Reccession ..... Calm Down & Carry On

[sten_super]

Osborne's policies after 2 years ARE NOT working and the fact Ed Balls has been proved to be right is even more galling. As it is only 30% of the cuts have come into effect so the danger is now that Cameron and Osbornes policies could push us into a long economic depression and a lost decade(s) as per Japan.

What is it his policies are meant to be doing? As far as I can see he only has one - austerity. Btw the number I heard (from someone quite high up in the civil service) was that it was more like 12% of the cuts that had taken effect.

I think you could be right on the lost decade. It comes back to my earlier point - without a balanced budget (or very close) I don't see how the debt can be kept under control (i.e. have the economy growing at a faster rate than the amount owed), given the large balance already owed and the interest due on that. The economy was inflated thanks to structural government borrowing; removing that is clearly going to shrink the size of the economy, and limit it's ability to grow. Why that is a surprise I don't know. The question (to me) is do we continue with a softly softly approach or do you attempt to make a sharp adjustment to a sustainable standard of living (i.e. cut government expenditure to the level afforded by tax income and take the associated hit to output)? It's rather unpalatable but will it ultimately leave us any worse off?

 

[CorgiRegisteredFriend]

I think a revolution may be on the cards as so far people have been very tolerant but patience is starting to wear very thin now.

This is what happened in the 70's and the revolution was PUNK. Cant imagine what the equivalent of that would/could be in 2012 but all I will say is bring it on!

 

[Lokki 7]

I had high hopes for Cameron and Osborne but they have been a crushing dissapointment.

What policies did you expect from them that they have not delivered? And what policies did you not agree with?

 

[ROSM]

What is it his policies are meant to be doing? As far as I can see he only has one - austerity. Btw the number I heard (from someone quite high up in the civil service) was that it was more like 12% of the cuts that had taken effect.

I had heard that number too and I think it was quoted on Question Time last night.

I dont think anybody who voted Conservative can be susrprised at what they're now seeing. Clearly there was a lot of talking down of the country ahead of the election and some of the comments about our likening to Italy and Greece was overplayed. That will have hit confidence and COULD have an impact on potentail future growth.

But it isnt simply a straiught choice between increasing GDP or decreasing expenditure. There is a balance and I for one thoiught Alistair Darling had found it. The poor handling of the budget on things like the Granny Tax, Pasty Tax, Charity tax etc (all things presented on numerous occasions to Lamont, Ken Clarke, Brown and Darling and all rejected) should not cover the underlying message that many predicted a double dip and the fact its happened is not a shock. The US are not in that state yet but perhaps there has been too much spending still going on there. However the strn austerity policy doesnt seem to be the answer either.

If you owed money as a person would you stop spending money on your train fare to get to work? Its a false economy but that appears to be what the austerity plan will do.

 

[Pot noodles for everyone]

What policies did you expect from them that they have not delivered? And what policies did you not agree with?

He wants self-pity to be eligible for disability allowance.

 

[sten_super]

I had heard that number too and I think it was quoted on Question Time last night.

I dont think anybody who voted Conservative can be susrprised at what they're now seeing. Clearly there was a lot of talking down of the country ahead of the election and some of the comments about our likening to Italy and Greece was overplayed. That will have hit confidence and COULD have an impact on potentail future growth.

But it isnt simply a straiught choice between increasing GDP or decreasing expenditure. There is a balance and I for one thoiught Alistair Darling had found it. The poor handling of the budget on things like the Granny Tax, Pasty Tax, Charity tax etc (all things presented on numerous occasions to Lamont, Ken Clarke, Brown and Darling and all rejected) should not cover the underlying message that many predicted a double dip and the fact its happened is not a shock. The US are not in that state yet but perhaps there has been too much spending still going on there. However the strn austerity policy doesnt seem to be the answer either.

If you owed money as a person would you stop spending money on your train fare to get to work? Its a false economy but that appears to be what the austerity plan will do.

I certainly think that the Government (and particularly Osbourne) have made a pig's ear of the budget and the taxation policy. I don't though think that your analogy for austerity is quite right - if the choice is walking to work (and not working/earning for that hour each day that it takes you to walk) and paying to get the bus which do you use?

I wouldn't paint it as a choice between output growth and decreasing expenditure - my point is more that some degree of our current level of output is dependent upon expenditure which is funded through borrowing. Attempt to limit the borrowing by cutting that expenditure and output will fall. The economy can and will still grow, but not the part that relies upon the spending. The latest quarterly GDP figures are an example of that; construction fell partly due to cuts in government spending on infrastructure and investment projects, but output in the services sector was up. If you can introduce policies that promote growth in the strong areas while simultaneously cutting large amounts from other areas you may be able to achieve a net growth in the economy while net spending falls - but it is clear that output will fall in some parts of the economy.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

PN - Oh do ****** you utter ****. You must know everyone on here ***** hates your guts, so just do one. Every post you do is objectionable, confrontational and abusive, not just to me but to everyone. You add NOTHING to the board and never have done. I have tried to reason with you but in short you are an ****** ****** ******.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Personal abuse of any kind is not allowed on here US. Furthermore, the term you used in your first line is severly frowned upon, as a derogatory term, for people with learning disabilities. I think an apology is in order.

 

[Simster]

I had heard that number too and I think it was quoted on Question Time last night.

I dont think anybody who voted Conservative can be susrprised at what they're now seeing. Clearly there was a lot of talking down of the country ahead of the election and some of the comments about our likening to Italy and Greece was overplayed. That will have hit confidence and COULD have an impact on potentail future growth.

But it isnt simply a straiught choice between increasing GDP or decreasing expenditure. There is a balance and I for one thoiught Alistair Darling had found it. The poor handling of the budget on things like the Granny Tax, Pasty Tax, Charity tax etc (all things presented on numerous occasions to Lamont, Ken Clarke, Brown and Darling and all rejected) should not cover the underlying message that many predicted a double dip and the fact its happened is not a shock. The US are not in that state yet but perhaps there has been too much spending still going on there. However the strn austerity policy doesnt seem to be the answer either.

If you owed money as a person would you stop spending money on your train fare to get to work? Its a false economy but that appears to be what the austerity plan will do.

Nicely summarised.

The way I see it, the biggest failing of the last government was not the spending of money it didn't have, but the fact it didn't put money aside to counteract the boom and bust cycles. Plus sending us into an illegal war costing billions, obviously.

However, these austerity measures will prove to be a disaster if they are fully carried out. You can't rebuild an economy by stripping back public sector borrowing to the extent the government want to see. It's a joke, and shockingly poor economic policy.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

Personal abuse of any kind is not allowed on here US. Furthermore, the term you used in your first line is severly frowned upon, as a derogatory term, for people with learning disabilities. I think an apology is in order.

Isn't it incredible that nothing is done about the Trolls on here and when you react and snap you are in the wrong. I apologise if the term offended but I do not apologise for the personal abuse. He adds NOTHING to this board and someone had to tell him. Every post he does is abusive, confrontational and adds no worth to the discussion. His comment was unwarranted as I was just giving my views in a generic way. I did not direct anything at any person. I am just about sick of these little digs as it is done purely to inact a confrontation. I am having a good day so will not let it drag me down. No doubt I will be accused of a " me " thread again but everytime it is initiated by someone else and this was started by someone else. I am off to lunch and a walk.

Please get back to an interesting debate people.

 

[Pot noodles for everyone]

Isn't it incredible that nothing is done about the Trolls on here and when you react and snap you are in the wrong. I apologise if the term offended but I do not apologise for the personal abuse. He adds NOTHING to this board and someone had to tell him. Every post he does is abusive, confrontational and adds no worth to the discussion. His comment was unwarranted as I was just giving my views in a generic way. I did not direct anything at any person. I am just about sick of these little digs as it is done purely to inact a confrontion. I am having a good day so will not let it drag me down. No doubt I will be acused of a " me " thread again but everytime it is initiated by someone else and this was started by someone else. I am off to lunch and a walk.

Please get back to an interesting debate people.

Apology accepted.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

. I apologise if the term offended but I do not apologise for the personal abuse. . .

I'm sorry, but it's not about whether or not YOU feel that personal abuse is justified. Its simply against site rules, and if repeated will incur infractions.

If you feel you are the victim of abuse, then rather than lowering yourself to respond in kind, you need to use the reporting tools provided.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

Get back on topic and put your views across in a sensible and reasoned way without abusing anyone , insulting anyone or being confrontational with people. I know its a tough ask but you can do it. Go on give it a go.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

I'm sorry, but it's not about whether or not YOU feel that personal abuse is justified. Its simply against site rules, and if repeated will incur infractions.

If you feel you are the victim of abuse, then rather than lowering yourself to respond in kind, you need to use the reporting tools provided.

I have said it and moved on. Lets get back to topic.

 

[Pot noodles for everyone]

Get back on topics and put your views across in a sensible and reasoned way without abusing anyone , insulting anyone or being confrontational with people. I know its a tough ask but you can do it. Go on give it a go.

What did you have for lunch? Something tasty? Nice bit of cold quiche perhaps?

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

The Bank of England base rate looks like being kept at 0.5% for another 2 years. This will be 5 years at its historic low. Do people think this is good or bad for the economy ?

 

[Beach Hut]

The Bank of England base rate looks like being kept at 0.5% for another 2 years. This will be 5 years at its historic low. Do people think this is good or bad for the economy ?

Good news on the mortgage front then

 

[Simster]

The Bank of England base rate looks like being kept at 0.5% for another 2 years. This will be 5 years at its historic low. Do people think this is good or bad for the economy ?

It's a necessity, but awful for savers and people looking to retire.

 

[Dave the OAP]

What I don't fully comprehend is this Quantative Easing.

I always thought that we operated a Gold Standard which basically said you can't print money unless you have the gold to back it up.

Isn't QE the same as what teh Wiemar Republic did before the war, where they just printed money left right and centre and money became worthless?

So what happened to teh £95 billion that the B of E printed last time? Did it just go into the bank vaults to make their balance sheets look good...want it supposed to be all loaned out to business?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The Bank of England base rate looks like being kept at 0.5% for another 2 years. This will be 5 years at its historic low. Do people think this is good or bad for the economy ?

For the economy it is essential. A small rise now would destroy us.