PMQ's shocker

[Berty23]

Isn't the big story from PMQs today that ed did not challenge on education. The Tories announced their plans on Monday with a freeze on flat rate per pupil I.e. A cut when inflation is considered. This should have been an open goal for labour but the lack of challenge can only be because they don't have a position themselves and Cameron would have pointed this out. How in the name of all triple science can you not have an education policy a few months before an election?

 

[Surf's Up]

Isn't the big story from PMQs today that ed did not challenge on education. The Tories announced their plans on Monday with a freeze on flat rate per pupil I.e. A cut when inflation is considered. This should have been an open goal for labour but the lack of challenge can only be because they don't have a position themselves and Cameron would have pointed this out. How in the name of all triple science can you not have an education policy a few months before an election?

Especially when you've had the best part of 5 years to sort one out!!!

 

[Machiavelli]

Hmmm, not sure this really answers the point originally made. Couldn't find the original article on Full Fact, but the fact that it's taken from HMRC's Income Tax statistics suggests that it is based on only income tax. As [MENTION=13715]jimhigham[/MENTION] suggests, the rich have half decent accountants, so will likely pay a decent chunk of capital gains tax (at 28%) rather than income tax. Also, it doesn't address his suggestion that large firms (and it's ultimately shareholders that benefit from this) might be getting an easy ride from HMRC.

This government have done their best to be (or at least appear) 'worker friendly', with an increasing personal allowance and increasing the rate of capital gains tax amongst other measures. However they are also extremely 'business friendly', which manifests itself through beneficial tax arrangements and (to some extent) a relaxation of some employment restrictions.

This. And that graph doesn't exactly take account of the fact that the HMRC aren't calculating the % tax paid of tax avoiders, for the simple reason that they're avoiding tax. Bit like that big Boots bod, who is 'resident' in Monaco, and has moved his company's head-quarters to Switzerland.

 

[Machiavelli]

Isn't the big story from PMQs today that ed did not challenge on education. The Tories announced their plans on Monday with a freeze on flat rate per pupil I.e. A cut when inflation is considered. This should have been an open goal for labour but the lack of challenge can only be because they don't have a position themselves and Cameron would have pointed this out. How in the name of all triple science can you not have an education policy a few months before an election?

I agree with the first part of your analysis, but not the second. The Tories only announced their policy last week and that merely relates to education funding (although you don't have to be a genius to work out what the rest of it will be), and you seem to be admonishing Labour for not doing so at the same time or earlier. Have a look at their manifesto, which will probably be an 'aspiration' to maintain real terms education spending. Although this is vague, it's preferable to confirmation of a real-terms cut, as we've had from the Tories, isn't it?

 

[Vegas Seagull]

This. And that graph doesn't exactly take account of the fact that the HMRC aren't calculating the % tax paid of tax avoiders, for the simple reason that they're avoiding tax. Bit like that big Boots bod, who is 'resident' in Monaco, and has moved his company's head-quarters to Switzerland.

Under whose watch did Starbucks & others start coughing up?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Cameron's Eton education was in no small part funded by his father's pioneering fondness for finding ways of shifting his assets to offshore accounts, so as to avoid paying taxes.

Where does that come from? His father was a stockbroker born with deformed legs, at Blairmore House near Aberdeen.
Blairmore, the birthplace of Ian Cameron, was built by his great-great-grandfather, Alexander Geddes, who had made a fortune in the grain business in Chicago, and had returned to Scotland in the 1880s.

 

[Easy 10]

Please don't fall into this trap. PMQ's is one of the few opportunites to hold power to account in this country.

The current spectacle is just one example of the establishment flicking the V at us. They are making it the joke that it is intentionally, they are fully aware that it detatches normal people from politics, that's what they want, they have nothing to gain by normal people becoming involved in the politcal process.

We should be campaigning for reform of it. How about rather than advocating it's removal (which is of course what people in positions of power want) we concern ourselves more with making it what we want it to be rather than what they want it to be?

Fair points. Just depresses the hell out of me watching those pricks playing out their pointless weekly pantomime. I'm already thoroughly disingaged politically, and can't imagine voting for any of those tools.

 

[sten_super]

Bit like that big Boots bod, who is 'resident' in Monaco, and has moved his company's head-quarters to Switzerland.

The irony of him criticising Labour's plans, when he's relocated both himself and his business while the country is governed by the most big-business friendly administration in more than 20 years, is breathtaking.

 

[Berty23]

I agree with the first part of your analysis, but not the second. The Tories only announced their policy last week and that merely relates to education funding (although you don't have to be a genius to work out what the rest of it will be), and you seem to be admonishing Labour for not doing so at the same time or earlier. Have a look at their manifesto, which will probably be an 'aspiration' to maintain real terms education spending. Although this is vague, it's preferable to confirmation of a real-terms cut, as we've had from the Tories, isn't it?

On daily politics on Monday the labour mp would not even commit to the matching Tory pledge, let alone match the lib dem pledge to maintain real funding.

On a side note it is worth reading the greens on education. It is amusing. Maximum class sizes of 20 instead of 30. There is no research to support this and would cost loads more and we would need to find 150k more teachers. Smashing.

 

[Machiavelli]

Under whose watch did Starbucks & others start coughing up?

The prevalence of tax avoidance, by MNCs and wealthy individuals, has grown exponentially over the past few decades. The only way it will be properly confronted is if there are supranational rules that are enforceable. I wouldn't expect either New Labour or the Tories to deliver this. I do expect the pressure to build for it to be delivered. Which is a better option than cynicism.

 

[Mr Bridger]

As an aside, is there really any point to PMQ's any more ? It always descends into a tedious, bawdy, mudslinging, point-scoring, blame-shifting, smart-arsed ner-ner-ne-ner-nerrr every time. Its playground bickering dressed up as politics, and frankly I think its something of an embarrassment that this tawdry weekly spectacle gets seen worldwide taking place in what is supposedly "the Mother of all Parliaments".

Bit like most political threads on here.

 

[Machiavelli]

Where does that come from? His father was a stockbroker born with deformed legs, at Blairmore House near Aberdeen.
Blairmore, the birthplace of Ian Cameron, was built by his great-great-grandfather, Alexander Geddes, who had made a fortune in the grain business in Chicago, and had returned to Scotland in the 1880s.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/apr/20/cameron-family-tax-havens

And before you dismiss it as a left-wing plot devised by Guardianistas:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ne-tax-dodging-offshore-investment-funds.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/pol...amily-wealth-based-in-foreign-tax-havens.html

And if you want to consult probably one of the most instructive organisations on tax(-and-spending) affairs, see:

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/...alk-about-david-camerons-fathers-tax-affairs/

 

[Machiavelli]

On daily politics on Monday the labour mp would not even commit to the matching Tory pledge, let alone match the lib dem pledge to maintain real funding.

They're not going to do that are they, just so there's a point of difference between them and the Tories. With the Tories, you know that education spending will decrease. With Labour, it's currently uncertain (and, as indicated, I suspect that it will remain as such even once they're announced their manifesto).

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

The tax take has fallen because everyone is on zero hours contracts, working 'zero hours', and therefore not even appearing on HMRC's radar.

Race to the bottom 'innit'. Everyone employed, but they're all earning diddly squat, so no-ones happy - Govt., Workers, HMRC, Businesses (because no-ones got any money to spend, hence rise of Lidl, Aldi, and collapse of Tesco shares). It's a vicious circle that will be even more vicious if/when Tories get into power.

 

[maltaseagull]

It's also strange that despite more people than ever before being in work, thanks to the Tories, tax receipts are falling ? Where is all the money going Mr Cameron ?

Low wages versus increased personal allowances?

Bit of a miscalculation methinks

 

[maltaseagull]

Bit like most political threads on here.

Absolutely correct. But you can't resist it !

 

[Ernest]

Not like the wonderful Blairs eh.

Typical Tory response, never answer a question or a point. Are you David Cameron ?

 

[Lower West Stander]

The tax take has fallen because everyone is on zero hours contracts, working 'zero hours', and therefore not even appearing on HMRC's radar.

Race to the bottom 'innit'. Everyone employed, but they're all earning diddly squat, so no-ones happy - Govt., Workers, HMRC, Businesses (because no-ones got any money to spend, hence rise of Lidl, Aldi, and collapse of Tesco shares). It's a vicious circle that will be even more vicious if/when Tories get into power.

Absolutely!

Because if Labour win everything will be ok.

If only it was as simple as you make out......

 

[yxee]

The tax take has fallen because everyone is on zero hours contracts, working 'zero hours', and therefore not even appearing on HMRC's radar.

Race to the bottom 'innit'. Everyone employed, but they're all earning diddly squat, so no-ones happy - Govt., Workers, HMRC, Businesses (because no-ones got any money to spend, hence rise of Lidl, Aldi, and collapse of Tesco shares). It's a vicious circle that will be even more vicious if/when Tories get into power.

Wasn't it the Lib Dems that forced the 10k tax threshold?

 

[Triggaaar]

Typical Tory response, never answer a question or a point. Are you David Cameron ?

The answer was fairly obvious. You're saying that the company that the wife of the prime minister works for represent the tories, which is nonsense. If you want to judge the tories bases on the company the wife of the prime minister works for then you should be more than happy to judge labour on their ex-prime minister, who is a completely self-centered scumbag.