Referee!

[Mustela Furo]

Out of interest, do you think we are a dirty team? I have missed only three games this season so think I have seen most of what has happened and I can't understand the number of bookings we have.

No we are not. Statistics show that in the games this season that Brighton have been involved in, the opposition have had more yellow cards than us..... and also acumulated over 100 more fouls.

Quite simply, there are more bookings in Bighton games than any other games ... and as we play in all of Brioghton's games, we therefore accumulate the most bookings.

Possibly it is our style of football leading to hacking challenges from the opposition gaining yellows, and then the referee feels he has to prove he is not biased by booking our players as well?? Other than that I can't think why our games attract card happy refs.

It certainly isn't our fouls ... yesterday's count was 8-22 in our favour

 

[briref]

interesting

Official reason was that our substitute was ready to come on so by asking Noone to leave the pitch at the closest exit, it would casue the minimum delay to the game.

Whereas there substitute was not ready, so by taking "the long way" off the pitch they had time to get their sub ready and so cause minimum delay to the game. (his watch was stopped at this time to ensure no benefit to the home side)

 

[Finchley Seagull]

No we are not. Statistics show that in the games this season that Brighton have been involved in, the opposition have had more yellow cards than us..... and also acumulated over 100 more fouls.

Quite simply, there are more bookings in Bighton games than any other games ... and as we play in all of Brioghton's games, we therefore accumulate the most bookings.

Possibly it is our style of football leading to hacking challenges from the opposition gaining yellows, and then the referee feels he has to prove he is not biased by booking our players as well?? Other than that I can't think why our games attract card happy refs.

It certainly isn't our fouls ... yesterday's count was 8-22 in our favour

This is what is frustrating. I can't understand why the referee yesterday let Coventry hack Noone down and not book them and then booked Dunk for his only foul. Where is the consistency there? It was certainly no worst than a couple of their challenges on Noone. We really seem to be getting the rough end of decisions at the moment another example is Reading where they committed 14 fouls to our 9 according to the stats and we ended with 3 booking to 1. I realise that is irrelevant if they are all bad fouls but I don't think any of them were. Sadly I think referees seem to be coming into our games with preconceptions which make them more likely to book our players.

 

[Deadly Danson]

There is no way the Burnley player reaction to Barnes tackle was a red card,[/QUOTE]

You have GOT to be joking. That was the absolute gold standard classic example of a red card offence. Barnes should have gone but having sent off Vincelot for his offence then the Burnley player HAD, HAD, HAD to go. Or are you saying trying to strangle an opponent is now allowed?

I always accept refs make mistakes and often far less than our own players but consistency and common sense has to be taught and that's all I ask. Yesterdays ref showed neither of those traits and before you say refs are not allowed to show common sense and have to apply the laws of the game I would point to all the top refs, Webb, Collina, Durkin etc having an abundance of common sense which is what sets them apart from the likes of D'Urso, Bennett, Danson and Prosser.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

The answer is simple: NEVER
23,000 un educated home fans or un educated 2,000 away fans will never all agree on the referees decision making,
Why did he book Navrro for taking a quick free kick?
Why did he make Noone walk all the way round the pitch and not the direct route?
Why was the Coventry Sub allowed to take the most direct route?
Why did only 2 Coventry players get booked when conceeded 23 fouls?
Why did Dunk get booked when we only conceeded 8 fouls?
Why did we let McSheffrey run 80 yards without closing him down ?
I could answere them all, but not going to waste my time.

All football fans should go on a referee course, and understand the LAWS of the game, before coming out with comments like "I seriously think it's about time that the fans and the clubs started a campaign to make refs more accountable.

We are all sick of it. I have never seen so many bad refs as this season (and don't forget we have D'Urso to come on Monday!). Surely they should at least be made to account for the decisions they make?"

Referee's are not perfect,Referee's do make mistakes,Referee's are always looking to improve and do the best job, and they are impartial, they dont give a toss who wins, they want to enjoy the game as much as ever one else -
every single manager,coach,physo,player,director,chairman,referee,kit man, supporter, assessor, are never always going to agree on the thousands of decisions havingto be made over 90 minutes, thats what makes the game.

All we can really hope, he get the BIG decisions right, (At Burnley he probably has) and doesnt influence the outcome of the game.

Please do me a favour, visit the Sussex County FA website, enroll on a referee course, even referee 10 x U11 games of football,(kids are OK, beware of no it all parents) for an insight in to refereeing, and the LAWS of the game.

Then we can have a serious conversation , we can get in to the mind of the referee, analysis what we think he did wrong, and we can really see if HE WAS A BAD REFEREE!

I'm afraid the attitude you show towards other peoples views in your post shows a certain arrogance that most of us see in referees.

23000 uneducated home fans etc etc is crass. Many many people like myself have not participated in any refs course but are fully aware of the LAWS (why uppercase?) of the game. To be critical about a doctor I don't need to be one!

The course itself is very short and does not in any conclude that everyone who attends will go on to become a good ref.

The problem most have is not that a ref makes a mistake or that he misses something (only give what you see) but that the accountability of refs is rubbish.

The game is only in its current guise due to the fact its a spectator sport. The players, managers, directors are all accountable to the fans. The refs are not. They can make a huge error or in fact numerous ones but are never shown to be pulled up over it, apart from that is if a bad mistake is made at a EPL game they might be relegated down the leagues, but why should a lower league game be subjected to a deficient ref?

Managers are stopped from saying anything about the ref without a reprimand from the FA. Look at Harry post Stoke/Spurs game. All he said was what was so obvious to all who had seen such a inept display from a ref. He gets a severe warning the Ref nothing.

 

[Finchley Seagull]

Your saying a referee is wrong in the job he is doing with out the proper knowledge.
Like calling out a plumber, and watching over his ever move and criticizing.
Leave them to do the f***ing job they are qualified to do.

RE: Burnley I was not there, I would say the two biggest decisions were reducing us too 9 men after 10 minutes, both of these decisions proven correct.
There is no way the Burnley player reaction to Barnes tackle was a red card,

So you think a player diving in two footed and then grabbing another player by the throat does not even deserve a talking to? Strange refereeing course you must have gone on. Also, how can not giving a penalty at 0-0 not be one of the biggest decisions? That could have changed but as you weren't there you presumably on your basis shouldn't have an opinion.

Your comments about referees being left to do their job is great if they were actually accountable for their mistakes. From what I see week in week out, they are not. In fact it takes a really terrible decision e.g. Stuart Attwell awarding a goal for Reading wrongly for anything to happen. It is all very well to say we all makes mistakes but there needs to be a better system for overturning errors as referees rarely admit they were wrong.

 

[kevo]

Y
There is no way the Burnley player reaction to Barnes tackle was a red card,

The single most ridiculous thing I've ever read on NSC - and that's saying something!

 

[Deadly Danson]

The single most ridiculous thing I've ever read on NSC - and that's saying something!

This x 1000

 

[Everest]

This x 1000

This X another 10

Surely that had to come under violent conduct?

 

[kevo]

The thing is the issue isn't even with the Burnley player not being sent off (both Sky and BBC commentators said it was surprising that it was Barnes and not the Burnley bloke that walked) - but the fact that he was not booked or even SPOKEN TO by the ref, despite lunging in two-footed and then throttling Barnes on the ground! Incredible.

 

[ChilternGull]

Perhaps it is about time the club officially complained to the FA and FL about the quality of the refs. Having watched every home game and quite a few away games this season it appears to me that persistent fouling is tolerated while a single bad challenge or infringing some of football's silly rules is not (like removing shirt after a goal celebration) is not. I think any complaint should come from the Chairman and Secretary and not Gus. Liverpool and Sunderland consistently stopped play in non threatening parts of the pitch so they could set themselves up in defence for the free kick. Consistent foul play just goes unpunished and I suspect some teams have fouling rotas to avoid the same player coming to the attention of the ref. This would explain why in most games this season we have acquired more bookings but the opposition has topped the foul count. Yesterday was a prize example. Coventry committed 22 fouls and all but 2 of them went unpunished apart from the free kick. The same player was responsible for 6 of them but was still on the pitch at the end. It also appears that shoving players over is permitted. So our options are complain about the standard of the refs or learn to be a cynical as nearly everybody else is in this League. I dread tomorrow's game as we have another poor ref who has form.

 

[ChilternGull]

The thing is the issue isn't even with the Burnley player not being sent off (both Sky and BBC commentators said it was surprising that it was Barnes and not the Burnley bloke that walked) - but the fact that he was not booked or even SPOKEN TO by the ref, despite lunging in two-footed and then throttling Barnes on the ground! Incredible.

In the Reading game CMS was grabbed around the throat right in front of the ref and nothing was done even retrospectively when the move broke down. Shortly after during another breakaway a Reading defender missed with a sliding tackle which if had made contact could have caused serious injury. Ref waved play on but not punished.

 

[army ali]

I posted the post below in another thread but thought it was apt to also post it on this one:

Referees meet every two weeks and it would be naive of us to think that they do not discuss clubs and their current disciplinary form. Gus (for the record, he is the best thing to come to the Albion for a long time), needs to build bridges quickly with referees. Brian Clough had a philosophy, get the refs on your side, do not argue with refs, any player who argued with a decision faced his wrath and Clough would not have been afraid to drop that player. We suffered yesterday because of the recent discipline problems. We did not deserve the two bookings yesterday at all. Nooney was sythed down on numerous occasions and the Coventry player just got a talking to. Nav takes a free kick a yard away and gets a yellow, Dunk goes in for a genuine tackle, also picks up a yellow. This is not rocket science. Equally, it is frustrating and understandably, emotions will run high further compounding the situation and leading to referees justifying their current 'tag' on the Albion. It happened to Leeds, Wimbledon and Joey Barton. Marked.

It needs Gus to lead us out of this and he can. He is totally passionate, however, with passion comes emotion which often leads to loss of control. I for one do not want Gus to lose his passion and commitment but he must know when to curb his frustrations, this goes for Tanno as well. Players will respond to him and act accordingly, they follow his lead whatever it may be as they are a team and back each other. Someone must take stock and change this current culture. We are much better than this.

 

[Finchley Seagull]

I posted the post below in another thread but thought it was apt to also post it on this one:

Referees meet every two weeks and it would be naive of us to think that they do not discuss clubs and their current disciplinary form. Gus (for the record, he is the best thing to come to the Albion for a long time), needs to build bridges quickly with referees. Brian Clough had a philosophy, get the refs on your side, do not argue with refs, any player who argued with a decision faced his wrath and Clough would not have been afraid to drop that player. We suffered yesterday because of the recent discipline problems. We did not deserve the two bookings yesterday at all. Nooney was sythed down on numerous occasions and the Coventry player just got a talking to. Nav takes a free kick a yard away and gets a yellow, Dunk goes in for a genuine tackle, also picks up a yellow. This is not rocket science. Equally, it is frustrating and understandably, emotions will run high further compounding the situation and leading to referees justifying their current 'tag' on the Albion. It happened to Leeds, Wimbledon and Joey Barton. Marked.

It needs Gus to lead us out of this and he can. He is totally passionate, however, with passion comes emotion which often leads to loss of control. I for one do not want Gus to lose his passion and commitment but he must know when to curb his frustrations, this goes for Tanno as well. Players will respond to him and act accordingly, they follow his lead whatever it may be as they are a team and back each other. Someone must take stock and change this current culture. We are much better than this.

Sadly I agree. To be honest, it is ridiculous that referees come into games with preconceptions. They should judge every game on its merits but that is probably a bit naive. We need to sort it out because we are definitely not a dirty team but have a ridiculously high number of bookings.

 

[BRIGHT ON Q]

the ref never effected the game for us yesterday,in fact i thought he was kind to us.

 

[Finchley Seagull]

the ref never effected the game for us yesterday,in fact i thought he was kind to us.

Out of interest, where did you get that from given they targetted Noone and basically only got one booking for about 6 fouls whereas Navarro got booked for something extremely petty and Dunk only committed one foul and was shown a yellow card?

 

[army ali]

the ref never effected the game for us yesterday,in fact i thought he was kind to us.

I sort of disagree as I thought the ref was far too lenient with the Coventry players. Nooney hacked continuously? Cov player having a go (I thought a punch was thrown at one point in the first half). If the ref had sorted out the two Cov players hacking Nooney, the game would have changed as they would have thought twice about doing the same. That is how much a ref can influence and affect the game. I understand where you are coming from ie, the overall result but the ref must take some of the 'credit' in the way the game went, especially some of the farcical decisions previously mentioned (nooney going off etc).

 

[briref]

have you seen the replay?
or just the split second at the game.
burnley player did not STRANGLE anyone
or would have recieved a red card on the day or on video evidance

There is no way the Burnley player reaction to Barnes tackle was a red card,

You have GOT to be joking. That was the absolute gold standard classic example of a red card offence. Barnes should have gone but having sent off Vincelot for his offence then the Burnley player HAD, HAD, HAD to go. Or are you saying trying to strangle an opponent is now allowed?

I always accept refs make mistakes and often far less than our own players but consistency and common sense has to be taught and that's all I ask. Yesterdays ref showed neither of those traits and before you say refs are not allowed to show common sense and have to apply the laws of the game I would point to all the top refs, Webb, Collina, Durkin etc having an abundance of common sense which is what sets them apart from the likes of D'Urso, Bennett, Danson and Prosser.[/QUOTE]

 

[BRIGHT ON Q]

fair enough,i do agree about Nooney but i thought we got a lot of the decisions yesterday.

 

[army ali]

fair enough,i do agree about Nooney but i thought we got a lot of the decisions yesterday.

Likewise, the ref did make some very strange decisions to both sides, and yes, we did get our fair share of dubious decisions, but none that warranted two yellow cards. This is what I find scandalous and it is something the club could take to the ref's association and work something out. Maybe something good might come of it all? (in a parallel universe perhaps?)