No Brian O'Driscoll for the Lions vs Australia 3rd Test!...

[sten_super]

Why ? What has changed ? The Lions won. The criticism of Gatland was for the spirit of the Lions - not the fact that the team could not win. I think you may have missed the point slightly.

I didn't miss anything. The players were all looking elated, even those not in the 23. O'Driscoll said lots of nice things. Winning Lions tours don't come around that often, as I suggested above it would appear that the players would rather win in a 'serious' Lions set up than lose in a 'fun' one.

Garland was admonished for dropping O'Driscoll, and Davies played brilliantly, he was admonished for reverting to boring rugby, when they played better rugby in this Test than any of the others, and he was admonished for picking 10 players from a team that bottled it against southern hemisphere sides but he used the starting XV and the subs to perfection to batter the Aussies into submission. If you really don't think he's been completely vindicated I suggest you don't bother watching future Lions tours until/unless they consist solely of England players and management.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Clearly a British and Irish Lions team with 15 starting players from one country would be wrong, so where do you draw the line? What if the side is drawn from 2 countries exclusively? I think The Lions management got away with it, just about.

 

[Simster]

I really feel for the knobbers not enjoying this

I can't help feeling you wouldn't have posted so smugly if a team containing 10 Welshmen had been hammered. If we had lost, the post-mortem would have been all about wondering whether it had been worth risking the spirit of the team.

But they didn't and so you have to give credit to Gatland for sticking to his guns. As Pavillionare says, he just about got away with it.

 

[One Love]

I can't help feeling you wouldn't have posted so smugly if a team containing 10 Welshmen had been hammered. If we had lost, the post-mortem would have been all about wondering whether it had been worth risking the spirit of the team.

But they didn't and so you have to give credit to Gatland for sticking to his guns. As Pavillionare says, he just about got away with it.

The problem Gatland had was that of the players competing for most jerseys, the non-Welsh players weren't really performing. I don't think he had much option but to pick the in-form players even if they largely come from the same country.

I was having a conversation with family after the 2nd test and we all agreed one of the teams problems was at centre where Davies was out of position and that O'Driscoll wasn't performing but he was undroppable. So credit to him for having the balls to do it.

However, Gatland wasn't a favourite with the Irish contingent before the tour and no doubt even less popular now.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

I can't help feeling you wouldn't have posted so smugly if a team containing 10 Welshmen had been hammered. If we had lost, the post-mortem would have been all about wondering whether it had been worth risking the spirit of the team.

But they didn't and so you have to give credit to Gatland for sticking to his guns. As Pavillionare says, he just about got away with it.

I think he more than 'just about got away with it'

 

[LamieRobertson]

I think he more than 'just about got away with it'

ye was a close game

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

I didn't miss anything. The players were all looking elated, even those not in the 23. O'Driscoll said lots of nice things. Winning Lions tours don't come around that often, as I suggested above it would appear that the players would rather win in a 'serious' Lions set up than lose in a 'fun' one.

Garland was admonished for dropping O'Driscoll, and Davies played brilliantly, he was admonished for reverting to boring rugby, when they played better rugby in this Test than any of the others, and he was admonished for picking 10 players from a team that bottled it against southern hemisphere sides but he used the starting XV and the subs to perfection to batter the Aussies into submission. If you really don't think he's been completely vindicated I suggest you don't bother watching future Lions tours until/unless they consist solely of England players and management.

I have no idea what your comment about England players is. However, you are focusing on the result. That is not the point I had been making. It was about the spirit of the Lions.

And of course the players were elated to have won - it was a magnificent performance and a career highlight to be part of it.

 

[Jbanged]

As pleased as I am about the lions winning and how great of an achievement it is I can't help but feel Australia didn't really care too much about winning. Of course they would have wanted to win, but I feel that they would be more concentrated on the 4 nations. They didn't even play a proper 10 in the whole series. It's such a pivotal position and they had a winger slash fullback.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

As pleased as I am about the lions winning and how great of an achievement it is I can't help but feel Australia didn't really care too much about winning

Nonsense.

The reactions of the Australian players at the end of the first and second tests told its own story. They cared, alright.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I think he more than 'just about got away with it'

The comment wasn't about whether he'd win or not, it was about starting 10 Welshman and making it stick. Had Adam Jones and Jonathan Davies scored those tries instead of Corbisiero and Sexton then I believe the imbalance would be a more prominent feature of the story.

I've already heard one Aussie journalist when asked about a possible double for us with the Ashes say "we got beat by the Welsh, maybe we'll get beat by South Africa in the cricket too".

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

The comment wasn't about whether he'd win or not, it was about starting 10 Welshman and making it stick. Had Adam Jones and Jonathan Davies scored those tries instead of Corbisiero and Sexton then I believe the imbalance would be a more prominent feature of the story.

I've already heard one Aussie journalist when asked about a possible double for us with the Ashes say "we got beat by the Welsh, maybe we'll get beat by South Africa in the cricket too".

Typical Aussies. bad losers.

Oh, and as far as the team is concerned, pick it on merit. If it meant 10 welsh so be it. If it had meant 15 Irish so be it. Gatland's team selection was more than vindicated.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

The comment wasn't about whether he'd win or not, it was about starting 10 Welshman and making it stick. Had Adam Jones and Jonathan Davies scored those tries instead of Corbisiero and Sexton then I believe the imbalance would be a more prominent feature of the story.

I've already heard one Aussie journalist when asked about a possible double for us with the Ashes say "we got beat by the Welsh, maybe we'll get beat by South Africa in the cricket too".

Oh, and is the Aussies who have just fast tracked a Pakistani leg spinner's passport so he can play in the Ashes?

 

[Triggaaar]

Lions tours maybe about more than just winning, but the result and performance have to be major parts. If we'd lost with the 10 Welshmen, it would have been no worse than losing with a bigger mix. We weren't giving the performances we need, so it was worth changing it.

 

[sten_super]

I have no idea what your comment about England players is. However, you are focusing on the result. That is not the point I had been making. It was about the spirit of the Lions.

And of course the players were elated to have won - it was a magnificent performance and a career highlight to be part of it.

Sorry, the England comment was the drink getting the better of me. I do believe that a lot of the fuss was because he picked 10 Welsh players rather than 10 players from one nation, although I accept that's not true in your case.

The rest is entirely my point; the spirit was fantastic. Clearly Gatland took a risk, and if they'd lost there may have been problems over team unity, but what was clear from last night was that picking the best team for the game came off in all senses. They thrashed the Aussies and everyone had a fabulous time, therefore all of the speculation and accusation beforehand was unnecessary and proved ultimate wrong. I honestly think that the time for all of that was afterwards if they had lost. Garland said that he was surprised by the strength of reaction and I struggle to see how any of it was helpful once he'd picked a side.

I don't agree with the idea that you pick token players just to maintain balance, so didn't agree with the fuss in the first place, but regardless I think for Gatland to be hung, drawn and quartered as he was by some before the game had started was completely OTT.

 

[Brovion]

Great result, with Gatland (to my surprise as I thought it would be closer) being totally vindicated and not 'just about getting away with it'. Jeez. And people saying it was 'against the spirit' were/are also wrong: despite some of the parochial attitudes displayed on this thread the Lions is about four nations playing as one and we can celebrate the win the same as most of us would celebrate if a Brighton team containing six Argentinians won the play-offs.

No one's talking about the end of Lions tours now like they were after the disaster of 2005

 

[Jbanged]

Nonsense.

The reactions of the Australian players at the end of the first and second tests told its own story. They cared, alright.

As I've put after that, "of course they would have wanted to win". They are Australians.
The team selection seemed more of a warm up for them and their 4 nations.

 

[Tooting Gull]

Well one thing's for sure, Ian Robertson's "catastrophic mistake" comment is going to haunt him for a while. As I highlighted on here before the match

 

[hans kraay fan club]

I've already heard one Aussie journalist when asked about a possible double for us with the Ashes say "we got beat by the Welsh, maybe we'll get beat by South Africa in the cricket too".

Aaah, diddums. Bless the bitter little sore loser.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Oh, and is the Aussies who have just fast tracked a Pakistani leg spinner's passport so he can play in the Ashes?

I was just about to post this. Didn't they actually change legislation to make this happen!? They've had 13 spinners in the test side since Warne retired, and I think only a couple of them have been able to turn the bloody ball, the rest are just slow bowlers!

 

[SULLY COULDNT SHOOT]

Nonsense.

The reactions of the Australian players at the end of the first and second tests told its own story. They cared, alright.

I actually listened to the Autsralian commentary here and they REALLY REALLY cared. Australian players were devastated.

Most players only get one lions tour in their career so it is really important. Other competitions come and go..... Lions tours dont.