[MENTION=12211]The Spanish[/MENTION] is absolutely spot on when he talks about benefits as a source of divide and rule. So it really doesn't matter whether as laymen we know the extent of this problem or not, it should be a cross party policy to weed out and punish abusers of the benefits system, and they should just get on with it and not bang on about it at every single Tory party conference as if it is something new.
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Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
That bollocks yesterday about the guy getting up for work at 530am and seeing his neighbours curtains closed etc, didn't they think that shift worker may have been on a late shift so only just got in ? True garbage but some get suckered in by it
Monsieur Le Plonk
Lethargy in motion
Simster, I agree every bit of that.
34064 Fighter Command
New member
It won't make a stroke of difference to help anyone except the employer, who can now shift 100% of his jobs overseas with impunity.......... The fact is, as we all know, that shares can be worth nothing if the stock market wills it to be so. You are effectively being given an 'I Owe U' in return for allowing yourself to be forced to do whatever the employer wants - I believe in certain societies it's referred to as 'slavery'. Now you might have been bribed rather than imprisoned in chains, to become a 'slave', but the fact remains that you will have become a slave to your employer.
The real irony is that by allowing the employer to shift those jobs overseas means we are even more screwed than we were before. What will happen is that those jobs will be replaced with ones that are poorer paid, and have fewer benefits/perks like pensions etc, because the policy will attract the kind of employer who ROUTINELY shifts his business from place to place to keep his costs low (such as when GM had to choose between Bochum and Ellesmere Port and chose Ellesmere Port because UK workers decided to work harder for no increase in pay - it basically chose the cheapest worker) - it WON'T attract employers or investors with a wish to become a 'stakeholder' in UK PLC, those sorts of people are usually born here anyway, but for the most part, it will be someone who see's the UK as a place where costs of employment (principally wages) are less than anywhere else, particularly India or China. It's going to result in a race to the bottom for sure. It doesn't cost anything to lay off Indian or Chinese workers, and with this policy, it won't cost anything to lay off UK workers either. There will be a few industry sectors where transport costs outweigh labour costs and so those areas will benefit (mainly heavy industries), but if you want to become a nation with a pooly paid workforce and long working hours, then this is the way to go.
It is very much a return to John Major's 'Victorian Values' - all the wrong ones however.
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Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
The shares thing is a worthless soundbite and will never happen
Tubby Mondays
Well-known member
A good answer but not the explanantion I was looking for.
Tubby Mondays
Well-known member
Again; its good but not what I was looking for.
Where is a political heavyweight like Seagull58 when you need him?
Tubby Mondays
Well-known member
Surely not?!
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
File it with all the other shit they come out with out
Trouble is neither main party has had any significant degree of success with this, and yes I know the Tories have been banging on about it;but when they do,it is interesting to hear some of our default lefties on this board throw their hands up in horror.What would they do if Ed their 'man of the people' came out with the same stuff............be OK then I suppose!
Seagull58
In the Algarve
Do you seriously believe the lies and propoganda churned out by that odious C**T Campbell? Author of the dodgy dossier that took us to war, no less.
Seagull58
In the Algarve
Here we go again. Why not let Labour bankrupt the country once more? After all, they're pretty f***ing good at it now.
Seagull58
In the Algarve
and never will be, hopefully.
Seagull58
In the Algarve
Indeed, and my tenant has chosen not to pass it on to me for the past 2 months because I have given her notice to leave. I can't get housing benefit paid direct until she is more than 2 months behind on the rent, by which time, hopefully, she will be out and then I have to take legal action to recover the back rent, which she was getting all the time from the Council.
Seagull58
In the Algarve
Not so impressive during the 13 years him and his Brown buddy were detroying the country's finances and rapidly expanding the benefits culture.
Straw man argument. It isn't the Labour party who bang the benefit cheats drum ad-nauseum at *every* conference. And yes there are people on the left who consider benefits cuts an attack on the weak, but as I say NOBODY is against clamping down on benefit fraud, so just get on with it and stop talking about it at the Tory party conference.
And you said it, neither party has had any success in this area - time to ensure there is cross party policy on tackling the problem, as there was with the Olympics, and presumably is on drug running.
Harrumph............'.Straw man argument'..............Simmo,what does that mean?Pray enlighten me!
Seagull58
In the Algarve
Only worthless if you issue an infinite number and the company does not grow. Be fair, many employees do nicely out of their company share options.
Simster,just googled it,but I think I would prefer your explanation!
Seagull58
In the Algarve
I haven't heard the detail of the policy but I have been offered company share options in the past with 3 year and 7 year vesting. I stayed with the company past the 3 year term and the share price had grown more than 100% from the option price. Very far from "worthless" even when there were hundreds, if not thousands, of people getting the options. I can't really see why you're slagging off the opportunity to get a stake in the company you work for and to be rewarded with a tax-free payout (if that's what it is) if the company does well and the share price increases.