OT - Degree required when hiring

[Chinman3000]

I noticed that on some job adverts (like some recently advertised ones on here) the description will request a 'degree in anything' as part of the requirements.

I really don’t understand the importance of this to the application/hiring process. If you choose to start employment after obtaining A-Levels or even GCSEs then you have gained an additional 3-5 years of experience in business instead of obtaining an irrelevant degree and putting yourself in debt.

Now obviously the details of the experience will be a key factor in the hiring process, but by stating at the outset you will need a 'degree in anything' means those who chose this path are not even getting a chance to show their additional experience.

I'm one of those who decided not to attend university and left education after my A-Levels. Now having built a 12 year career in financial services, I would find it more than insulting if, I couldn’t be considered for a position because I didn’t spend 3 years partying, living like a tramp, getting £30k in debt and coming away with a degree in art.

Am I missing something?

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Am I missing something?

3 years partying?

 

[Biscuit]

It shows a aptitude to research, study and learn at a certain level. Contrary to popular belief, there's no such thing as a 'useless' degree.

 

[StonehamPark]

I noticed that on some job adverts (like some recently advertised ones on here) the description will request a 'degree in anything' as part of the requirements.

I really don’t understand the importance of this to the application/hiring process. If you choose to start employment after obtaining A-Levels or even GCSEs then you have gained an additional 3-5 years of experience in business instead of obtaining an irrelevant degree and putting yourself in debt.

Now obviously the details of the experience will be a key factor in the hiring process, but by stating at the outset you will need a 'degree in anything' means those who chose this path are not even getting a chance to show their additional experience.

I'm one of those who decided not to attend university and left education after my A-Levels. Now having built a 12 year career in financial services, I would find it more than insulting if, I couldn’t be considered for a position because I didn’t spend 3 years partying, living like a tramp, getting £30k in debt and coming away with a degree in art.

Am I missing something?

Funnily I did think the same thing when I saw the degree required post.

I'm in the same boat as you, straight into work from school.
Have great experience in my field and and generally more life-experience than my friends who stumbled out of uni a few years ago and still trying to work things out.
I've essentially had a 10 year head start.

However, this is the first job advertised requiring a degree that I've seen in a long time.

I've not one friend or colleague who has said anything that would indicate Uni being hard work. Aside from the dissertation.
They were all out at least 2-3 nights per week and living of pasta and Fosters.

That said, obviously some degrees are required for particular roles (Law/Medicine/Engineering etc).

 

[Acker79]

According to a recent equality and diversity training session I went on, unless the degree is relevant to the job, that could be indirect discrimination on the basis of age. You are essentially discriminating against anyone under 21 (since most people with a degree will need to have spent at least 3 years at Uni and are generally not younger than 18 when they start). The qualities of study and application can be demonstrated through other means (college for example, good school records/references.

 

[Chinman3000]

It shows a aptitude to research, study and learn at a certain level. Contrary to popular belief, there's no such thing as a 'useless' degree.

Is that a quote from a UCAS promotion??!

I understand the point but you could also say 'Finding employement shows a drive to put yourself out there and work hard to get where you want to be. There is no such thing as unless experience.'

 

[Postman Pat]

It shows a aptitude to research, study and learn at a certain level. Contrary to popular belief, there's no such thing as a 'useless' degree.

Don't industry specific qualifications also show this but are more relevant? I'm the same as Chinman, left school after A-Levels and despite having 12+ years experience and industry recognised qualifications in my role, there are some jobs I wouldn't get through the door as I don't have a degree.

 

[Biscuit]

Is that a quote from a UCAS promotion??!

I understand the point but you could also say 'Finding employement shows a drive to put yourself out there and work hard to get where you want to be. There is no such thing as unless experience.'

Experience and having a degree are not mutually exclusive. The best applicants gain experience in relevant fields while studying for their degree.

 

[brightn'ove]

It's called lazy recruitment, they don't have to sift through as many CVs and can just delete any without a degree.

 

[Springal]

It's called lazy recruitment, they don't have to sift through as many CVs and can just delete any without a degree.

Agreed and pretty ancient recruiting requirement unless especially for qualification requirements because it is required.

Probably wouldn't want to work for a company like that

 

[brightn'ove]

Agreed and pretty ancient recruiting requirement unless especially for qualification requirements because it is required.

Probably wouldn't want to work for a company like that

Deloitte and Ernst & Young have done away with the degree requirement. I can only imagine the faces of their HR department when they found this out .

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I noticed that on some job adverts (like some recently advertised ones on here) the description will request a 'degree in anything' as part of the requirements.

I really don’t understand the importance of this to the application/hiring process. If you choose to start employment after obtaining A-Levels or even GCSEs then you have gained an additional 3-5 years of experience in business instead of obtaining an irrelevant degree and putting yourself in debt.

Now obviously the details of the experience will be a key factor in the hiring process, but by stating at the outset you will need a 'degree in anything' means those who chose this path are not even getting a chance to show their additional experience.

I'm one of those who decided not to attend university and left education after my A-Levels. Now having built a 12 year career in financial services, I would find it more than insulting if, I couldn’t be considered for a position because I didn’t spend 3 years partying, living like a tramp, getting £30k in debt and coming away with a degree in art.

Am I missing something?

Maybe if we had educated people in financial services we wouldn't have had the crash?

 

[GingerBeerMan]

According to a recent equality and diversity training session I went on, unless the degree is relevant to the job, that could be indirect discrimination on the basis of age. You are essentially discriminating against anyone under 21 (since most people with a degree will need to have spent at least 3 years at Uni and are generally not younger than 18 when they start). The qualities of study and application can be demonstrated through other means (college for example, good school records/references.

What about the less well off and/or lower classes? I've got nothing to back this up but I imagine there is a huge correlation between parents income and people who obtain a degree, perhaps it's a sly way of making sure you only get the 'right kind' of people in your company.

 

[Acker79]

What about the less well off and/or lower classes? I've got nothing to back this up but I imagine there is a huge correlation between parents income and people who obtain a degree, perhaps it's a sly way of making sure you only get the 'right kind' of people in your company.

I don't believe financial status is a protected characteristic.

Just googled: age, disability, gender, gender reassignment, race, religion or belief and sexual orientation are the protected characteristics.

 

[Triggaaar]

According to a recent equality and diversity training session I went on, unless the degree is relevant to the job, that could be indirect discrimination on the basis of age.

I doubt it. A degree proves some level of intelligence and determination, and there's no reason not to ask for it, if it's what you require.

The qualities of study and application can be demonstrated through other means (college for example, good school records/references.

No they can't. Many kids will get a good reference from school, the school wants them to get a job. That's not the same as proving yourself.

I understand the point but you could also say 'Finding employement shows a drive to put yourself out there and work hard to get where you want to be. There is no such thing as unless experience.'

And some job adverts will state that they require the applicant to have some work experience, showing just that.

It seems some of you think we should just do away with higher education (other than vocational courses).

 

[Acker79]

I doubt it. A degree proves some level of intelligence and determination, and there's no reason not to ask for it, if it's what you require.

The problem is that they are asking for any degree. That could be a degree in Baking Technology Management, Viticulture and Oenology, Viking Studies, Surf Science and Technology, Contemporary Circus and Performance Arts, Hand Embroidery, Artist Blacksmithing, Dairy Herd Management.

There have even been degree courses dedicated to David Beckham and to Star Trek.

There are a lot of degrees that would not necessarily prove, or even suggest, a level of intelligence beyond College level education or a level of determination better than a good school/college report and/or reference. I speak as someone who has earned a degree, and has worked in universities and can see quite clearly how little intelligence, and how little determination it can take to get a degree. Especially when you bear in mind they're not specifying a subject or area, nor are they specifying any classification in the adverts to which the OP refers.

 

[Triggaaar]

The problem is that they are asking for any degree.

Yes, and that's fine. As I said a degree proves some level of intelligence and determination. People who study history at university don't all want to become historians. If there was a legal case backing up your point, it would devastate our universities.

There are a lot of degrees that would not necessarily prove, or even suggest, a level of intelligence beyond College level education or a level of determination better than a good school/college report and/or reference.

I disagree.

I speak as someone who has earned a degree, and has worked in universities and can see quite clearly how little intelligence, and how little determination it can take to get a degree.

Well it's all relative. It takes even less to just leave school.

 

[1066familyman]

Probably the best careers advice any teacher ever gave us at school was the one who said..." Never stop at A levels".

His reasoning? :

1) You could be overlooked for the bog standard jobs as they might think you're too bright, get bored too quickly and leave.

2) You'll be under qualified for the vast number of 'decent' jobs that require a degree, and besides, they'll wonder why you stopped at A levels.


Bearing in mind this was advice given at a raggy arsed Comprehensive in the 80's when most of us were regarded as factory fodder. The 6 form (A levels) comprised of no more than a couple of dozen in each year group, and possibly even fewer still went onto University. It was nothing like today, where it seems a good 70% of school leavers go onto college for A levels and a fairly decent percentage of those then go on to do a degree.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I noticed that on some job adverts (like some recently advertised ones on here) the description will request a 'degree in anything' as part of the requirements.

I really don’t understand the importance of this to the application/hiring process. If you choose to start employment after obtaining A-Levels or even GCSEs then you have gained an additional 3-5 years of experience in business instead of obtaining an irrelevant degree and putting yourself in debt.

Now obviously the details of the experience will be a key factor in the hiring process, but by stating at the outset you will need a 'degree in anything' means those who chose this path are not even getting a chance to show their additional experience.

I'm one of those who decided not to attend university and left education after my A-Levels. Now having built a 12 year career in financial services, I would find it more than insulting if, I couldn’t be considered for a position because I didn’t spend 3 years partying, living like a tramp, getting £30k in debt and coming away with a degree in art.

Am I missing something?

I hire people. Anyone that makes a big thing of their degree on their CV finds themselves dumped. I was actually on a call last week and someone had the audacity to say "I have a degree and masters in it networks so I know what I'm talking about" despite him being wrong, only having four years IT experience and me having engineers on the call with a total of 60 years combined experience. A degree means nothing and employers that insist on one miss many a good person. It's nothing but educational snobbery.

Edit - I also detest the attitude of many holding degrees that somehow they deserve more money ( no you don't, start at the bottom like everyone else ) or some special treatment. Give me a hard grafter over a degree holder any day.

 

[dazzer6666]

It shows a aptitude to research, study and learn at a certain level. Contrary to popular belief, there's no such thing as a 'useless' degree.

...but not necessarily an aptitude for grammar ?[emoji23][emoji23]

Most of our job ads (financial services industry) carry something like 'expected to be educated to degree level in a relevant subject' but it's not a pre-requisite. It's increasingly rare, though, to see applicants without degrees - those without are mostly the older gits like me.