Panorama tonight: investigation into FIFA (Merged)

[Tricky Dicky]

One of the worst aspects about the process is that there are 2 bids with the 2022 World Cup on the table as well. That gives all sorts of scope for 'horse-trading' and 'double-dealing'. England may find that we are simply too clean and honest to ever get the World Cup again whilst Blatter and the present regime remains in place.

I fully expect Russia and then Qatar to be the next two hosts.

I think they have admiited that they were wrong about joining the bids together and that it won't happen again. You actually don't need horse-trading if people like Warner having 3 votes - what's that about ? He seems to be a despicable man, with a huge amount of power, and I have no idea how he got to be there in the first place.

 

[glasfryn]

FIFA .................crooks and gangsters

 

[Lady Whistledown]

I understand why some people are disappointed by the timing of this bid and worried it would jeopardise England's chances. But frankly, if FIFA were actually to let such an important decision be affected in some way by a 30 minute BBC documentary, then it simply illustrates how what a bunch of unprincipled, bitter, shameless old shysters they really are. The World Cup should be hosted by the country who has proved they have or can provide the infrastructure, finances and ability to host the best possible competition, not the country who has pissed off the grasping crooks on their committee the least. A BBC report should have no impact whatsoever, and if it does then that speaks a thousand words.

I'm not sure if we should be pulling out because of this- frankly I suspect Russia are nailed on anyway- but, playing devil's advocate here- when would the best time have been for the BBC to have raised this issue? After the bidding process has been decided? That would just make us look like sore losers. Even if it had been shown months ago, it would no doubt have niggled away at the sensitivities of those at FIFA with the most to lose. While if they hadn't shown it at all it would essentially have made us complicit in what's going on- as if to suggest that corruption by the decision makers is fine so long as we get what we want out of it. It's not fine, it's disgusting and it's high time something was done.

Don't think the FA aren't aware of what goes on. There's no way they could build such a strong case without at least a few sweeteners going down, perhaps on a much smaller scale, but they know what FIFA expect. I seem to recall there was some minor scandal a few months back when it was revealed that the FA gave all the delegates Mulberry handbags (hey, let's suck up to the wives and mistresses too) valued at something like £250 each. As soon as it came to public attention, that devious shit Jack Warner leapt up to claim the moral high ground, gave the handbag back (which he'd originally accepted quite willingly) and stated that he felt it shameful for England's bid team to offer such gifts. Like he's never accepted any gifts, including those of much greater value, before in his career.

The whole process stinks, and if we don't win it, well I can live with that. I'm confident Russia have always been the likely winners, because they are richer and are better than we are at greasing the palms of the people who get to make these decisions. Don't blame the BBC for this: they're just a convenient excuse for Blatter and his mates to hide behind.

(Interesting, isn't it, how Blatter etc have never, ever sued Andrew Jennings or indeed any other journalist for repeatedly perpetuating these supposedly untrue allegations against them?)

 

[Gully]

I fully expect Russia and then Qatar to be the next two hosts.

If Qatar were to host the World Cup it would mean having it during our winter...the temperatures there in the summer months, June to August, are usually around 40-45C or more during the day and 25-30C if you are lucky through the night...I wouldn't fancy playing football in those conditions.

 

[Sam Ovett]

How funny would it be if we actually got the World Cup now?

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Back in 2009...

Casting himself as a “critical friend”, Warner said: “My colleagues [on Fifa’s executive committee] are saying very quietly that the guys who are coming to them are lightweight. This is the type of thing that loses you a bid."

Lightweight in the sense that they are not carrying heavy goody bags?

 

[Gwylan]

If Qatar were to host the World Cup it would mean having it during our winter..

There's no way that it would be in the winter - could you imagine the whingeing from Prem managers if they were to lose most of their squads for two months?

I see that the US are hot favourites for 2022 anyway.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I understand why some people are disappointed by the timing of this bid and worried it would jeopardise England's chances. But frankly, if FIFA were actually to let such an important decision be affected in some way by a 30 minute BBC documentary, then it simply illustrates how what a bunch of unprincipled, bitter, shameless old shysters they really are. The World Cup should be hosted by the country who has proved they have or can provide the infrastructure, finances and ability to host the best possible competition, not the country who has pissed off the grasping crooks on their committee the least. A BBC report should have no impact whatsoever, and if it does then that speaks a thousand words.

I'm not sure if we should be pulling out because of this- frankly I suspect Russia are nailed on anyway- but, playing devil's advocate here- when would the best time have been for the BBC to have raised this issue? After the bidding process has been decided? That would just make us look like sore losers. Even if it had been shown months ago, it would no doubt have niggled away at the sensitivities of those at FIFA with the most to lose. While if they hadn't shown it at all it would essentially have made us complicit in what's going on- as if to suggest that corruption by the decision makers is fine so long as we get what we want out of it. It's not fine, it's disgusting and it's high time something was done.

Don't think the FA aren't aware of what goes on. There's no way they could build such a strong case without at least a few sweeteners going down, perhaps on a much smaller scale, but they know what FIFA expect. I seem to recall there was some minor scandal a few months back when it was revealed that the FA gave all the delegates Mulberry handbags (hey, let's suck up to the wives and mistresses too) valued at something like £250 each. As soon as it came to public attention, that devious shit Jack Warner leapt up to claim the moral high ground, gave the handbag back (which he'd originally accepted quite willingly) and stated that he felt it shameful for England's bid team to offer such gifts. Like he's never accepted any gifts, including those of much greater value, before in his career.

The whole process stinks, and if we don't win it, well I can live with that. I'm confident Russia have always been the likely winners, because they are richer and are better than we are at greasing the palms of the people who get to make these decisions. Don't blame the BBC for this: they're just a convenient excuse for Blatter and his mates to hide behind.

(Interesting, isn't it, how Blatter etc have never, ever sued Andrew Jennings or indeed any other journalist for repeatedly perpetuating these supposedly untrue allegations against them?)

Just what I was trying to say but much more eloquently put

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Back in 2009...

Casting himself as a “critical friend”, Warner said: “My colleagues [on Fifa’s executive committee] are saying very quietly that the guys who are coming to them are lightweight. This is the type of thing that loses you a bid."

Lightweight in the sense that they are not carrying heavy goody bags?

Interestingly, just before Warner huffily rejected the Mulberry bag for Mrs Warner (perhaps it wasn't expensive enough for his tastes?) he had publicly commented that it reflected badly on England's bid that they had not provided goody bags for delegates at a conference held in London, in contrast to the Australian bid team who gave out bags containing God knows what.

Jack's view on this? 'Why isn’t there a bag for England? People are looking at these things and asking themselves questions.'

What an shamelessly odious :tosser he is.

 

[Lady Whistledown]

I see that the US are hot favourites for 2022 anyway.

Which is crap in itself, because they only hosted it in 1994. If you're going to give it to a nation that's not in the Middle Eastern desert, at least let Australia have a go. They have a history of organising great sporting events, and I'm sure they'd appreciate it more than the USA would.

Then again, the USA comes under CONCACAF, which is led by....oh! Jack Warner and Chuck "DLT" Blazer

 

[Gully]

Do you know something, the more I hear about some of the people deciding who should have the World Cup the less I want it to come here...who would want a tournament where there was always doubt about whether bungs were paid to win the vote.

Clean up FIFA first...even if it means being as destructive towards it as we can...then lets have the World Cup afterwards.

 

[Gully]

I think Edna is right, the Aussies would put on a brilliant World Cup...the Olympics in Sydney is widely regarded as one of the best...why not let them have a go with football?

 

[ROSM]

I understand why some people are disappointed by the timing of this bid and worried it would jeopardise England's chances. But frankly, if FIFA were actually to let such an important decision be affected in some way by a 30 minute BBC documentary, then it simply illustrates how what a bunch of unprincipled, bitter, shameless old shysters they really are. The World Cup should be hosted by the country who has proved they have or can provide the infrastructure, finances and ability to host the best possible competition, not the country who has pissed off the grasping crooks on their committee the least. A BBC report should have no impact whatsoever, and if it does then that speaks a thousand words.

I'm not sure if we should be pulling out because of this- frankly I suspect Russia are nailed on anyway- but, playing devil's advocate here- when would the best time have been for the BBC to have raised this issue? After the bidding process has been decided? That would just make us look like sore losers. Even if it had been shown months ago, it would no doubt have niggled away at the sensitivities of those at FIFA with the most to lose. While if they hadn't shown it at all it would essentially have made us complicit in what's going on- as if to suggest that corruption by the decision makers is fine so long as we get what we want out of it. It's not fine, it's disgusting and it's high time something was done ?)

The best time to show it was when they did previously - 3 years ago, 6 years ago, 9 years ago. if they had something new then by all means do it now. but they didn't.

also I do believe that in a knife edge vote that this will impact some of our potential supporters. that's not being crooked that's being human. have you ever in your life let your opinion of someone who'd done w perceived wrong to a friend or colleague of yours affect a decision you've later made?

 

[Lady Whistledown]

The best time to show it was when they did previously - 3 years ago, 6 years ago, 9 years ago. if they had something new then by all means do it now. but they didn't.

also I do believe that in a knife edge vote that this will impact some of our potential supporters. that's not being crooked that's being human. have you ever in your life let your opinion of someone who'd done w perceived wrong to a friend or colleague of yours affect a decision you've later made?

Fair enough, but I don't think it is or has ever been a knife edge vote, because so much has been said about FIFA in recent years that it's hard to believe more than the odd few are actually on the level. One way or another, there's an awful lot on that committee that have been tainted in some form: whether it be taking bribes, making outrageously offensive comments towards women, Jews or different racial groups, dodgy political involvement in their own countries, flogging tickets on the black market, accepting gifts or taking the piss when it comes to hospitality.

Even the ones who don't seem to be outwardly bent come across as weak or easily influenced. Remember the year they mysteriously awarded the 2006 World Cup to Germany, when pretty much everyone outside that country assumed South Africa would get it? It came down to one vote, because the New Zealand delegate bottled out, claiming he felt unduly pressured. By whom?? Nobody ever really got to the bottom of that.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

The best time to show it was when they did previously - 3 years ago, 6 years ago, 9 years ago. if they had something new then by all means do it now. but they didn't.

Given FIFA haven't taken any real action when it was raised in the past then it should be raised again and again and again and again until Blatter and his cronies are in jail or at least out of FIFA.

also I do believe that in a knife edge vote that this will impact some of our potential supporters.

Here's hoping !

 

[Lady Whistledown]

The FIFA Executive Committee, for those who are interested:

Sepp Blatter (President)
Swiss businessman, never played football at any decent level, once claimed women footballers should wear tighter shorts and low cut shirts to attract male spectators. Used to be a member of the World Society of Friends of Suspenders, an organisation which tried to stop women replacing suspender belts with pantyhose. Apparently.

Julio Grondona (Argentina) Senior Vice President
Once claimed ‘I do not believe a Jew can ever be a referee at that level (Argentine Premier League) because it’s hard work and, you know, Jews don’t like hard work’ . Recently alleged to have threatened to shoot Oscar Ruggeri, former Argentina player, in the leg and stab his daughter because they insulted him.

Issa Hayatou (Cameroon) Vice President
Subject of BBC's bribery report, alleged to have accepted FF100,000 from ISL, now under investigation by the International Olympic Committee of which he is also a member.

Chung Mong Joon (South Korea) Vice President
Probably drives a Hyundai, but I can't actually find much else wrong with him.

Jack Warner (Trinidad & Tobago) Vice President
President of CONCACAF, promised T&T players bonuses for reaching 2006 World Cup finals which have never been paid, publicly linked to the illegal reselling of hundreds of World Cup tickets via his own family's company: fined $1 million by FIFA and has only ever repaid $250,000. Previously claimed "nobody in Europe likes England", and "for Europe, England is an irritant", reportedly asked the head of the Scottish FA to make a cheque in return for Scotland playing T&T in a friendly out to him personally and not the federation bank account. Once said "no foreigner, particularly a white foreigner, will come to my country and harass me" in response to being investigated by journalist Andrew Jennings, followed by "Go f*** yourself"

Angel Maria Villar (Spain) Vice President
Recently seen passing a note to Mohammed Bin Hamman of Qatar at an executive meeting, reading "Congratulations! We are going to win!"

Reynald Temarii (Tahiti ) Vice President
Recently suspended from the World Cup voting process after reportedly asking for money from bidding nations.

Michel Platini (France) Vice President
Once reported to UEFA for an unsavoury post match incident involving Jean-Marie Pfaff, a particularly rare breed of orchid and a Thompson's gazelle. Likes wearing berets.

Geoff Thompson (England) Vice President
Chosen instead of SFA candidate John McBeth, who was blocked by FIFA after accusing Sepp Blatter and others of corruption

 

[Barrel of Fun]

The FIFA Executive Committee, for those who are interested:

Chung Mong Joon (South Korea) Vice President
Probably drives a Hyundai, but I can't actually find much else wrong with him.

Making Sepp feel better after a tough month for Fifa's image: Hyundai chairman Chung Mong-koo – renewing his firm's official Fifa partner status until 2022, backing Sepp's "vision for a better world". Sepp: "I am extremely happy... we have a shared philosophy!" (Chung's philosophy highlights: three-year suspended sentence in 2008 for fraud, breach of trust and embezzling £53m to use for bribing politicians and officials, plus a £40m fine last February for "serious managerial misconduct".)

• Also last week: Chung Mong-joon – Mong-koo's brother and Fifa's vice-president – assesses the suspensions and fines given to the executives caught in the Sunday Times sting. "Personally? I believe those measures were excessive."

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Also featuring on the cuddly FIFA committee:

Amos Adamu (Nigeria)
Currently suspended from voting over allegation he asked for £500,000 to influence the 2018 vote. Was investigated and mysteriously redeployed from his role at the Nigerian National Sports Commission in 2008.

Ricardo Teixeira (Brazil)
Named by Panorama as having taken bribes from ISL in relation to television rights to previous World Cups. Former son in law of Joao Havelange, who was himself previously linked to corruption & bribery allegations when in charge of FIFA before Blatter.

Mohammed Bin Hammam (Qatar)
See Angel Maria Villar

Chuck Blazer (USA)
Notoriously close to Warner, granted this isn't a crime, but it does leave him open to being pressured.Once tried to get Michael Zen-Ruffinen suspended because he supported a new candidate for the CONCACAF presidency, ahead of Warner. In 1996 and 1998 alleged to have knowingly allowed firstly the girlfriend of a Jamaican FA member and latterly another Jamaican delegate to illegally stand in for Haitian delegates during a CONCACAF vote. Blazer's appearance before a New York court in relation to a case brought by Mastercard against FIFA was described by the judge thus: "his testimony was generally without credibility based on his attitude and demeanour and the evasiveness of his answers". She also rejected part of his evidence as "fabricated".

Nicolas Leoz (Paraguay)
Subject of Panorama bribery allegations

Vitaly Mutko (Russia)
Alleged to have claimed for 97 breakfasts, totalling $4,500, during his 20 day stay at the Winter Olympics in Vancouver, also spending $1,499 per night in the hotel and spending twelve times his official limit. Recently claimed English football is corrupt...

Jerome Valcke (France)
Heavily criticised for his role in the failed attempt by FIFA to secure a rights deal with Visa at the expense of original partners Mastercard. Accused by the judge of double dealing and allowing false statements to be made.





Makes you feel confident in the whole process, doesn't it?

 

[Lady Whistledown]

Making Sepp feel better after a tough month for Fifa's image: Hyundai chairman Chung Mong-koo – renewing his firm's official Fifa partner status until 2022, backing Sepp's "vision for a better world". Sepp: "I am extremely happy... we have a shared philosophy!" (Chung's philosophy highlights: three-year suspended sentence in 2008 for fraud, breach of trust and embezzling £53m to use for bribing politicians and officials, plus a £40m fine last February for "serious managerial misconduct".)

• Also last week: Chung Mong-joon – Mong-koo's brother and Fifa's vice-president – assesses the suspensions and fines given to the executives caught in the Sunday Times sting. "Personally? I believe those measures were excessive."

Thank you, I knew there was something on him.

Out of the 25 members on the committee, I have, without too much digging, found some sort of controversy surrounding thirteen of them (not including Platini as being French is not a crime, and Thompson who can't really be blamed for McBeth pissing off FIFA). It's not a good ratio, is it?

 

[Gully]

.

Makes you feel confident in the whole process, doesn't it?

We trust this lot with running World football...all fool us...I would feel happier if Walt Disney ran the show, FIFA is little better than a Mickey Mouse outfit!