Revealed: former Bradford chairman linked to at least eight fires before Valley Parade

[theboybilly]

I'm sitting here with a lump in my throat just watching that clip. We get to see a longer video footage on our fire-training days at work. It was astonishing how such a small flame in the corner of that stand (no doubt a blaze underneath) soon engulfed the whole of the stand. watching people try to put out the burning clothes of victims on the pitch is heartwrenching.

RIP

 

[Fungus]

You'd have to a right c**t to set a fire on purpose under a stand full of people.

The families and friends must have had a hard enough time, even accepting it as an accident - accidents do happen.

But if it turns out to be murder, that pain will all come back.

Also, what is the point of warning of fire risk, and doing nothing when the inevitable happens?
"Heginbotham died in 1995, aged 61, and was never prosecuted for the Valley Parade fire, despite the coroner later saying he had given serious consideration to bringing a charge of manslaughter. Bradford City had received three separate warnings about the potential fire risk, two from the Health and Safety Executive and another from the council, but did nothing."

 

[fat old seagull]

Surely if you were going to burn down a stand you wouldn't do it during a f**king football match when it's full of people?!?

The south stand at the Goldstone had the good grace to burn down after a match, when empty.

In my view it is exactly the time any desperate and devious person would choose, how would he convince Insurance Companies a fire had started by naturally combusting without means. The fire might have been slowly ignited sometime before the game in the hope that it would give some cause (a disguarded fag) and to take hold after the match. Also perhaps he might have felt the Ins Co might have taken your point of view and thought no one would do such a terrible thing.....well looking around the World at the moment I believe they would.

 

[Flex Your Head]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-32330734

Well, he would say that, wouldn't he?

 

[TomandJerry]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-32330734

Well, he would say that, wouldn't he?

"Mr Fletcher, who was 12 at the time of the blaze, escaped unharmed from the stand at Valley Parade, but his father, uncle, grandfather and younger brother all died.

He claims to have uncovered evidence Mr Heginbotham was in dire financial trouble at the time."

That gives motive to do it

 

[surlyseagull]

I remember going to Readings old ground elm park and a steward advising a guy to put out his cigarette ,in the days when you could smoke in grounds ,as the stand we were in was made of wood, he was fighting a losing battle though ,and going to the Goldstone and seeing piles of rubbish underneath the south stand as we went to take our seats .Out of this tragedy there was some serious safety measures put in place thank god .

 

[Yoda]

I remember going to Readings old ground elm park and a steward advising a guy to put out his cigarette ,in the days when you could smoke in grounds ,as the stand we were in was made of wood, he was fighting a losing battle though ,and going to the Goldstone and seeing piles of rubbish underneath the south stand as we went to take our seats .Out of this tragedy there was some serious safety measures put in place thank god .

Saltergate used to be the same. Whole thing was made of wood.

 

[TomandJerry]

Andy Burnham, the shadow health secretary and one of the prominent campaigners for justice from the Hillsborough tragedy, has called for a fresh investigation into the Bradford City disaster after the revelations about the club’s former chairman Stafford Heginbotham’s history with major fires.

Burnham has also joined Martin Fletcher, the author of a new book about the tragedy that killed 56 football fans at Valley Parade in May 1985, in saying that the Popplewell inquiry into the fire, led by the judge Oliver Popplewell, was unsatisfactory and “conducted with undue haste”.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

That was my first thought, but perhaps you set the stage beforehand, with a pre-planned starting point, which you can easily trigger after the game. As I remember it, the South Stand burnt down shortly after the final home game of a season. Convenient for us, and made to look like a discarded fag butt etc.

So maybe the plan was to set it alight shortly after the game, but not having enough time to set up some combustibles under the stand after the final whistle, it was put there beforehand, and it was sheer bad luck that a lighted cigarette, found it's way through the stand and landed on exactly the spot, and began the fire a couple of hours early.

Absolutely horrific if found to be the case. The Bradford fire was one of the most horrific events I remember. Plane crashes, train crashes, football violence, or accidents .... It's the Bradford fire that is right up there with Hillsborough as a trauma that remains vividly etched in my mind.

Highly unlikely, i know someone that was at the ground and in that very stand for a match that took place a few games before the fire and he said that the rubbish was really bad under there and had been built up over years. He had been there over several seasons prior to the fire and there had always been a lot of rubbish under the stand which had fallen between the gaps and it had been commented upon well before the incident that it was a fire hazard and an accident waiting to happen.

Is there any truth to the insurance claims or is it a rumour / conspiracy theory that has only recently gained any attention or only recently been invented (internet gossip and speculation where guesses and false accusations quickly turn into percieved fact?)

 

[Guy Fawkes]

In my view it is exactly the time any desperate and devious person would choose, how would he convince Insurance Companies a fire had started by naturally combusting without means. The fire might have been slowly ignited sometime before the game in the hope that it would give some cause (a disguarded fag) and to take hold after the match. Also perhaps he might have felt the Ins Co might have taken your point of view and thought no one would do such a terrible thing.....well looking around the World at the moment I believe they would.

If that theory was credible, don't you think that the fire escapes and emergency exits would have been unlocked so that the punters would have an escape route.

The way football fans were thought of and treated was disgraceful back then, mainly because of the hooligan element, so things like emergency exits were padlocked to stop people getting into the ground without paying so if someone was going to deliberately start a fire in a stand full of fans of their own club or hope that one started for an insurance claim, surely they wouldn't help trap them in the ground by denying access to safety when the fire they desired finally started? (if i remember correctly, the vast majority of the fatalities were due to being trapped by the locked exits within the stands and not being on the terraces whilst the fire raged)

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

If that theory was credible, don't you think that the fire escapes and emergency exits would have been unlocked so that the punters would have an escape route.

The way football fans were thought of and treated was disgraceful back then, mainly because of the hooligan element, so things like emergency exits were padlocked to stop people getting into the ground without paying so if someone was going to deliberately start a fire in a stand full of fans of their own club or hope that one started for an insurance claim, surely they wouldn't help trap them in the ground by denying access to safety when the fire they desired finally started? (if i remember correctly, the vast majority of the fatalities were due to being trapped by the locked exits within the stands and not being on the terraces whilst the fire raged)

Unlocking all the exits for the first time in ages on the same day as a fire would arouse suspicion and point the finger straight at the chairman I would have though.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

Unlocking all the exits for the first time in ages on the same day as a fire would arouse suspicion and point the finger straight at the chairman I would have though.

But if being planned for a while (as some see to suggest) then surely you would over several games. He wouldn't have suddenly got to that particular match and only just realise he was in financial trouble and needed to make an insurance claim.

He could have waited until the crowd was leaving or had left and either set it himself or got an accomplice to set it and make it look like it could have been caused by a discarded fag. No potential fatalities and still have a plausable innocent cause. Why set it whent he crowd was there? Besides, the rubbish that caught fire had been there for a very long time so could have caught light at any time, whether deliberate or not. How would he decide it was now the time?

 

[Pavilionaire]

I find it staggering that the judge of the inquest said this morning he was unaware that the owner had a history with fires and that his businesses were in financial distress.

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

Ok the cause of the incident and the reason for the deaths of so many seems obvious but the speed of the Popplewell inquiry was interesting.

Yes the findings prompted positive outcomes that were reflected in the various regulations for sports grounds. However I'm curious that HM Coroner publicly stated that he was minded to use his powers to get manslaughter charges brought against the Club and the local authority for failing to act on formal warnings, but he failed to carry this through. Secondly why was significant forensic and technical evidence not considered by the Inquiry?

I suspect in the '80s there was still a (naïve?) public willingness to accept that authorities would be diligent in their investigations, we were less litigious and less easy for someone with concerns to get their voice heard. Forensic techniques have moved on too. However hindsight and the subsequent failings around the Hillsborough investigations have shown this faith can be misplaced. It is understandable that the media will now pose questions about the diligence of the investigation and potential for political pressure in the haste to publish findings from the Bradford Inquiry .

Fletcher is brave in publishing his book and raking over a particular personal tragedy - but there are questions worthy of objective answers. It will be interesting to see where this goes and what is revealed.

I'm mindful that the casualties largely occurred because their normal egress routes were locked and were overtaken by rapid fire spread. Those that escaped were not hindered by the perimeter fencing common at many grounds at that time, otherwise the number of casualties could have been in the hundreds.

I know contemporary stadiums can feel a bit sanitised but we owe to those at Bradford and Hillsborough not to take our safety and enjoyment for granted.

 

[Dandyman]

Judge Popplewell seems to be a little jittery:

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2011/oct/19/judge-hillsborough-families-conspiracy-theories

 

[fat old seagull]

Judge Popplewell seems to be a little jittery:

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2011/oct/19/judge-hillsborough-families-conspiracy-theories

Popplewell sounds like a pompous phart to me. To say that when you haven't lost anyone yourself, sits well with the I'm alright Jack brigade. Jittery really is too kind.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Judge Popplewell seems to be a little jittery:

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2011/oct/19/judge-hillsborough-families-conspiracy-theories

Over three years on, & Duckenfield's admissions a few weeks ago, show the 'conspiracy theories' were right.

 

[scousefan]

Just watched the video again. I really wish I hadnt. Shocking pictures of people on fire. Equally shocking that some were celebrating as the stand burnt.

We know there are some bad owners out there. However, I refuse to believe that any would deliberately set a fire on a match day.

 

[Acker79]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-30-years-after-56-died-at-Valley-Parade.html

Theresa May to consider a 'Hillsborough style review'.

 

[TomandJerry]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-30-years-after-56-died-at-Valley-Parade.html

Theresa May to consider a 'Hillsborough style review'.

Good!