[Football] Pretendance - THE FACTS

[worthingseagull123]

Does it really matter?

We have sell outs whereupon there are plenty of empty seats. Our ‘official’ attendences are much higher than actual bums on seats. Who really cares?

 

[LlcoolJ]

I'd be massively surprised if the caterers didn't use some sort of algorithm weeks or even months in advance - with probably major input from the club - as to what would be the likely actual attendance. From their point of view, far better to under-order and run out, rather than over-order and have to bin stuff. Totally understandable IMHO, it's never going to be an exact science.

I think you're massively overestimating the skills of Sodexo.

By the way, did you know they also run outsourced probation services (and are shit at that too)?

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Does it really matter?

We have sell outs whereupon there are plenty of empty seats. Our ‘official’ attendences are much higher than actual bums on seats. Who really cares?

Personally I don't like having my intelligence insulted. 'Attendance' means bums on seats. The club have that figure available in real time. If they want to announce how many tickets they sold, then call it something else. Simples.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

Do they really need to even announce the attendance figure at the match any more?

As others have said, the statistic makes no difference to the match day experience. They could just publish it on their website or in the next match-day programme instead for those who are interested

This seems like something that is done just because it has been done for a long time but is it really needed? I mean, how many travel to an away game and think I really need to know how many were there before I can go home?

It's not going to devalue the experience by not finding this out over the public address system just before the end of the game, (besides a lot will have already left before it's announced)

Announcing it make those in the ground start to think the game is almost over, (only from a timing point of view) so does this contribute to people deciding to leave early because it alerts them to the fact that the game is almost finished and make them more likely to depart shortly afterwards? Would more stay longer simply because they are engrossed in the game and won't necessarily realise how little time is left to play?

 

[Official Old Man]

If the attendance is tickets sold then there should be a big sign pre match saying "today you are one of 30597, thank you for attending "

 

[Triggaaar]

Burnley is a SHITHOLE. It's Reading who are TINPOT.

And they're not tinpot because of their attendances, they're tinpot because of things like a pitch invasion for finishing 7th.

 

[jasetheace]

" Tottenham's largest discrepancy was 8,686 (55,124 - 46,438) for the game with Brighton on 3 December. "

That's less than there were at the same fixture 40 years ago in a lower division.

And at that game 40 years ago, those there will swear blind that the official attendance was far less than the actual. I can feel the crush to this day!

 

[LlcoolJ]

And they're not tinpot because of their attendances, they're tinpot because of things like a pitch invasion for finishing 7th.

Yes they're just TINPOT for being Reading.

 

[Easy 10]

I'd be massively surprised if the caterers didn't use some sort of algorithm weeks or even months in advance

Going by the average number of times I trudge back from their kiosks empty handed over the course of a season, or end up with something I didn't really want, I'd have to take completely the opposite viewpoint to this and say I'd be massively surprised if they did.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Going by the average number of times I trudge back from their kiosks empty handed over the course of a season, or end up with something I didn't really want, I'd have to take completely the opposite viewpoint to this and say I'd be massively surprised if they did.

If you read the rest of that post you quoted, you wouldn't be THAT surprised

 

[bhadebenhams]

And they're not tinpot because of their attendances, they're tinpot because of things like a pitch invasion for finishing 7th.

Finishing SEVENTH with Dean Wilkins as manger was highlight of my life and i dont care if you leftie PC types say different

#KnightOut

 

[Easy 10]

If you read the rest of that post you quoted, you wouldn't be THAT surprised

Well, I'm not surprised any more. They've had 7 years now and its still never improved, so we know by now that it never will. Buying food at the Amex is only ever absolute last resort stuff anyway, so I don't lose much sleep over it, to be fair.

 

[Weststander]

BBC Sport have done a rather good long read using FOI requests to calculate the real attendances at Premier League games rather than "tickets sold".
For the survey , Spurs and Watfords least attended game was v ....Brighton.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45158878

• West Ham: Newham council says the average attendance at West Ham was 42,779 based on the 12 games it attended - which is 12,530 fans fewer than the club's season average figure of 55,309.
• Manchester City: Greater Manchester Police's average figures were 7,482 lower than club figures, again based on 12 games.
• Southampton: Hampshire Police figures were an average of 4,246 fans lower than figures issued by the club.
• Tottenham: Brent Council says crowds at Wembley Stadium were on average 3,740 less than the club's stated numbers.
• Chelsea: Hammersmith and Fulham council says its average was 3,505 fans lower than club numbers, based on six games.
• Watford: Hertfordshire Police says its average was 2,602 fans fewer than club figures, based on four games.
• Manchester United: Trafford Council and Greater Manchester Police both said United's published attendance figures matched its own, based on 12 games.

Thanks.

Some clubs have variable published attendance figures and tell the truth - Liverpool and ManU.

Others out of pride, Arsenal, ManC and West Ham, childishly won't come clean. It is of interest, because it reveals collosal numbers not attending due to disillusionment with their club and/or the greater numbers plastics at certain clubs who are wealthy enough to buy a s/t but don't attend.

So when Sullivan/Gold/Brady glow with the warmth that they have more attendees than Newcastle and Liverpool, because "they're massive", they're wrong.

 

[Weststander]

Personally I don't like having my intelligence insulted. 'Attendance' means bums on seats. The club have that figure available in real time. If they want to announce how many tickets they sold, then call it something else. Simples.

Attendance = what it says on the tin ... those there.

Anything else is simply seats sold. An economic or accounting stat.

 

[Weststander]

Citeh fans are hyper sensitive about this report. Blaming the messenger, apparently the BBC are ManU biased and are lying, as are Greater Manchester Police. A thread of 500 paranoid posts.

https://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/threads/bbc-bias-new-empty-seat-article-p39.335555/page-51

Some fans ego's are dependent on their club's image as having sell outs.

I wouldn't give a monkey's whether real Amex attendances were 30,000 or 26,000.

 

[El Presidente]

Thanks.

Some clubs have variable published attendance figures and tell the truth - Liverpool and ManU.

Or do they?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/apr/12/manchester-united-attendances-police-figures

 

[Weststander]

Or do they?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/apr/12/manchester-united-attendances-police-figures

I posted on NSC about the gaps at OT, and was told in no uncertain terms (by an obvious ManU-Albion fan, who wasn't going to come clean on that), that I was talking bullshit. Apparently its always full and I was told they always stay until final whistle.

 

[El Presidente]

I posted on NSC about the gaps at OT, and was told in no uncertain terms (by an obvious ManU-Albion fan, who wasn't going to come clean on that), that I was talking bullshit. Apparently its always full and I was told they always stay until final whistle.

I subscribed to the brilliant and scurrilous United fanzine Red Issue for years, and they conducted a FOI request a few years ago from GMP which revealed that there were normally about 7,000 tickets going unused each match.

The willy waving from those 'big' clubs that do sell out is more to do with the ease at which people can sell to football tourists (anyone who was at Anfield a few weeks ago will have noted the high number of both British and overseas fans wearing half and half scarves in the home end). The clubs where this takes place are indifferent in relation to taking this further as they know that those tourists taking the tickets are far more likely to spend large amounts in the club shop on merchandise and tat.

As others have said, the discrepancies between the two sets of figures doesn't prove any one group of supporters is any more 'loyal' than others. The reasons are far more complex than that, but simpletons will use the gaps to reinfornce their simple view of the world.

 

[Weststander]

I subscribed to the brilliant and scurrilous United fanzine Red Issue for years, and they conducted a FOI request a few years ago from GMP which revealed that there were normally about 7,000 tickets going unused each match.

The willy waving from those 'big' clubs that do sell out is more to do with the ease at which people can sell to football tourists (anyone who was at Anfield a few weeks ago will have noted the high number of both British and overseas fans wearing half and half scarves in the home end). The clubs where this takes place are indifferent in relation to taking this further as they know that those tourists taking the tickets are far more likely to spend large amounts in the club shop on merchandise and tat.

As others have said, the discrepancies between the two sets of figures doesn't prove any one group of supporters is any more 'loyal' than others. The reasons are far more complex than that, but simpletons will use the gaps to reinfornce their simple view of the world.

A good point was made on BBC, that this aids the image of s/t's being a scare commodity, to increase demand. This would obviously not be a factor where there's genuinely lengthy waiting lists (Amex, Anfield), but I would strongly suspect WHU have reason to do this.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

" Tottenham's largest discrepancy was 8,686 (55,124 - 46,438) for the game with Brighton on 3 December. "

That's less than there were at the same fixture 40 years ago in a lower division.

Less than 8,600 at the Lane in their promotion season? Really?