Player ratings vs Rotherham

[MattBackHome]

I cannot believe the criticism of Bong shown on here. To me he is getting back to his best and performed well generally last night.

I agree. He had a good game in my view.

 

[Kaiser_Soze]

Completely untrue. He went past a player 2 or three times and was brought down for free kicks. How that is a weakness on his part is beyond me. He also beat 1 or 2 players to reach the byline for a cross.

From where I sit, WSU in line with the edge of the North Stand penalty box, he had a poor game. He may have gone past players a couple of times but a lot of the time he did a little trick and got dispossessed. He either hasn't got the pace anymore, or hasn't got faith in his ability to use it without aggravating one of his numerous groin or hamstring injuries. Wouldn't be disappointed if we released him at the end of the season regardless of how we do.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Maenpaa 8
Rosenior 7
Bruno 8
Dunk 8
Bong 6
Knockaert 9
Norwood 6
Stephens 7
Murphy 6
Murray 8
Hemed 7

Baldock 5
Lualua 5

 

[JBizzle]

Maenpaa - 8 - Some superb stops, great distribution, commanding. When was the last time we had as good a number 2?

Rosenior - 7.5 - Great cross for Murray's goal. Hard worker and gives everything, everytime.
Bruno - 8 - Are we sure he's not a centre back? Ludicrous.
Dunk - 8 - Some lovely runs, commanding presence. Really on his game at the moment
Bong - 7.5 - Looking back to his best

Knockaert - 8.5 Scintillating as usual
Stephens - 7.5 Back in the side, back on the ball.
Norwood - 7 - A very tidy debut. A couple of dodgy passes but will grow nicely
Murphy - 6 - Great 1st half, literally forgot about him in the second

Hemed - 7.5 - An absolute workhorse. Some things didn't come off, but starting to get a good relationship with the Muz.
Murray - 9 - Big, fit, holds up play like a boss. Tracked back. Scored a lovely goal. Won the pen. The difference.

Subs - 5

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

From where I sit, WSU in line with the edge of the North Stand penalty box, he had a poor game. He may have gone past players a couple of times but a lot of the time he did a little trick and got dispossessed. He either hasn't got the pace anymore, or hasn't got faith in his ability to use it without aggravating one of his numerous groin or hamstring injuries. Wouldn't be disappointed if we released him at the end of the season regardless of how we do.

I know it's always a touchy subject on here, but the statistics from the game suggest he wasn't dispossessed once. In fact, the statistics suggest that you were watching a different Bong performance altogether. He completed all of his dribbling attempts, he had the second most accurate key passes of all of our players, a pass completion rate of 88% of his 59 passes (beaten only by Norwood, Stephens and Murphy of the starters), won both of his tackles, got an assist, completed 3 of his 6 crosses, didn't commit a foul all game...

I'm not entirely sure what more you want from the guy.

 

[pb21]

Maenpaa 7
Rosenior 7
Bruno 8
Dunk 7
Bong 8
Knockaert 8
Norwood 6
Stephens 7
Murphy 6
Murray 8
Hemed 7

Baldock 5
Lualua 5

 

[Kaiser_Soze]

I know it's always a touchy subject on here, but the statistics from the game suggest he wasn't dispossessed once. In fact, the statistics suggest that you were watching a different Bong performance altogether. He completed all of his dribbling attempts, he had the second most accurate key passes of all of our players, a pass completion rate of 88% of his 59 passes (beaten only by Norwood, Stephens and Murphy of the starters), won both of his tackles, got an assist, completed 3 of his 6 crosses, didn't commit a foul all game...

I'm not entirely sure what more you want from the guy.

I was talking about KLL.

I seem to be in the minority that thought Bong had a great game. His touch is superb and his link up play with knockaert is immense.

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

I was talking about KLL.

I seem to be in the minority that thought Bong had a great game. His touch is superb and his link up play with knockaert is immense.

Oh, apologies. I read the last page and made the assumption you were talking about Bong. I agree with you.

I also agree with you re KLL, and that's from the North Stand. Poor is probably harsh, but he certainly didn't do anything to make him worthy of a starting spot moving forward.

 

[goldstone]

I know it's always a touchy subject on here, but the statistics from the game suggest he wasn't dispossessed once. In fact, the statistics suggest that you were watching a different Bong performance altogether. He completed all of his dribbling attempts, he had the second most accurate key passes of all of our players, a pass completion rate of 88% of his 59 passes (beaten only by Norwood, Stephens and Murphy of the starters), won both of his tackles, got an assist, completed 3 of his 6 crosses, didn't commit a foul all game...

I'm not entirely sure what more you want from the guy.

Thank you for unearthing those. I thought he had a decent game ... much better than some on here would accept. It will be good if he's getting back to last season's form because however good a footballer Liam Rosenior is, I don't want him replacing Bong at LB when Goldson is fit. We need a left-footer at LB

 

[Ninja Elephant]

I know it's always a touchy subject on here, but the statistics from the game suggest he wasn't dispossessed once. In fact, the statistics suggest that you were watching a different Bong performance altogether. He completed all of his dribbling attempts, he had the second most accurate key passes of all of our players, a pass completion rate of 88% of his 59 passes (beaten only by Norwood, Stephens and Murphy of the starters), won both of his tackles, got an assist, completed 3 of his 6 crosses, didn't commit a foul all game...

I'm not entirely sure what more you want from the guy.

That's one of those statistics vs the game you watched argument. Some would say that scoring a goal means you had a good game, but I think generally it would be agreed that it's about the whole thing rather than just one moment - however important.

Personally, I think Bong is a decent left back and solid enough - he's picked up a couple of assists in the last couple of games, can't ask for more when the team is also keeping a clean sheet. But he could be upgraded, that's the point I'd make. And that Rosenior will switch sides when Bruno can return to right back and Goldson is fit again.

 

[Baaaald]

Amazed Lua Lua averages a 6. When Solly is back he won't get a look in. Just doesn't offer enough... Good at diving around and winning us free kicks mind

 

[BensGrandad]

I think that Bruno has done the job of a centre back well but my concern is that instead of attacking the ball as Dunk does he lets it bounce first which a full back will do to play it wide and a forward like Murray or Rhodes even Hooper would see this and get in first and punish him.

 

[Lifelong Supporter]

Bong will keep the shirt whilst fit. Leroy is not as good a left back. Players like Bong tend to be appreciated when they are out of the team. He is tough, he is determined and he is not afraid to go for the incisive cross or pass. He made the important first for Knocky against Forest, when the game was very even. He is not always pretty but he is very effective and certainly winds the opposition up. He does not give an inch.

 

[Lifelong Supporter]

I think that Bruno has done the job of a centre back well but my concern is that instead of attacking the ball as Dunk does he lets it bounce first which a full back will do to play it wide and a forward like Murray or Rhodes even Hooper would see this and get in first and punish him.

I thought the idea is that Dunk does the aggressive challenging bit and Bruno does the classy clear up. They have worked extremely well together so far and there is no way Goldson (or anybody else for that matter) will come straight back in the way things are going.

 

[BensGrandad]

I thought the idea is that Dunk does the aggressive challenging bit and Bruno does the classy clear up. They have worked extremely well together so far and there is no way Goldson (or anybody else for that matter) will come straight back in the way things are going.

We must just disagree as I have said a decent striker, that we havent faced much yet, would capitalise on the moment Bruno lets the ball bounce.

 

[portslade seagull]

Can you all please take a few marks away from Knocky. Bigging him up is not the best idea with those Geordie boys sniffing round. He had a terrible game obviously

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

That's one of those statistics vs the game you watched argument. Some would say that scoring a goal means you had a good game, but I think generally it would be agreed that it's about the whole thing rather than just one moment - however important.

Personally, I think Bong is a decent left back and solid enough - he's picked up a couple of assists in the last couple of games, can't ask for more when the team is also keeping a clean sheet. But he could be upgraded, that's the point I'd make. And that Rosenior will switch sides when Bruno can return to right back and Goldson is fit again.

I'd be surprised to see him lose his place, to be honest. I don't think Rosenior at left back is an upgrade on Bong, who is a natural in that position. And all of our players, by default almost, could be upgraded hypothetically.the likelihood is, in reality, that Rosenior, Bong and Bruno will probably share the full back positions throughout the season depending on who else is available.

As for the statistics argument, sometimes the statistics simply override someone's opinion and show it to be bollocks. If someone is sitting there complaining that player X has lost the ball too much and the statistics prove otherwise, then there is no argument to be had - their opinion is wrong and their subjective watching of the game is flawed. Unfortunately, none of us like being told we're wrong, even when there are hard facts to prove otherwise.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

I'd be surprised to see him lose his place, to be honest. I don't think Rosenior at left back is an upgrade on Bong, who is a natural in that position. And all of our players, by default almost, could be upgraded hypothetically.the likelihood is, in reality, that Rosenior, Bong and Bruno will probably share the full back positions throughout the season depending on who else is available.

As for the statistics argument, sometimes the statistics simply override someone's opinion and show it to be bollocks. If someone is sitting there complaining that player X has lost the ball too much and the statistics prove otherwise, then there is no argument to be had - their opinion is wrong and their subjective watching of the game is flawed. Unfortunately, none of us like being told we're wrong, even when there are hard facts to prove otherwise.

For me there isn't any question - Rosenior is superior to Bong and that's really the end of it for me but I like Bong, and he adds natural balance. I just think Rosenior's game is better.

And there's a reason that not everyone plays moneyball. If you're a moneyball person, then stats matter and performances don't. But personally, I think performances do matter and if a player statistically had a great game but watching it, I thought he didn't - I don't care what stats you provide. Brentford do, and good luck to them, but it's not for me.

 

[fat old seagull]

Well if I was a young hottie..(.and female)! I'd offer to have Knockies babies a 9 at least.
Bongo not so good tonight ...(no baby making for him) ......he'd be pleased to know!
And pleased to agree that Norwood is a fair acquisition. All in all not a bad effort, but should have had 5 at least.

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

For me there isn't any question - Rosenior is superior to Bong and that's really the end of it for me but I like Bong, and he adds natural balance. I just think Rosenior's game is better.

And there's a reason that not everyone plays moneyball. If you're a moneyball person, then stats matter and performances don't. But personally, I think performances do matter and if a player statistically had a great game but watching it, I thought he didn't - I don't care what stats you provide. Brentford do, and good luck to them, but it's not for me.

We'll agree to disagree re the left-back spot. I don't see much between Bong and Rosenior, particularly in that position, but I think Bong offers a more natural outlet, particularly if we have an inverted wide player in front of him. We become far too narrow down the left with Rosenior and one of Murphy or Skalak, at least in my opinion, but we'll see what Hughton does. I wouldn't have a problem with either in there.

I've never said performances don't matter. But I also find it hilarious that some people are so dismissive of statistics (and, as I previously stated, it's because those stats often disprove what they have decided to make fact but which is, in reality, just their wrong subjective opinion). Do you genuinely think the Brighton staff don't look at stats from training sessions, for transfers etc? Of course they do...Leicester won the league with what you class as a "moneyball" strategy, but in reality, all clubs do it now and they'd be stupid not to as there are so many KPIs that help teams evaluate the progress of players.

Regarding my initial point, it was in reply to a very specific situation. I thought the initial poster was complaining about the amount Bong had been dispossessed (they weren't, they were complaining about Lua Lua being dispossessed). My initial reaction was "I don't remember him being dispossessed at all, so that seems like a harsh criticism". I looked at the stats and that proved to be the case. So in reality, my evaluation of his performance wasn't based around stats at all, but they are there to prove or disprove certain things on a football pitch and that instance was a fine example of when they could have been used. If you choose to overlook facts in such an instance because of your subjective opinion, then fair enough, but it lessens your argument rather substantially.