emotions, a few days later reached the conclusion that she was an adult and could see who she wanted. Rather than risk the relationship with his middle daughter, he quickly and perhaps reluctantly accepted their relationship.

When he told me this, I nearly fell off my chair. “Of course you can fúcking do something about it”, I said to him. “Ring the police, she’s been fúcking groomed”. Yet again, it was me who was out of order, for speaking so out of turn about something so grotesque, and it was his relationship with me that soured for sometime.

I don’t doubt that it was an infinitely more difficult situation for him to grapple with emotionally than it was for me, but it staggered me how blinkered this young girl’s family could have been both before and after the revelation that in her late teens, she was seeing someone in their late 30s.

Ultimately, the best part of two decades later, the two of them are married and have just had their second child - he of course now a man in his mid-50s changing the nappies of his 4 month old daughter. Very quickly, their relationship was normalised within the family circle and remains that way today. I’ve always struggled to get my head around that, and still find the whole thing uncomfortably, even though she seems happy (and some would say that that’s all matters).

Funnily enough, though on reflection that’s probably not the most appropriate choice of words, my mate’s daughter (about 12 at the time) was groomed by a bloke who would sit directly behind us at the football (Grimsby). Though she was fortunately never subject to any sexual abuse, it got close to that, and when he was finally thwarted, some other very dark and disturbing things happened. I can’t find the story online as it’s about 15 years ago now, but he had wreaths and even an undertaker sent to their house to collect her “body” - she of course wasn’t dead. He was jailed for 5 or 6 years if memory serves.

Again though, what’s really strange about it was that my mate never saw it coming. He would leave her with this bloke while he went for a pint at half-time, even though I and other friends were very clear to point out that this fella was very clearly a perv.

It makes you wonder; if people close to those being abused don’t see it, perhaps it’s not as easy for those it is actually happening to appreciate what is happening to them; at least at the time. Both situations seemed very strange to me, and yet those directly (and / or closely) affected seemed to do anything and everything to convince themselves that what was happening was completely normal.

Incidentally, both incidents happened or at least began in the noughties. Would they have happened, or been allowed to happen, in the 2020s? Who knows.

You outline different examples of life's rich tapestry. There is no guarantee that any relationship, no matter how young or old one or other of the participants may be, will either last or fail. We have rules that deriver from societal norms, and legal cut offs that are deemed to be 'on average' relatively 'safe'. We all think we can spot a wrong 'un but in most cases there is no know 'previous', so we can get it wrong. Some adults are never ready for a sexual relationship at any age (and the sensible ones avoid having one). Others (and not just men) are drawn to all manner of things others would find appalling. And establishing 'informed consent' is tricky, so we arbitrarily deem that it cannot be assigned by someone under the age of 16. It is what it is.

Parents taking an interest in their kid's welfare is however a pivotal bit of safeguarding. I salute your efforts.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I'm not 100% familiar with Youtube's terms of use off the top of my head, but if he's broken them then surely they're perfectly within their right to remove his income stream as he would have agreed to their rules when he joined?

It's not like a genuine public space, being on Youtube is being subject to their rules (just as it is to be here, or as it is to be at the Amex, neither are a God-given right) and if he's broken them (like I said, I don't know whether he has or not, but Youtube clearly think they have a case) then they're well within their right to take action. My Youtube page has never been popular enough to justify digging into it, but someone of his profile should have been aware.

They can do what they want. Like a pub, the management does not need to offer a reason for barring someone, and it is up to the outcast to prove discrimination.

 

[jcdenton08]

They can do what they want. Like a pub, the management does not need to offer a reason for barring someone, and it is up to the outcast to prove discrimination.

This. He also isn’t an employee. The wording in Twitch/YouTube TOCs is very clear and precise about this. Any reason whatsoever is valid - it’s their platform, can do what they like.