[Travel] P and O

[Herr Tubthumper]

Just seen a Facebook post from an ex friend. Habitual Tory voter and Brexiteer. Hopping mad about this because he used to work on the ferries.

The empathy always kicks in as soon as it gets close to home. I do wish he’d employed some of those critical faculties his last few trips to the ballot box.

Sigh!

Corrected for you.

 

[beorhthelm]

RMT have been very vocal before the latest news that the P&O decision to register ships in Cyprus because of Brexit was pure opportunism and more to do with them being able to recruit cheap EU labour not subject to our national minimum wage or having to pay tax even though they will work here.
RMT and others have been using the Irish Ferries, now operating out of Dover already using cheap agency workers mostly from Eastern Europe, as an example of what lies in store now they too register in EU Cyprus, use cheap EU labour with some alleged shocking worker conditions.
There is much more to this story than simply jumping into the usual divisive camps of defending Brexit or blaming Brexit and thinking the EU is wonderful for protecting seafaring worker jobs and conditions.

https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-demands-action-on-seafarer-jobs/
https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-on-pando-flagging-out-dover-calais-fleet/
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2021/11/white-cliffs-of-dover-shipping-companies-labor-conditions

emerging theres been an ongoing problem with the ferries, last link is particularly illuminating about industry practice.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

The people are thick.

"You lost, get over it" will be the comment from the pracning ninny if he pops onto this thread. Been very quiet for a while now, though.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Not happening in France because the billionaire filth know French workers would shut down the ships, the ports and the motoways leading to them, and a lot of French people would stand in solidarity with them.

And, simply, the laws won't allow it. European laws, with French embellishments.

The sort of laws and embellishments we are now free from, having left the EU. We now have greater freedom. Lovely freedom.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Natalie Cecilia Elphicke, MP for Dover, describes the action of P+O as a 'knife in the back'.

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

Exactly the same thing happened with Irish Ferries in 2005 - they sacked their entire workforce who were unionised and on trade union rates of pay - and employed workers from Latvia at the Latvian minimum wage of €2 per hour.

Despite the fact that 250,000 workers and trade unionists march through the streets of Dublin - the Irish TUC leadership sat on their hands.

This could be stopped in the blink of an eye of the leadership of the TUC in Britain acted - yet they will likely do exactly that same as their counterparts in Ireland 17 years ago.

 

[beorhthelm]

Exactly the same thing happened with Irish Ferries in 2005 - they sacked their entire workforce who were unionised and on trade union rates of pay - and employed workers from Latvia at the Latvian minimum wage of €2 per hour.

Despite the fact that 250,000 workers and trade unionists march through the streets of Dublin - the Irish TUC leadership sat on their hands.

This could be stopped in the blink of an eye of the leadership of the TUC in Britain acted - yet they will likely do exactly that same as their counterparts in Ireland 17 years ago.

what can the TUC do; what could the Irish unions have done that they didnt do?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Business and profits first.

[tweet]1504728791414890504[/tweet]

 

[Baker lite]

I totally agree. These P&O workers need to stop moaning. Get over it, it’s the will of the people. And to be fair, they are moving on…..albeit from their place of work to the dole queue escorted by balaclava clad security guards. They knew what they were voting for!


PS isn’t happening in France.

Same old bumf from remainiac loons, move on with your lives.

https://twitter.com/paulembery/status/1504612124538155009?s=21

 

[WATFORD zero]

Same old bumf from remainiac loons, move on with your lives.

https://twitter.com/paulembery/status/1504612124538155009?s=21

Shouldn't you be giving your RMT colleagues advice to help them, rather than NSC

Quite right,but should someone on a decent living wage have their wages cut to conform with someone on low wages?
Or should the person on low wages aspire to be on a decent wage?
My union, through the power of collective bargaining have over the years negotiated a good living wage for Myself and My colleagues,I suggest you join a Union.

Good thread, especially at this most of interesting of times.
Always thought I was a bit on the left, trades union member, could not really relate the stereotypical Tory toff, on the other hand I cannot imagine voting for the Labour Party now, they are certainly, in their current guise not a party of the working class.

Maybe coming out in support, Actions speak louder ... etc ?

 

[The Merry Prankster]

my mid curve brain cant work out how sacking 800 people will save much on £100m losses, especially when a large portion will be rehired. so heres something different, is this a ploy to have business bought out, government looking to an alternative operator or nationalise ?

I read somewhere that they will save £9 million but that they spend £160 million sponsoring golf world wide. Cant find it now to check source

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Same old bumf from remainiac loons, move on with your lives.

https://twitter.com/paulembery/status/1504612124538155009?s=21

Try reading Britannia Unchained co-authored by Kwasi Kwarteng (Author), P. Patel (Author), Dominic Raab (Author), Chris Skidmore (Author), Elizabeth Truss (Author)
published in 2012

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Britannia-Unchained-Global-Lessons-Prosperity/dp/1137032235

Just one of the reviews (many more like it)

The best things about this book are definitely the title and the illustration on the cover of Britannia shielding herself from the world. I wish Dominic Raab, Priti Patel, Kwasi Karteng, Chris Skidmore and Liz Truss had been more open about who wrote which chapter. (I guess Priti penned the one on Israel. But whose proofreading let all those typos through?) Anyway, since this 116 page, 6 chapter volume is talked up as the blueprint for post Brexit Britain, I thought I should read it. Apparently the UK needs: the banks of Canada, the geekish quality of tech people from India, the work ethic of Singaporeans, the optimism of Brazilians, and the Research and Development capabilities of Israel in order to get on. Coupled with these qualities from around the world, the authors argue for large-scale state deregulation and elimination of intrusive protections of workers and the environment, more tolerance for bankrupt companies, and less government support for the ill, the old, and the unemployed. They suggest it's good for parents to pay for extra maths and science tuition for their children, and they appear to condemn popular celebrity culture in Britain, too. There are 15 pages of notes on the chapters, along with a four page bibliography and an eight page index. This brings the total number of pages up to 144. With a cover price of 15.99, that means just over 11 pence per page. For what it's worth, I'd suggest buying it second hand, if at all.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

This undoutly does have a link to Brexit - probably loss of trade more than anything else. But it's being suggested that it's being suggested it's down to employment law changing in the UK since we left - it hasn't - we're still aligned. Or it's down to the ferries being registered in Cyprus - yet Cyprus are part of the EU so have to follow EU employment law.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Same old bumf from remainiac loons, move on with your lives.

https://twitter.com/paulembery/status/1504612124538155009?s=21

Paul Embery

Now there’s a very confused person I’ve not heard from in a long time.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

People voted for Brexit to take control of our borders and stop foreign workers taking British jobs.

How's that working out, BTW?

So-called Freeports will make this much easier as well as putting our strategic port assets beyond the reach of important legal safeguards and regulation. This is what Singapore-on-Sea looks like in practice. Exactly what disaster capitalists like Rees-Mogg planned so it's no good the Government throwing up their hands in mock-horror when they realise this fails their populism test.

But yes, Johnson got Brexit done, his great achievement. It's all done and dusted. Ancient history. The reason Brexiteers say this, of course, is that it's been such a clusterf*CK disaster.

Sent from my M2103K19G using Tapatalk

Freeports will be an absolute disaster. P & O on serial steroids.

Let's rule them out immediately.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

"You lost, get over it" will be the comment from the pracning ninny if he pops onto this thread. Been very quiet for a while now, though.

If the prancing ninny is the one I think it is then the biggest irony is that they are actually the one that hasn't "got over it" or "moved on" from 2016.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

If the prancing ninny is the one I think it is then the biggest irony is that they are actually the one that hasn't "got over it" or "moved on" from 2016.

I know. Last seen fluffing the most ignored of all NSC oddballs.

 

[highflyer]

Freeports will be an absolute disaster. P & O on serial steroids.

Let's rule them out immediately.

P&O is owned by Dubai-based DP World, a major global port owner with a track record of aggressive tax avoidance. DP World has been at the forefront of lobbying the British government to establish so-called free ports where standard customs, planning and tax measures will not apply. This situation is an inevitable part of the vision of a financialised future promoted by successive governments, where our key services are sold offshore, to be squeezed for maximum profit while worker’s rights and conditions are brutally undercut and corporations are able to avoid all obligations to contribute to society.

I don't think the link with Brexit is as direct as some want to present, but it is part of the same bigger picture - the UK as an offshore financial centre where the wealthiest are able to do their business as they wish.

I suspect the suggestion that the reason that P and O didn't do the same to French workers is because they feared the response of more organized, and more effective, French unions are correct.

 

[Eric the meek]

I distinctly recall Boris bragging about how Brexit would bring a 'high wage economy'.

I didn't realise he meant high wages for the Filipino agency workers (relative to their normal wages), and no wages for the Brits whose jobs they are taking.

 

[WATFORD zero]

This undoutly does have a link to Brexit - probably loss of trade more than anything else. But it's being suggested that it's being suggested it's down to employment law changing in the UK since we left - it hasn't - we're still aligned. Or it's down to the ferries being registered in Cyprus - yet Cyprus are part of the EU so have to follow EU employment law.

Having had to make redundancies in the past (but never on this scale) and making sure I was completely briefed legally at the time, this doesn't look right to me. However, things have probably changed since I did it and I can't believe that P&O would have cocked this up by not following the legal avenues.

The Government deliberately blocked this 'fire and rehire' bill on employee rights a few months back, but whether this is directly relevant, I don't know.

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2021/oct/22/anger-as-ministers-block-fire-and-rehire-bill-in-commons

There are reports this morning that P&O haven't fired any of their French staff. I suspect that we will find out in time, but my guess is that the various staff will be on different contracts spread across companies with structures inside and outside the UK and EU making the protection of employees rights complicated