O/T - How Regularly Should Car Air-Con Get Re-Gassed?

[wehatepalace]

What has that got to do with it. Are you saying the air in a fridge is poisonous?

No I'm saying car A/C systems harbour bacteria that you subsequently breath in, in reply to your quote, that its just another motor industry rip off.
I had to do quite an extensive course to become a refrigerant handler and invest several thousands of pounds into the equipment, so I do speak with some 1st hand knowledge on the subject.
Obviously I can't make anyone think past the "rip off" status and we never force anything onto our customers but you are incorrect to say it's the same as a fridge and to not have it serviced.
And as I said earlier in the thread we only charge £35, £35 every couple of years is hardly a rip off !

 

[Bwian]

This is another great con orchestrated by the car industry. Your car air con is basically a fridge using the same refrigerant as in your home - when did you last have you fridge or freezer recharged?

Only get it done if it stops working.

Your fridge doesn't have the extreme conditions a car's a/c goes through, not to mention all of the movement. Also, re-gas and debug are 2 different things and can be done independent of each other.

Factor in the latest gas required to comply with regulations and £75 will seem cheap.

And yes, every two years is sensible- if only for finding leaks and fresh oil. You wouldn't run a car for 2 years without an oil change-I hope.

I sell chemical products to the motor trade and see first hand the results of penny pinching. Especially this time of year with a/c failures.

 

[larus]

No I'm saying car A/C systems harbour bacteria that you subsequently breath in, in reply to your quote, that its just another motor industry rip off.
I had to do quite an extensive course to become a refrigerant handler and invest several thousands of pounds into the equipment, so I do speak with some 1st hand knowledge on the subject.
Obviously I can't make anyone think past the "rip off" status and we never force anything onto our customers but you are incorrect to say it's the same as a fridge and to not have it serviced.
And as I said earlier in the thread we only charge £35, £35 every couple of years is hardly a rip off !

Is this something you do as a mobile service? If so, PM me your details if you don't mind and I'll get it done.

 

[Weststander]

My VW golf was not regassed for 10 years. The air con remained perfect. Never a problem. And my regular services never mentioned it (at a VW dealership).

After I had a shunt, however, and my insurer tried to get the repairs done on the cheap, I ended up paying a grand to have it fixed. As part of the cost cutting process, I had to take 7 or 8 days off work while the garage repeatedly took the car back in to fix the air con. They regassed it 4 or 5 times, each time insisting the problem was fixed, only for the air con to revert back to 'room air' after an interval (ranging from a day to 2 weeks). I spent so much time complaining to the AA (who managed my insurance at the time) that I started to think 'it was me' (I'm one of those who always starts thinking its 'my fault when there is a conflict). The bit that got me was the guys at the garage telling me that 'it takes a while for the air con to kick in after you start the car' (no it bloody doesn't - it takes about 30 seconds) and 'it feels cool to me, mate' (no it bloody doesn't). *******s. I have other horror stories about AA insurance (they did my house insurance for a while) that I'll save for another rant

Similarly, the air con in my Golf wasn't re-gassed and purged in the entire 8 years I owned it. It was used most of the year, and felt bitterly cold if set that way throughout.

VW Caffyns sometimes gently asked at service time did I want it done as an extra, but I always declined.


Re-gassing when it still comes out icy cold is a rip-off.

 

[wehatepalace]

Your missing the point, the "icy coldness" isn't what a service is all about, see the above couple of posts.

Similarly, the air con in my Golf wasn't re-gassed and purged in the entire 8 years I owned it. It was used most of the year, and felt bitterly cold if set that way throughout.

VW Caffyns sometimes gently asked at service time did I want it done as an extra, but I always declined.


Re-gassing when it still comes out icy cold is a rip-off.

 

[wehatepalace]

Unfortunately not, I have a garage in Horsham Town Centre if you're ever that way. Special rates for Albion fans obviously !

Is this something you do as a mobile service? If so, PM me your details if you don't mind and I'll get it done.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Similarly, the air con in my Golf wasn't re-gassed and purged in the entire 8 years I owned it. It was used most of the year, and felt bitterly cold if set that way throughout.

VW Caffyns sometimes gently asked at service time did I want it done as an extra, but I always declined.


Re-gassing when it still comes out icy cold is a rip-off.

Quite. And boy did I appreciate it today on my intrepid journey to and from Rye for a cycle to Camber Sands and swim (well, mooch; at low tide you have to practically wade to France in order to get enough depth to do a front crawl).

Yes, working at home can be so . . . diverting

 

[Weststander]

Your missing the point, the "icy coldness" isn't what a service is all about, see the above couple of posts.

Ching Ching $$$$$

 

[thedonkeycentrehalf]

Unfortunately not, I have a garage in Horsham Town Centre if you're ever that way. Special rates for Albion fans obviously !

Which is your garage? I pop up to Horsham once a month so if you do this on a Saturday morning, I could get this done while Mrs DCH goes shopping.

 

[upthealbion1970]

Your fridge doesn't have the extreme conditions a car's a/c goes through, not to mention all of the movement. Also, re-gas and debug are 2 different things and can be done independent of each other.

Factor in the latest gas required to comply with regulations and £75 will seem cheap.

And yes, every two years is sensible- if only for finding leaks and fresh oil. You wouldn't run a car for 2 years without an oil change-I hope.

I sell chemical products to the motor trade and see first hand the results of penny pinching. Especially this time of year with a/c failures.

I work in a motor factor, firstly the HO1234YF gas is massively expensive with dealer stealers charging £300 upwards for a regas. This gas is in all cars 2015 onwards and only about 1 in 10 independent garages have the equipment to do this, next couple of years they will be able to charge outrageous amounts until market forces drive the cost of a 5kg bottle down (currently on offer at £395 +vat for 5kg compared to 75 + vat for 13.6 kg of R134a).

Most people don't know that for as little as about £7 or £8 you can debug your own ac with a single use can.

As for penny pinching it's not exclusive to ac system servicing there's a growing number of people who buy a car and expect it to last indefinitely, one of my customers had a 60 plate meriva in a short while ago owned by an older couple who'd covered about 40k and never so much as changed the oil resulting in timing chain failure!

 

[beorhthelm]

No I'm saying car A/C systems harbour bacteria that you subsequently breath in, in reply to your quote, that its just another motor industry rip off.
I had to do quite an extensive course to become a refrigerant handler and invest several thousands of pounds into the equipment, so I do speak with some 1st hand knowledge on the subject.

really not seeing this "AC holds bacteria" thing. its a closed system correct, with gas under pressure? so how does bacteria get in, any crack to allow 1 micro-meter bacteria in is going to let an awful lot of <1 nano-meter gases out. maybe im being simplitic, just doesnt sound right. now in the evaporator and blower components, lots of moisture for bacteria to thrive in and a recognised problem with all air con.

 

[upthealbion1970]

really not seeing this "AC holds bacteria" thing. its a closed system correct, with gas under pressure? so how does bacteria get in, any crack to allow 1 micro-meter bacteria in is going to let an awful lot of <1 nano-meter gases out. maybe im being simplitic, just doesnt sound right. now in the evaporator and blower components, lots of moisture for bacteria to thrive in and a recognised problem with all air con.

The bacteria collect in the evaporator (heat exchanger) in the moisture and general crap build up that doesn't make to your pollen filter.

 

[Bwian]

Ching Ching $$$$$

It's a bigger and louder ching ching if you fail to service anything properly, including a/c systems. You might get lucky and it will never let you down, however, you might have it fail on you-at best it will need gas, at worst it's knackered and expensive to fix. It is no coincidence that poorly serviced (or not serviced at all) vehicles are unreliable, costlier to run and more likely to let you down when you least need it to.

It's weird that garages are always thought of as being rip off merchants by recommending sensible maintenance. Every day I see my customers being blamed for when things fail. Typical scenario:

Customer: I booked my car in for a service.
Garage: Ok, you haven't had a service for a long time, the minimum we recommend is an interim service but you really need a full service. Do you know when the timing belt was last changed?
Customer: I just want a cheap service, leave the timing belt for now.

Fast forward 2 months...

Customer: You serviced my car 2 months and the timing belt has just snapped-what are you going to do?
Garage: We did advise you about the timing belt but you declined. Now it is likely to cost you about 1500 quid, depending on the damage the valves have done.
Customer: You effing bunch of rip off cowboys. Right [MENTION=2092]wehatepalace[/MENTION] ?

I see this every week. Every week.

Strange that paying 200 or 300 quid to have a reliable car is considered a rip off but women's hairdressers charge a shed load (mine happily pays 60 quid regularly) for a cut and style but that's 'essential'.

 

[Bwian]

really not seeing this "AC holds bacteria" thing. its a closed system correct, with gas under pressure? so how does bacteria get in, any crack to allow 1 micro-meter bacteria in is going to let an awful lot of <1 nano-meter gases out. maybe im being simplitic, just doesnt sound right. now in the evaporator and blower components, lots of moisture for bacteria to thrive in and a recognised problem with all air con.

Unfortunately, most people talk about a/c systems as if they are one loop. A/c is simple. 2 interconnected systems make one a/c unit. The closed (gaseous) part does not contain bacteria. All of the other parts do (evaporator plate and hose, airways, vents and blower). The moisture in the airside breeds bacteria. Do nothing about it and enjoy the sick car syndrome in your vehicle. Remember legionnaires disease? Air Con bourne bacteria.

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

You wouldn't run a car for 2 years without an oil change-I hope.

That's a crap analogy if I may say so.

The engine oil has to maintain a film of separation between fast moving metal parts so is being worked hard - thus failing to renew this is putting an expensive engine damage scenario as a possibility.

Perhaps a far better example is "Would you replace the air in your tyres?" Top-up / adjust at service, yes, as it's a safety component - but would you replace all the air in a tyre if you didn't have a leak [puncture]? I don't think so.

Doing an air-con re-gas when air con is working fine is stealing ....

 

[Weststander]

What are the stats are people dying or getting ill in the U.K. from bacteria in car a/c, out of the c. 60 million car users at one time or another?

Government and council agencies, and trading standards, don't publicise the risks, which is strange in a Nanny State.

Just the proprietors of garages.

 

[beorhthelm]

Unfortunately, most people talk about a/c systems as if they are one loop. A/c is simple. 2 interconnected systems make one a/c unit. The closed (gaseous) part does not contain bacteria. All of the other parts do (evaporator plate and hose, airways, vents and blower). The moisture in the airside breeds bacteria. Do nothing about it and enjoy the sick car syndrome in your vehicle. Remember legionnaires disease? Air Con bourne bacteria.

yes, thats what i was getting at.

 

[Bwian]

That's a crap analogy if I may say so.

The engine oil has to maintain a film of separation between fast moving metal parts so is being worked hard - thus failing to renew this is putting an expensive engine damage scenario as a possibility.

Perhaps a far better example is "Would you replace the air in your tyres?" Top-up / adjust at service, yes, as it's a safety component - but would you replace all the air in a tyre if you didn't have a leak [puncture]? I don't think so.

Doing an air-con re-gas when air con is working fine is stealing ....

So there are no fast moving parts in an air conditioning sytem then? The internal parts of the compressor stay apart by magic? The engine oil analogy still stands.

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk

 

[Bwian]

What are the stats are people dying or getting ill in the U.K. from bacteria in car a/c, out of the c. 60 million car users at one time or another?

Government and council agencies, and trading standards, don't publicise the risks, which is strange in a Nanny State.

Just the proprietors of garages.

Never heard of 'Sick Car Syndrome'? It's real.

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

So there are no fast moving parts in an air conditioning sytem then? The internal parts of the compressor stay apart by magic? The engine oil analogy still stands.

Are you trying to make us believe the refrigerant gas acts as a lubricant and therefore degrades over time the same as engine oil? Really?
The air in the tyres is much closer to the truth ...

Periodical air con gas replacement is a rip-off - it's a fix on fail component to a car unless you have more money than sense [and a dodgy dealer]