One dead, several hurt in central London knife attack

[gripper stebson]

Surely killing in the name of an imaginary bloke in the sky represents a mental health issue?

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[Hastings gull]

The French just shoot dead people who run amok in public knifing and shooting people, shouldn't we consider doing the same? I'm not overly happy contributing to locking them up for life. Does this make me a bad person or just old and stuck in the past?

No, it does not. I personally was disappointed that the Police at the time did not shoot dead those scum that killed Lee Rigby, and the death sentence would have been quite justified in their case. It was abundantly clear that they were guilty, there could not have been any miscarriage of justice, they had every intention of taking life, and they clearly have never shown any remorse. We now have a situation where their stay will cost hundreds of thousands over many years, and they are likely to negatively influence others in jail regarding radicalisation. That does not mean all systems go to "hang 'em high" as routine punishment, just that in truly exceptional circumstances, which this surely is, it can be justified.

 

[Insel affe]

Sky now reporting

Terrorism is being examined as a potential motive for a knife attack in central London that left one woman dead and five others injured.
Britain's most senior counter-terrorism officer, Assistant Commissioner Mark Rowley, said "early indications suggest that mental health was a factor" but that police were "keeping an open mind regarding the motive".
In an earlier statement, Mr Rowley said terrorism was "one line of inquiry that we should explore".
Police were called to reports of an armed man attacking people in Russell Square at 10.33pm on Wednesday

 

[Thunder Bolt]

No, it does not. I personally was disappointed that the Police at the time did not shoot dead those scum that killed Lee Rigby, and the death sentence would have been quite justified in their case. It was abundantly clear that they were guilty, there could not have been any miscarriage of justice, they had every intention of taking life, and they clearly have never shown any remorse. We now have a situation where their stay will cost hundreds of thousands over many years, and they are likely to negatively influence others in jail regarding radicalisation. That does not mean all systems go to "hang 'em high" as routine punishment, just that in truly exceptional circumstances, which this surely is, it can be justified.

Surely the point is that those particular terrorists want to die in action, for their 'rewards'. The fact that we don't kill them, could act as a deterrent to others who may be tempted to glory in their 'holy fight'. There's no honour in rotting in a cell.

 

[scamander]

Surely the point is that those particular terrorists want to die in action, for their 'rewards'. The fact that we don't kill them, could act as a deterrent to others who may be tempted to glory in their 'holy fight'. There's no honour in rotting in a cell.

Agreed, the big fear is rotting in a cell somewhere. Being killed serves as a martyr recruiting tool, knowing that if you do it you'll spend the rest of your life in solitary is a tougher deterrent (though you could debate to what extent any deterrent works in such cases).

I was listening to the Media Show on R4 yesterday and they were discussing how some news outlets are moving away from naming those responsible so as to avoid any glorification (and inspire copycat events).

 

[Icy Gull]

Surely the point is that those particular terrorists want to die in action, for their 'rewards'. The fact that we don't kill them, could act as a deterrent to others who may be tempted to glory in their 'holy fight'. There's no honour in rotting in a cell.

If that was true wouldn't they kill themselves rather than be captured, or get involved in a shoot out. The Lee Rigby ones seemed to want to revel in what they had done imo

 

[carlzeiss]

Agreed, the big fear is rotting in a cell somewhere. Being killed serves as a martyr recruiting tool, knowing that if you do it you'll spend the rest of your life in solitary is a tougher deterrent (though you could debate to what extent any deterrent works in such cases).

I was listening to the Media Show on R4 yesterday and they were discussing how some news outlets are moving away from naming those responsible so as to avoid any glorification (and inspire copycat events).

3 square meals a day , home comforts ,recreational facilities and priority medical treatment doesn't imo constitute rotting in a cell .

 

[Insel affe]

I was listening to the Media Show on R4 yesterday and they were discussing how some news outlets are moving away from naming those responsible so as to avoid any glorification (and inspire copycat events).

Makes perfect sense deeming them non entities as you say avoiding glorification for the Jihad. What I do not want though is the none reporting or deflecting the issue of terrorism and trying to use another excuse such as mental health or a difference of cultural understanding etc etc. I want it to be called as it is, no hiding or burying the facts, we must know.

 

[Eeyore]

3 square meals a day , home comforts ,recreational facilities and priority medical treatment doesn't imo constitute rotting in a cell .

No, but if you're stuck with that for the rest of your days you'd be a little miffed that your four and twenty virgins will be grannies by the time you reach paradise.

 

[scamander]

3 square meals a day , home comforts ,recreational facilities and priority medical treatment doesn't imo constitute rotting in a cell .

If you are hoping to die for your faith and reap the rewards you are sure you'll get any denial of this won't be preferable. I don't know enough to speculate on how they would be housed, but it wouldn't be very nice - you'll certainly be denied what you wanted to achieve and left to sweat on this for many years.

 

[scamander]

If that was true wouldn't they kill themselves rather than be captured, or get involved in a shoot out. The Lee Rigby ones seemed to want to revel in what they had done imo

You are correct about the Lee Rigby incident, though perhaps they had hoped/expected to be killed by the police and thus tick the boxes as they saw it. Behind all of this is intelligence, even the most ardent fanatic can give away vital clues or information.

 

[Gwylan]

If that was true wouldn't they kill themselves rather than be captured, or get involved in a shoot out.

There are several strictures against suicide in Islam: the lowest circle of Hell is reserved for those who take their own lives. The belief is that Allah gives life and only Allah can take it away. It's one of the reasons why so many Muslims declare that suicide bombers aren't true believers

 

[Diablo]

Surely the point is that those particular terrorists want to die in action, for their 'rewards'. The fact that we don't kill them, could act as a deterrent to others who may be tempted to glory in their 'holy fight'. There's no honour in rotting in a cell.

But they don`t rot in a cell...Human rights dictate they are fed watered supplied with TV Computer etc etc at our expense...I`d be happier with them dead honourable or not. An honourable dead terrorist can do no more harm.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

But they don`t rot in a cell...Human rights dictate they are fed watered supplied with TV Computer etc etc at our expense...I`d be happier with them dead honourable or not. An honourable dead terrorist can do no more harm.

A honourable dead terrorist inspires others to do the same. They are martyrs for the cause. For some, the cause is more important than life itself.

 

[cjd]

A terrorist in prison , will eventually have the opportunity to 'convert' other muslims in prison to their savage cause. Their 'work' is far from over while they are alive.

 

[The Clamp]

It's wise to shoot them dead if they are an ongoing threat. If they are contained I imagine it's better to detain them and hand them over to military intelligence. Most of these brainwashed young terrorists are in their teens or early twenties, most were living at home a few months before they attacked. A few days of sleep deprivation, no food and a couple of waterboarding sessions and they'll be singing like canaries.
I wouldn't think these criminals are destined for a nice time in prison.

 

[brightn'ove]

Makes perfect sense deeming them non entities as you say avoiding glorification for the Jihad. What I do not want though is the none reporting or deflecting the issue of terrorism and trying to use another excuse such as mental health or a difference of cultural understanding etc etc. I want it to be called as it is, no hiding or burying the facts, we must know.

I kind of get you, I hate how if a white supremacist for example goes and kills a group of people they are called mentally ill and the word terrorist is rarely used. But it goes both ways, they are both terrorists AND mentally deranged, not one or the other.

 

[Insel affe]

A terrorist in prison , will eventually have the opportunity to 'convert' other muslims in prison to their savage cause. Their 'work' is far from over while they are alive.

At last someone get's it...

This is actually a big problem the prison system is dealing with at the moment, a breeding ground of hate confined to four walls with constant bombardment of us v them.....

Big problem for the future.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I kind of get you, I hate how if a white supremacist for example goes and kills a group of people they are called mentally ill and the word terrorist is rarely used. But it goes both ways, they are both terrorists AND mentally deranged, not one or the other.

The police are now saying the suspect, who is a Norwegian of Somali origin, does have mental health issues, and there are no signs of radicalisation.

[tweet]761153459433381888[/tweet]

 

[Insel affe]

The police are now saying the suspect, who is a Norwegian of Somali origin, t]

Dare I pose the question of immigration and checks on peoples back grounds including mental health, nope probably not as that would make me guess what....