Oscar Pistorius

[vegster]

Good old South Africa, they have live in helpers etc and still call them Servants....


Has this "Servant" been called to the stand, it surely must be a must...

Nope, for some unexplained reason, he not being called as a prosecution or defence witness. Very odd indeed if you ask me.

 

[KZNSeagull]

Good old South Africa, they have live in helpers etc and still call them Servants....


Has this "Servant" been called to the stand, it surely must be a must...

Er, not sure they did refer to him as his servant actually. Housekeeper. Have not heard anyone call their housekeeper/domestic a servant since I have been living here.

No, he will not be called - he slept through the entire incident apparently.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Nope, for some unexplained reason, he not being called as a prosecution or defence witness. Very odd indeed if you ask me.

I guess you can only assume he was drunk, on medication or something that would make his testimony completely unreliable for both sides.

 

[father_and_son]

Yep, and it also tends to be women with low self esteem who date and marry murderers in prison, knowing full well that that they are not going to run off with another woman when behind bars.

It gives them some sort of false sense of control in the relationship.

Can absolutely concur. Years ago I dated a girl who used to be a penpal (back when that was a thing!) to a number of long term inmates. Didn't last that long!

 

[KZNSeagull]

Er, not sure they did refer to him as his servant actually. Housekeeper. Have not heard anyone call their housekeeper/domestic a servant since I have been living here.

No, he will not be called - he slept through the entire incident apparently.

I take that back - Johan Stipp referred to a "servant" in court apparently. Oh dear.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...s-at-Pistorius-home-on-night-of-shooting.html

 

[Insel affe]

Er, not sure they did refer to him as his servant actually. Housekeeper. Have not heard anyone call their housekeeper/domestic a servant since I have been living here.

No, he will not be called - he slept through the entire incident apparently.

Someone did on this thread, so can only apologise if I caused you any offence.

On the other matter of not calling said person to the stand, that is outrageous how can that be even if to just question him or her about why they slept through the "incident" or about the dynamics of the household on the build up to the night. I would have that thought that would be important. I can not think of one reason why they would not be called they were at the crime scene for heavens sake.

Very very odd

 

[KZNSeagull]

Someone did on this thread, so can only apologise if I caused you any offence.

On the other matter of not calling said person to the stand, that is outrageous how can that be even if to just question him or her about why they slept through the "incident" or about the dynamics of the household on the build up to the night. I would have that thought that would be important. I can not think of one reason why they would not be called they were at the crime scene for heavens sake.

Very very odd

Not at all - see my post above yours. Johan Stipp referred to a "servant" in court apparently. Tosser (Dr Stipp, not you!). The Telegraph article in my post above sort of explains why he has not been called.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Just seen this:

Oscar intimidated Reeva's friend - report

Oscar Pistorius allegedly leaned forward and spoke to Reeva Steenkamp's friend during an adjournment in court on Tuesday, according to a report.

Beeld reported that Pistorius whispered "how do you sleep at night?" to Kim Myers, who is the sister of Gina Myers - Steenkamp's best friend.

Pistorius is on trial in the North Gauteng High Court for Steenkamp's murder. The incident happened during a long adjournment on Tuesday morning while the next defence witness was being fetched. Pistorius apparently stood up and walked out, lingering for a moment as he passed Kim Myers.

Myers told Beeld that she was "shocked" as well as "upset and angry" by the incident.

City Press reported that police officers saw it happen and spoke to her. A source close to the investigation told City Press he hoped Myers had been advised to lay a charge of intimidation against Pistorius.

However, Pistorius's attorney said the report was "grossly untrue", according to a tweet from journalist Aislinn Laing.

Laing also tweeted that Pistorius denied having spoken to members of the Myers family, saying he saw them in the court's corridors but they didn't look him in the eye, and he hadn't spoken to them for a year-and-a-half.

The Myers family lawyer later said Pistorius made the comment in a "very sinister tone", and that the family had been in contact with the National Prosecuting Authority, according to Laing.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/Oscar_Pistorius/Oscar-intimidated-Reevas-friend-report-20140506

He says it did not happen yet he was seen doing it. I believe this is a breach of his bail conditions if true.

Some of the comments on the article on the link are interesting too.

He wasn't aware his mouth, tongue and vocal chords were moving, before he knew it words involuntary escaped from his mouth, but not to anyone in particular, he just happened to be looking directly at someone...by accident again.

 

[symyjym]

These people didn't hear the gun shots? That's a bit weird. Even if they gunshots woke them up, you'd think they knew they woke up from the gunshots.

Yep I think the defense angle is "if the direct next door neighbours couldn't hear Reeva screaming, how did other witnesses living further away hear a woman screaming."

Some of the witnesses heard her screams from over 100 yards away, so to discredit and discount what they think they heard is the motivation. That said the witnesses who lived opposite did hear everything.

 

[symyjym]

Can absolutely concur. Years ago I dated a girl who used to be a penpal (back when that was a thing!) to a number of long term inmates. Didn't last that long!

Yep you have to draw a line somewhere.

 

[Insel affe]

Not at all - see my post above yours. Johan Stipp referred to a "servant" in court apparently. Tosser (Dr Stipp, not you!). The Telegraph article in my post above sort of explains why he has not been called.

"Mr Chiziweni, the closest person by far to the events of St Valentine's Day last year after Pistorius and Steenkamp themselves, is understood to have told police he slept through the entire incident.
He was mentioned by name for the first time yesterday, just over two months after the start of the 27-year-old athlete's trial for the premeditated murder of his girlfriend, 29.
Carice Viljoen, a friend of Pistorius whose father he rang moments after shooting the model through a locked lavatory door of his home, said when she arrived at the house, “Frank” was standing in the road with the estate security guards.
The housekeeper has been referred to in several profiles of Pistorius, a world-famous Paralympic athlete, written before the shooting.
In one, written in October 2011, he is reported to be asked by Pistorius, who addresses him as “brother”, to bring him his prosthetic legs. In another, written the following year, he is referred to as a “live-in caretaker who keeps his home spotless”.
A policeman who arrived at the scene an hour after the shooting confirmed Mr Chiziweni had been sleeping in a room off the kitchen and was awake when they arrived.
He said the man spoke good English. “We said to him, you were here. What did you hear?” the policeman said, adding that he had replied: “No, no, no, I didn't hear anything”.
He said police had been unconvinced by his response: “We were all asking ourselves how he could not have heard anything,” he said.
Barry Roux, Pistorius's barrister, *said the defence would not be asking Mr Chiziweni to come to court to give evidence. *“He says he was asleep. We’re not going to be calling him.” Despite being listed as a prosecution witness, a source for the State said they would not call him either, confirming he told police in his statement he heard “absolutely nothing”.
Asked why the defence would not call Mr Chiziweni either, the source responded: “He is an employee of Mr Pistorius's. What you don’t hear can be as damaging as what you do.”
The housekeeper is the second member of South Africa's massive but often invisible domestic worker class to be referred to in the murder trial.
Dr Johan Stipp, a neighbour and radiologist who gave evidence about going to Pistorius' house to offer medical assistance after the shooting, made mention of a “servant” who lived on his property.
His wife Anette Stipp said the domestic worker also heard a woman screaming around the time of the shooting, but she was never called to give evidence."

Bloody outstanding.....

I heard nothing boss....

Cover up......

Guilty as sin....

 

[Triggaaar]

Can absolutely concur. Years ago I dated a girl who used to be a penpal (back when that was a thing!) to a number of long term inmates. Didn't last that long!

You got dumped for someone that was locked up. That's gotta hurt.

 

[KZNSeagull]

"Mr Chiziweni, the closest person by far to the events of St Valentine's Day last year after Pistorius and Steenkamp themselves, is understood to have told police he slept through the entire incident.
He was mentioned by name for the first time yesterday, just over two months after the start of the 27-year-old athlete's trial for the premeditated murder of his girlfriend, 29.
Carice Viljoen, a friend of Pistorius whose father he rang moments after shooting the model through a locked lavatory door of his home, said when she arrived at the house, “Frank” was standing in the road with the estate security guards.
The housekeeper has been referred to in several profiles of Pistorius, a world-famous Paralympic athlete, written before the shooting.
In one, written in October 2011, he is reported to be asked by Pistorius, who addresses him as “brother”, to bring him his prosthetic legs. In another, written the following year, he is referred to as a “live-in caretaker who keeps his home spotless”.
A policeman who arrived at the scene an hour after the shooting confirmed Mr Chiziweni had been sleeping in a room off the kitchen and was awake when they arrived.
He said the man spoke good English. “We said to him, you were here. What did you hear?” the policeman said, adding that he had replied: “No, no, no, I didn't hear anything”.
He said police had been unconvinced by his response: “We were all asking ourselves how he could not have heard anything,” he said.
Barry Roux, Pistorius's barrister, *said the defence would not be asking Mr Chiziweni to come to court to give evidence. *“He says he was asleep. We’re not going to be calling him.” Despite being listed as a prosecution witness, a source for the State said they would not call him either, confirming he told police in his statement he heard “absolutely nothing”.
Asked why the defence would not call Mr Chiziweni either, the source responded: “He is an employee of Mr Pistorius's. What you don’t hear can be as damaging as what you do.”
The housekeeper is the second member of South Africa's massive but often invisible domestic worker class to be referred to in the murder trial.
Dr Johan Stipp, a neighbour and radiologist who gave evidence about going to Pistorius' house to offer medical assistance after the shooting, made mention of a “servant” who lived on his property.
His wife Anette Stipp said the domestic worker also heard a woman screaming around the time of the shooting, but she was never called to give evidence."

Bloody outstanding.....

I heard nothing boss....

Cover up......

Guilty as sin....

Well indeed. He did not hear any of the gunshots and other banging about, but was awake when all the cars turned up. Amazing.

 

[father_and_son]

You got dumped for someone that was locked up. That's gotta hurt.

The more I think about this the stranger it seems. It was something she did a good while BEFORE we started going out. But we were 1st year Uni students at the time, so were both 18. We never discussed it in detail (we were 18 and students, we didn't discuss much, just stayed in bed all day) but I realise I have no idea how old she actually was when she was doing this. A more innocent age or a bit creepy that young girls were allowed to contact long term inmates like that??


She actually dumped me because she didn't like Pink Floyd and it was pretty much all I ever played.

 

[KZNSeagull]

An interesting morning but probably not for the right reasons.

Defence called an Anaesthetics expert from Wits University to talk about gastric emptying. The upshot of it was that there are loads of factors that go into how quickly stomach contents empty and it is not an exact science (we knew that already) and that she could not dispute the findings of the post mortem as she is not a forensic scientist and does not deal with stomach emptying after death. So I am not sure she really added anything.

Next a Mrs Van Schalkwyk was called who asked to testify on Tuesday after she had read that Oscar was faking his crying etc. She works as a social worker for the social development department and was with Oscar at the bail application. She testified that Oscar was upset the day after the incident and had said that he was sorry because he had lost Reeva and that he was sorry for her parents. Under cross examination, it was found that even though she had 24 years experience, Oscar was the first person she had ever met the day after an incident of this nature, so she did not know what a normal reaction would be! So why she was there and what she added to anything is a mystery as well. She wanted to give evidence to say that Oscar was upset the day after the incident and was traumatised. We know that already. She says he told her it was an accident. Nel questioned her at length, determined that she was not a psychologist and that at no point did he say that he was sorry for what he had done. Together with the first witness today, it just gave the impression of desperation from the defence and the lawyers on the tv are saying that she added nothing and if anything, helped the state!

At last they have now called Wollie Wolmerans, the balistics expert that we have been waiting for for weeks! They just went through his CV to determine his expertise (did national service in the 60's, joined police in 1966 and retired in 1992 and has been a balistics consultant since then). He did work in Zim during the bush wars(!) and with the UN in Kosovo, has worked on about 10000 cases and given evidence over 500 times in court. He could be very interesting but his English is not great. We wait and see what he has to say...

 

[Bold Seagull]

Who has called Wolmerans then? Has his expertise been paid for by the defence team, or by the state or police?

 

[KZNSeagull]

Who has called Wolmerans then? Has his expertise been paid for by the defence team, or by the state or police?

Defence. So Oscar is paying for him.

 

[Bold Seagull]

So, Nel has Wolmerans confirming the magazine rack had to be where it was (next to the toilet), which contradicts OP's testimony that he heard a noise which had to have been the magazine rack as there is nothing else in the toilet.

 

[KZNSeagull]

So, Nel has Wolmerans confirming the magazine rack had to be where it was (next to the toilet), which contradicts OP's testimony that he heard a noise which had to have been the magazine rack as there is nothing else in the toilet.

Yes, and he tried very hard to get Wolmarans to say that there had to be a significant time gap between the bullets to the hip and arm and the bullet to the head, but Wolmarans was not having that. We cannot have common sense in this case, clearly.

Interesting that Wolmarans' report is dated 25th April 2014, 7 days AFTER Roger Dixon finished testifying, who Mr Wolmarans had taken for a beer the day he finished testifying. But they did not discuss the case, apparently!

 

[symyjym]

In OP’s testimony he suggested that not only did he think that someone used a ladder to get into the main bathroom, he suggested that he thought another ladder could have been put up to the toilet window. As if any intruder would put up a ladder to the house from the main street in public view anyway? Let alone trying to look innocent whilst dragging two ladders through the estate in the early morning hours.

Even if there was an intruder who locked themselves in a toilet, which is improbable, OP used excessive force with the intention to kill. It was unlawful killing, murder whoever was behind the door.