Police office stabbed and assailant shot outside Parliament, Parliament in lockdown

[Hamilton]

When the IRA were bombing Britain (in the main), we didn't have the internet, or 24 hour rolling news channels, which is perhaps the salient point.

They have to fill their broadcasts with something, no matter now trite it appears. How else would Kay Burley still be in gainful employment?

Agree 100%. I alluded to that in a later post.

However, in this case the media outlets have made decisions that go beyond the need for 24 hour rolling coverage. Why were BBC Breakfast reporting live from the seen the next day? Why did coverage of all other news move significantly backwards? I wonder which government departments have rushed out a little bit of bad news via press releases under the smokescreen of this event? Who knows?

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Well, if we're going to go back in history, then I'd look to the brutalism of Richard the Lionheart during his vanity project otherwise known as The Crusades. Compared to Salladin he was an equally vicious Christian Warlord driven by power and a thirst for battle.

Ironic that he spent just 6 months in England, saw himself more as a French Norman and yet we all dress up like him at the Rugby and the Football. Maybe in 500 years time we'll be playing Afghanistan at spaceball and their fans will all be dressed in the black of ISIS and we'll all be laughing and having a beer or carrot juice and talking about the good old days. And yes, I know I am being provocative, but there are precedents from history everywhere.

Richard isn't a prophet, he has no religion or religious followers in the modern world based on his actions or views. As you've pointed out history does paint him as often being brutal.

The difference is Richard isn't inspiring violence in 2017. Muhammad still is.

 

[Hamilton]

Richard isn't a prophet, he has no religion or religious followers in the modern world based on his actions or views. As you've pointed out history does paint him as often being brutal.

The difference is Richard isn't inspiring violence in 2017. Muhammad still is.

And so is Jesus to some.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

You'll never find any other religion anywhere in the world having a hold over its followers and causing them to take up dogmatic views that can not be shifted. No other religion anywhere does that. Not one. Not one single religion.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/osaama-saifi/isis-is-to-islam-what-the_b_9866208.html

There are bad muslims and there are bad christians.

Check out the Army of God's website.

PS - I agree with what you say about the lethal inextricable combination 100%.

To varying degrees although Islam has some unique characteristics.

http://time.com/4353838/islamic-exceptionalism/

Can we also agree the bad Muslims are a bigger problem/threat than the bad Christians/other religionists at this point in time?

 

[Bold Seagull]

To varying degrees although Islam has some unique characteristics.

http://time.com/4353838/islamic-exceptionalism/

Can we also agree the bad Muslims are a bigger problem/threat than the bad Christians/other religionists at this point in time?

To be honest, in terms of threat to our everyday lives, someone texting while driving is probably more of a threat than both religions put together.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

You'll never find any other religion anywhere in the world having a hold over its followers and causing them to take up dogmatic views that can not be shifted. No other religion anywhere does that. Not one. Not one single religion.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/osaama-saifi/isis-is-to-islam-what-the_b_9866208.html

There are bad muslims and there are bad christians.

Check out the Army of God's website.

PS - I agree with what you say about the lethal inextricable combination 100%.

Except the difference is that when it comes to prophets Jesus is to figures like Mandela/Ghandi as Muhammad is to a Hitler/Stalin.

Jesus actions and words always preached peace. Muhammad's did not.

 

[Hamilton]

To varying degrees although Islam has some unique characteristics.

http://time.com/4353838/islamic-exceptionalism/

Can we also agree the bad Muslims are a bigger problem/threat than the bad Christians/other religionists at this point in time?

I think we can agree that bad Muslims are a bigger problem to us right now, but that is 'us'. Perhaps bad Christians are a bigger problem to other people in other parts of the world. My fear is that as we try to isolate reasons we risk dumbing down what is driving people to act in the way we do.

This guy yesterday, when Adrian was born in Kent, he wasn't born ready to go and knife a policeman. Stuff has happened to him from a much earlier age to drive him towards a future that has included violence in his life. The guy has been convicted of GBH etc when he was younger - long before ISIS or Osama bin Laden. He's been carved out by events. We need to understand all the events in their entirety in order to do something to stop future Adrian's turning to this path.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

And so is Jesus to some.

Jesus can't inspire violence, he preached peace. There's nothing he is recorded as saying or doing that can insight another person to harm another.

Jesus is nothing like Muhammad.

 

[Hamilton]

Except the difference is that when it comes to prophets Jesus is to figures like Mandela/Ghandi as Muhammad is to a Hitler/Stalin.

Jesus actions and words always preached peace. Muhammad's did not.

We do have to remember that, just as Jesus didn't write the Bible, Muhammad didn't write the Quran.

You'll also find many Christians that believe in the Bible in its entirety and not just the New Testament.

To get to the heart of what makes these evil *******s do what they do we have to avoid falling into the trap of polarising. That's what they want us to do - in my view. If anything, we should all be taking Islam off them and celebrating it in a way that the fundamentalists hate.

And we let the internet guide us too much. Remember this photo yesterday that demonised a poor Muslim girl? Look closer. It was posted to make it look like she didn't care. Her face says something different.

My point is that these events are doing a great job of dividing us. Perhaps the terrorists are winning at present.

 

[Yoda]

We do have to remember that, just as Jesus didn't write the Bible, Muhammad didn't write the Quran.

You'll also find many Christians that believe in the Bible in its entirety and not just the New Testament.

To get to the heart of what makes these evil *******s do what they do we have to avoid falling into the trap of polarising. That's what they want us to do - in my view. If anything, we should all be taking Islam off them and celebrating it in a way that the fundamentalists hate.

And we let the internet guide us too much. Remember this photo yesterday that demonised a poor Muslim girl? Look closer. It was posted to make it look like she didn't care. Her face says something different.

My point is that these events are doing a great job of dividing us. Perhaps the terrorists are winning at present.

There was also a picture, that didn't do the rounds, of a white male in a suit doing exactly the same thing in the opposite direction. But because it doesn't serve some people's agenda's it was missed by quite a few hundred thousand people.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

To be honest, in terms of threat to our everyday lives, someone texting while driving is probably more of a threat than both religions put together.

Probably true although that may be because our security services have done such a good job thwarting numerous mass casualty plots.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Dieu et mon Droit ... the motto of English kings and queens, ever since it was adopted by King Richard I as his battle cry.

This doesn't make us all religious fundamentalists, of course. But I could understand, if it was misinterpreted by enemies of the country for their own purposes.

I know plenty of people who wince at the German phrase Mit Gott fuer Koenig und Vaterland.

 

[Hamilton]

There was also a picture, that didn't do the rounds, of a white male in a suit doing exactly the same thing in the opposite direction. But because it doesn't serve some people's agenda's it was missed by quite a few hundred thousand people.

You might mean this one.

Probably lots more. Could have been you and me.

Perhaps this guy (and the girl) had helped someone else on the bridge. Perhaps they just felt helpless.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

We do have to remember that, just as Jesus didn't write the Bible, Muhammad didn't write the Quran.

True, however there is nobody of note refuting Muhammad wasn't a warlord.

You'll also find many Christians that believe in the Bible in its entirety and not just the New Testament.

Then they aren't Christians. The basis of being a Christian one who follows the life and teachings of Christ.

To get to the heart of what makes these evil *******s do what they do we have to avoid falling into the trap of polarising. That's what they want us to do - in my view. If anything, we should all be taking Islam off them and celebrating it in a way that the fundamentalists hate.

It's too much of a backwards right wing ideology for anyone to celebrate it in the west unless someone totally ignores Muhammad which would then make it a pointless exercise.

And we let the internet guide us too much. Remember this photo yesterday that demonised a poor Muslim girl? Look closer. It was posted to make it look like she didn't care. Her face says something different.

My view isn't to attack Muslims, it's to rip Islam down. If Christianity can be targeted and attacked in words and thoughts then so to can Islam. How people react to that criticism says a lot about the ideology.

My point is that these events are doing a great job of dividing us. Perhaps the terrorists are winning at present.

It's the shitty ideology of Islam and its backwards followers that means division will always be there. Look at the impact Islam has had on scientific progress and innovation on a world stage as evidence of it's ability to kill off any chance of contributing to a modern world.

 

[Hillian1]

ISIS are all but defeated.

Breakfast TV presenter Phillip Schofield, in an act of defiance, has walked, yes WALKED across Westminster Bridge.

Such a noble, heroic and selfless act will surely not go unnoticed by those who wish to harm us.

Thank you Phil, I will personally request you receive a George Cross.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/phillip-schofield-walks-over-westminster-bridge-in-defiance-after-terror-attack-a3498361.html

 

[Hamilton]

True, however there is nobody of note refuting Muhammad wasn't a warlord.

How about the Grand Mufti of Egypt?

http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2015/03/31/no-justification-for-terror-in-any-religion/

I don't have the time to comment on the rest of your post, save to say that I share your horror at what has happened and your concern, but I think we must avoid driving ourselves to the very point of polarisation that the terrorists want by committing these crimes.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I think we can agree that bad Muslims are a bigger problem to us right now, but that is 'us'. Perhaps bad Christians are a bigger problem to other people in other parts of the world. My fear is that as we try to isolate reasons we risk dumbing down what is driving people to act in the way we do.

This guy yesterday, when Adrian was born in Kent, he wasn't born ready to go and knife a policeman. Stuff has happened to him from a much earlier age to drive him towards a future that has included violence in his life. The guy has been convicted of GBH etc when he was younger - long before ISIS or Osama bin Laden. He's been carved out by events. We need to understand all the events in their entirety in order to do something to stop future Adrian's turning to this path.

'Us' takes in quite a few people. Islamic extremism/terrorism is a worldwide problem. Africa, Europe, Russia, North America, Middle East, India, Australia etc etc.

Agree we shouldn't just focus on the religious element but it is a key factor.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

How about the Grand Mufti of Egypt?

http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2015/03/31/no-justification-for-terror-in-any-religion/

I don't have the time to comment on the rest of your post, save to say that I share your horror at what has happened and your concern, but I think we must avoid driving ourselves to the very point of polarisation that the terrorists want by committing these crimes.

Nobody cared when the world went after the Catholic Church in all manner of ways and words. It was seen as being required to get it to change its ways and to accept such attacks if it was to have any kind of place in the world.

Nobody cared what the common Catholic thought or felt. They just had to take it as their penance for being associated with the church. Abuse and all.

Now we have another large religious group who are even more backwards than the Catholics and far more extreme at the "moderates" level and yet they are being defended like it's some benevolent group of people being targeted rather than an ideology based in war and conquering to impose it on others.

There is zero place for Islam in Western society if it can't be taken to the cleaners like the RC church was.

 

[Yoda]

You might mean this one.

Probably lots more. Could have been you and me.

Perhaps this guy (and the girl) had helped someone else on the bridge. Perhaps they just felt helpless.

Yep! That's the one. As you say, they might not have any clue on what to do to help re first aid.

As such, my first response would be (as someone that does) there are enough helping (if they know what they are doing) and not to get in the way.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Yep! That's the one. As you say, they might not have any clue on what to do to help re first aid.

As such, my first response would be (as someone that does) there are enough helping (if they know what they are doing) and not to get in the way.

Plenty more- of all backgrounds- stopped to take photos or record videos. Which is nice.