[Football] Right then. After that demonstration... VAR? Yes or No?

[trueblue]

This would appear to be a waste of time since you've ignored it when another poster pointed it out: referees have been taught to ignore tight decisions and allow VAR to make the call. If there was no VAR that instruction wouldn't be in place, and the linesman would have flagged. West Ham didn't need to appeal because they would know that every goal is reviewed, and as soon as the ball went in the ref was holding his finger to his ear making it clear the goal was being reviewed.

Letting a goal stand when you know there was an offside is a clear error. The offside call won't always be clear, I've seen a replay and can tell it's offside without the need for the additional lines. So I think it's a clear offside, but even if we agree that it was a tight decision, that is irrelevant. It isn't about how obvious the offside is, it's about allowing a goal to stand when know it was it offside. Allowing the goal to stand is the clear error, not the offside call itself.

I don't say this to defend or champion VAR (still on the fence about it, personally), but to explain the approach regarding the term 'clear and obvious'.

Good explanation. Agree with all of that. Bizarrely, the ‘clear and obvious’ bit has really muddied the waters. They’re actually applying it really well so far as Murray’s ‘handball’ showed i.e. not getting involved in marginal decisions by over-ruling the ref unless they absolutely have to.

But everyone’s getting uptight about things that aren’t really VAR’s fault: applying an offside law that’s now probably too strict and an amendment to ‘handball’ which is stupid.

As for VAR itself, not a fan of delays. But I’m even less a fan of seeing us denied points by dodgy penalties or blatantly offside goals, which has happened so many times that I’m pro, just.

 

[Nobby]

My points, made before VAR was introduced widely.

1. Match Officials make mistakes, whether VAR or not. Examples today, Man City penalty vs Tottenham and Bournemouth penalty vs Villa. Cast Iron but not given despite VAR. so we may as well not have VAR.

2. 30,000 spectators, plus players and staff today, had absolutely no idea there was an issue until Anthony Taylor stuck his finger in his ear. Watching at home, the armchair fan would have been aware that a review was happening.

I travelled round trip seven hours to watch yesterday and spent a lot of hard earned cash. I’m seriously considering not bothering next week even with a season ticket.

May as well save myself some money and become an armchair fan.

Officials are still crap and there’s no advantage given to people who actually go to games.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Man City. A corner comes over, Laporte and a Spurs player leap and challenge, the ball randomly bounces off his bicep, it falls to Jesus who buries it for the winner. But no. A minute or two of celebrations later, and once again the speccy brigade decree they've somehow cheated, and the goal is binned off.

This.
Is.
Shit.

This is where I will disagree. Seeing Castrol GTX PLC having a last minute winner chalked off, for the 2nd time against the same club as the Champions league one was superb. Peps smug grin being erased from his face was magical. All that was missing was a fan in tears.

I'm really looking forward to one going against Palace.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Watching MotD and it just confirms everything I thought. VAR is a pedant's charter, a system for those who'd rather see the "right" result than a nutmeg, volley or crunching tackle. For City's winner the correct decision was eventually made according to the letter of the law. It was handball under the rule changes. But the touch barely changes the tradjectory of the ball, the referee doesn't see it, if it hits the defender's arm it's not a penalty and not a single player appeals. The real issue is the new handball law but VAR has enabled it. We have a terrible rule that has only been brought in because technology allows it. Talk about putting the cart before the horse.

As for our goal, yes one of Burn's legs is offside. Does it give him an advantage in reaching the ball? Of course not. he's 6ft 7 and the ball drops in to an area where he's favourite to pick it up. And is his cross part of the same passage or a new phase? It's debateable. What's not debatable is that a 6ft 7 defender put a cross on a sixpence for a Premier League debutant to volley beautifully in to the corner and go wild with joy. We're back to Pep's passion killer quote again. VAR is granny pants.

I can only assume those in favour have spent their lives driving Volvos, wearing Super Dry and going to the same Spanish resort on holday every year. These things are technically fine but no one will every write a song about them or paint a masterpiece entltled "Man in Super Dry jacket admires his XC40".

Agree with all of that except I have a Volvo and love it. It looks great, is fast and is well equipped.

 

[darkwolf666]

100% yes.

Was the correct decision, just like VAR ruling out Murray's handball v Watford was the correct decision.

Correct decisions being made by referees is a positive thing. How many points has shambolic refereeing in the past cost us - so I'm glad that we are to see a massive improvement in the quality of refereeing because of VAR.

Some days it will suit us, others it won't. Will just will take a bit of getting used to.

But VAR didnt rule out Murray’s handball, the ref didn’t give it - you know that man in the black who used to make the decisions! VAR as it’s now being used is a crock of shit and will ultimately spoil the game as a live spectacle...

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

This would appear to be a waste of time since you've ignored it when another poster pointed it out: referees have been taught to ignore tight decisions and allow VAR to make the call. If there was no VAR that instruction wouldn't be in place, and the linesman would have flagged. West Ham didn't need to appeal because they would know that every goal is reviewed, and as soon as the ball went in the ref was holding his finger to his ear making it clear the goal was being reviewed.

The West Ham players would have certainly appealed had they thought the goal shouldn't have stood. A lifetime of playing football and learning that habit would have ensured that. Var is not going to change that element at all. They didn't appeal as they thought it was a damn fine goal.

 

[Surf's Up]

Yes but with the massive caveat that the way it is used needs to be quickly and significantly improved

 

[trueblue]

What about the occasions VAR will HELP the game flow? If the linesman hadn’t had the safety net of VAR yesterday, he may well have stuck his flag up. Happens all the time on marginal calls and favours the bigger clubs, as the officials know they’ll take a national pummelling if little Brighton upset one of the big 6 with a goal that shouldn’t have counted. So it’s (subconsciously perhaps) safer to flag a 50-50.

9 times out of 10, yesterday’s situation would not have ended with a centre-back crossing it for someone to spank in on the volley. It would have moved on to a new phase of play pretty quickly - and by not making a split second decision on a marginal offside, there would still be the opportunity to score a valid goal.

VAR will have some positive effects on the game and player behaviour, for sure. Unfortunately, they can’t be proven like the black and white “it all took too long”.

 

[Boston28]

My only argument with var is that if it’s going to be used to such a fine margin that is impossible to be seen by the naked eye why have any officials on the pitch in the first place? Just ref the game from behind some screens on the sideline

 

[Nobby]

Get rid sharpish

Stockley Park will be full of geeks who want to make their mark, and now they can spoil the entertainment for the vast majority

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Its just annoying that such minimal margins for a goal (offside) being picked up by a computer. Im not saying it because of today, its just its so minimal in the first place it takes a computer picking up a hair or a players ponytail flicking offside at the wrong moment is a joke, its a negative for me.

What computer is this then ?

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

My only argument with var is that if it’s going to be used to such a fine margin that is impossible to be seen by the naked eye why have any officials on the pitch in the first place? Just ref the game from behind some screens on the sideline

Yes.

Given the free-kick was over hit, and without Burn’s intervention was trickling out of play, doesn’t it then become second phase possession?

Also, although obviously offside, was Burn seeking to gain an advantage? It’s all too black and white.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Nobby]

What computer is this then ?

It’s the super computer operated by the super wannabe refs based at Stockley Park

 

[Westdene Seagull]

It’s the super computer operated by the super wannabe refs based at Stockley Park

All I can imagine is a Hitchikers Guide to the galaxy scene.

 

[GoingUp]

What computer is this then ?

The computer the humans watch all the angles from, from the cameras that they have access to.

 

[Brian Fantana]

VAR will be the reason I walk away from football sooner rather than later.

 

[Nobby]

VAR will be the reason I walk away from football sooner rather than later.

This

 

[Nobby]

All I can imagine is a Hitchikers Guide to the galaxy scene.

The whole thing blows up when they have to make a decision in the 41st minute

 

[Westdene Seagull]

The whole thing blows up when they have to make a decision in the 41st minute

Or we get a total of 42 points.

 

[Albumen]

After two games (cup semi and this one) I’m already not being able to fully enjoy a goal. How is this progress?

The fact that even Trossards allowed goal was being partly reviewed is utter shite. And is what’s the point of having linesman? If they flag and the ref blows what happens if they were onside?

What is it adding to the game? Nothing.