Opening Up Old Sussex Railway Lines

[goldstone]

Have a look at the BML2 website www.bml2.co.uk They have an interesting proposal to develop a second Brighton Main Line to relieve pressure on the current line.
Briefly, from Brighton, a tunnel under the Downs (branching off the Lewes line just after Falmer), then following the old Lewes - Uckfield line, then using the current Uckfield - E. Croydon line (including reinstating the lines to Tunbridge Wells West), via a much expanded E. Croydon station, then onwards to Canary Wharf.
A very exciting idea in my opinion. Would love to see it happen.

 

[gazingdown]

This is all very interesting. Any Albionites or whatever you call yourselves up for helping get a heritage railway on the Cranleigh line off the ground? I and my currently sole colleague have been making steady progress on putting together information and plans for this, starting at the Christ's Hospital end. Could really do with more folk on board, to be treasurer, secretary and all the other positions involved in a charitable trust, as well as directors of the PLC which will also have to be started - and also anyone willing to give us their physical assistance on-site, or swing any influence anywhere (with councils, landowners, whatever), lend equipment, or just give us your money... ANY way you can help us would be most appreciated! I'm on Facebook under the same name as here, and there's a page you can 'like' ("Wey & Arun Railway") and a group you can join too... hoping to get a website up soon (again, any decent web designers around here?). The eventual aim is to get the full 30-odd miles from Peasmarsh Junction down to Shoreham reopened, but beyond Christ's Hospital, dear God is the route bollocksed... that's going to be a megamillions project!

With respect, I would not be supporting this.

I (and may others) love cycling/walking various parts of this route and wouldn't want that taken away. By all means, build a train line next to, rather than on, the line

 

[Surrey Seagull]

Have a look at the BML2 website www.bml2.co.uk They have an interesting proposal to develop a second Brighton Main Line to relieve pressure on the current line.
Briefly, from Brighton, a tunnel under the Downs (branching off the Lewes line just after Falmer), then following the old Lewes - Uckfield line, then using the current Uckfield - E. Croydon line (including reinstating the lines to Tunbridge Wells West), via a much expanded E. Croydon station, then onwards to Canary Wharf.
A very exciting idea in my opinion. Would love to see it happen.

Wasn't this proposal (or something similar) rejected about 6 months ago?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Wasn't this proposal (or something similar) rejected about 6 months ago?

Indeed. On grounds of cost. If the money could be found to fund this project, there would be bound to be lots of other transport projects that would represent better value for money.

Therefore it won't happen.

 

[The Birdman]

Wouldn't I just love to be able to get on at West Hoathly (the station for which was actually in Sharpthorne) and travel by train all the way to the Amex. Or better still, from WH to Lewes to change for Falmer. On good days I could even walk from home to the station. The East Grinstead to Crawley (Three Bridges) line was closed just as Crawley was being expanded. Now about 25% of East Grinstead residents work in Crawley, and they have no alternative but to drive (bus services are poor and slow). The line cannot be reopened, as shops and flats were built across the track at Crawley Down.

They did actually try to get part of the Horsham to Guildford line reopened, from Cranleigh to Guildford. Cranleigh's residents were in favour, but Bramley, a real Ye Olde Englande village, was against. Why, I don't know, when the traffic on that part of the A281 is a real pain and spoils the village. Baron Pepperpot, there is no real prospect of the Bluebell reopening the Ardingly line for some while. It is a long-term project, but they think it will take about 20 years, and it will only ever be a tourist railway.

Edit: I hadn't read forrest's post before posting myself. For the Horsted Keynes to Ardingly section, I think they plan to fill in the cutting where the viaduct was removed and then put a much narrower bridge across. There is also the issue of the stone terminal at Ardingly. I presume it will have to close before the Bluebell can use the track, and I can't see Network Rail allowing the Bluebell into Haywards Heath, which is exceptionally busy, though I suppose they might be able to use Platform 1 in off peak hours.




I believe that Haywards Heath Station (rail track) will allow the bluebell railway to have a shared entrance and its own platform the issue for the bluebell is they don't have the space for a run around for the locomotive to turn around and it would be costly to have two engines.

I think they have solved the run around problem at Haywards Heath Station. I believe that the bluebell has been very busy since the opening of the East Grinstead line. Roll on to The Heath.

 

[The Birdman]

Wasn't this proposal (or something similar) rejected about 6 months ago?

So was the Handcross Hill project you need to keep campaigning those who shout the most may get want they want! (A stadium)

 

[Wey-Arun Railway]

With respect, I would not be supporting this.

I (and may others) love cycling/walking various parts of this route and wouldn't want that taken away. By all means, build a train line next to, rather than on, the line

With respect, the infrastructure requirements of a cycle path are much less than those of an operation railway: the need for the latter is clearly demonstrable, whereas, on the occasions I have walked the route (each time in beautiful sunny weather), I have seen very few people using it. I have spoken to a number of people in nearby towns who have walked and cycled it and opine that the very straight and level formation makes it pretty boring, same old thing mile after mile. There are substantial sections where, in any case, the Downs Link isn't quite on the line but running adjacent to it. It doesn't actually get right onto the line (working NW from Christ's Hospital) until after the site of the old Slinfold station. It also deviates around Baynards Tunnel and the former Cranleigh station site (now occupied by Stocklund Square and its car park). It's also not on the site of the junction with the Portsmouth main line at Peasmarsh - although unfortunately a house IS! Given the demonstrable need for the railway, we believe that (where there is insufficient width for or a compelling health-and-safety case against a formation share) deviating the Downs Link off the route would be easily achievable and that the cost of doing so would be a tiny fraction of the economic benefits to the area. The A281 is an absolute nightmare at rush hour. Young and old alike are also disadvantaged by public transport being available only in the form of a few pathetic bus services (subsidised by Surrey County Council, so the Sussex villages of Rudgwick, Slinfold and Itchingfield simply aren't served at all) which do not run in the evenings or on Sundays. Offset that against a few hundred walkers and cyclists a month being temporarily disadvantaged and the case for reinstatement is clear.

 

[Wey-Arun Railway]

I believe that the Bluebell has been very busy since the opening of the East Grinstead line. Roll on to The Heath.

They will not be doing so until they have done a lot of catching-up on maintenance and renewal of the existing infrastructure and sorted out the dire state of their motive power fleet.

 

[Leekbrookgull]

Indeed. On grounds of cost. If the money could be found to fund this project, there would be bound to be lots of other transport projects that would represent better value for money.

Therefore it won't happen.

L/B your point about costs is often thrown up in cases like this by many people,however like others i would argue against Hs2 why ?
It takes me longer to travel from Stoke-on Trent to Derby Midland Stn than Ldn to Btn why semiphore signals,out dated track and diesel unit trains. As a user of the WCML it takes TWELVE mins to cover the FOUR miles from Stockport to Manchester Piccadilly why again infrascruture,we all know the locomotive will pull a train at 125mph,so as you have said before L/B i/e Croydon and Clapham these are the areas that need to be addressed ?

 

[goldstone]

With respect, I would not be supporting this.

I (and may others) love cycling/walking various parts of this route and wouldn't want that taken away. By all means, build a train line next to, rather than on, the line

I am a very keen walker, but I avoid any walks on former railway lines. They offer some of the most boring walking there is. Too straight, too flat, and for much of their distance either tall trees on either side obscuring the view, or they are in cuttings. May be OK for cyclists, but I thought even cyclists liked a view?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

L/B your point about costs is often thrown up in cases like this by many people,however like others i would argue against Hs2 why ?
It takes me longer to travel from Stoke-on Trent to Derby Midland Stn than Ldn to Btn why semiphore signals,out dated track and diesel unit trains. As a user of the WCML it takes TWELVE mins to cover the FOUR miles from Stockport to Manchester Piccadilly why again infrascruture,we all know the locomotive will pull a train at 125mph,so as you have said before L/B i/e Croydon and Clapham these are the areas that need to be addressed ?

I'd certainly put money (ahead of Brighton - Uckfield) into improving the mess that is the railway in South Manchester and to improving things in the Croydon area. Work in the Croydon area will deliver better value to Brighton passengers than any amount of tunneling between Falmer and Barcombe.

 

[Leekbrookgull]

I'd certainly put money (ahead of Brighton - Uckfield) into improving the mess that is the railway in South Manchester and to improving things in the Croydon area. Work in the Croydon area will deliver better value to Brighton passengers than any amount of tunneling between Falmer and Barcombe.

Using your words,how do you improve it ? CP orders to allow installment of 'new' lines in South Manchester ?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Using your words,how do you improve it ? CP orders to allow installment of 'new' lines in South Manchester ?

I really don't know what the detailed options might be. My experience of South Manchester is largely based on how things were before 2005, when I had family living in Wilmslow, although I still occasionally use the railway between Manchester Airport and the city centre.

Compulsory purchase tends to be seen these days as incredibly draconian, but the pros and cons have to be weighed up against the public and economic benefits that it can bring. That's how the railway was built originally and it's how new roads are built today.

 

[Leekbrookgull]

Ah,a Liberal ?

 

[Wey-Arun Railway]

I am a very keen walker, but I avoid any walks on former railway lines. They offer some of the most boring walking there is. Too straight, too flat, and for much of their distance either tall trees on either side obscuring the view, or they are in cuttings. May be OK for cyclists, but I thought even cyclists liked a view?

Which is what a lot of the users of the Downs Link tell me. I'd be inclined to agree. WSCC have today emailed us turning us down, simply because (according to their data) it's too well-used (20,000 users a year - we could be getting that in one weekend ten years from now if we were to start rebuilding in the next year! - plus I don't believe from what I've seen that the usage is anything like that high) and too important an environmental asset, wildlife corridor etc (for which read it's completely bloody overgrown with nettles). I've sent back to them what is I hope a very nicely-worded demolition of all their arguments against reinstatement - and I'll be following it up with a further demolition once I've got hold of all the WSCC and Horsham BC local plans etc...

 

[Notters]

No mention has yet been made of the Spa Valley Railway which now connects the Network Rail station at Eridge via Groombridge to the site of the old Tunbridge Wells West Station. To rejoin it to the main line at Tunbridge Wells would involve demolishing a Sainsbury Superstore. If done this would of course with a new link from Lewes to Uckfield provide an alternative route from Brighton to London.

Not just the Sainsbury though. There's a lot of pricey property in the way too. Isn't the problem with these tracks is that if there's a breakdown, the whole line is stuffed?

Nope. There's nothing on the line. Sainsburys is to the east.

 

[Notters]

Edit. Thr pictures on the previous page seem to disagree with me

 

[Bladders]

Nope. There's nothing on the line. Sainsburys is to the east.

Sainsburys have to pay for the demolition and re-positioning of their Supermarket if the line to T Wells West is reopened, though I think the owners of the land at Grove Hill junction are trying to flog the land to developers which would balls everything up.

 

[Don Tmatter]

From this weeks Mid Sussex Times :

http://www.midsussextimes.co.uk/news/business/business-news/bluebell-railway-on-track-to-come-to-haywards-heath-1-5876869

 

[dougdeep]

They'll have to get the builders merchants to move out of Ardingly station.