[Politics] Next Gov: Where will the money come from?

[Uh_huh_him]

This thread is about where can the next government, assumed to be Labour, find (more) money to pay for all the demands on the public purse. Most of the replies on here are just thinking of ways to squeeze more money out of someone else. My starting point, from where we are now, is that we are already taxed to the eyeballs. To get more money into the public purse we need to increase the economy. 20% VAT on a bigger economy is more income. More people in work is more income tax.

The issue of wealth redistribution is that in truth, we aren't all taxed to the eyeballs.
Sunak has come out and confessed that his effective tax rate is 22%.
His untaxed revenue isn't going to be spent within the economy, it will just be reinvested into his personal wealth.


There are still too many people perpetuating the trickle down economics myth.

 

[ElectricNaz]

I have often wondered why labour don't change the pension relief allowances. I can see no reason why a higher tax rate payer should get more benefit than the basic rate. Changing it would be easy, fair and largely well received by the electorate. An easy win on the face of it so why don't they?>

Probably because higher rate taxpayers pay double the % income tax (not NI) of everyone in the lower band once they're over that threshold.

(lets call the threshold 50k exactly for maths purposes)

An individual earning 60k paying 5% into their pension saves about £600 a year in tax relief vs if they were on the basic rate.

But at the same time they pay £2000 more in income tax compared than if they were on the basic rate.

At 100k, it's a £3000 saving vs £10k more tax vs if everything was basic rate

That's probably why they haven't messed about with it.

 

[amexer]

I’d reinstate tax on gambling given how many things you can gamble on now.

I have never understood why the stake and winnings are both not taxable. Maybe someone can explain the reasons for this exemption.. It cant be to encourage gambling.

 

[BLOCK F]

Tough shit peasants....

As I expected from some.

 

[Ethelwulf]

Easy tax the rich and upper middle class that the scum tories have made so much richer in last 14 years and use the money to support people I. Lower wages and benefits .
Labour have a better chance than 97 to stay in power for years . The people of the UK are sick to death of the tories and I hope and pray we never see a Tory government for generations

 

[ElectricNaz]

I have never understood why the stake and winnings are both not taxable. Maybe someone can explain the reasons for this exemption.. It cant be to encourage gambling.

Probably because then net losses would need to be tax deductable. Would be more hassle than it's worth to try and sort the admin for that?

Surely you wouldn't be able to deduct say 10% gambling tax on a £100 win if that same person has lost £100 the week before, etc...?

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Lots of possibilities. Raising income tax - yes, fair enough, we all want better NHS and public services; they cost money. Stop the NHS out-sourcing everything under the sun - it just puts money in the company owners' pockets. Do it in-house.
My particular idea would be a property tax, based on the value of the property - graduated, of course, so it wouldn't hugely impact the folks paying off a mortgage on their three bedroomed semi, but would generate income from larger properties - and the catch would be that the tax would be payable on the property, regardless of who owns it, Russian oligarch, trust fund in the Seychelles, whatever - the tax must be paid, or the property becomes the property of the state, either to sell or use for social housing, thus generating income and helping to solve the housing problems we have.

Utterly stupid idea and impractical on a couple of counts. Firstly the value of a property is only as much as someone will pay. As an example, I'm currently under investigation by HMRC for undervaluing properties in my late parents estate. This despite every single one selling for up to 20% less than the value given, and paid on, for IHT purposes. Some of the drop in value was due to defects in the properties found at survey - how do you account for this on a properties value for tax purposes ?


Equally - some people are property 'value' rich but cash poor. The idea of taxing a property's value takes no account of ability to pay.

 

[HeaviestTed]

If they legalised drugs, boom, a billion dollar industry nicely taxable up to the hilt.

Tax betting companies.

Finance companies to pay 50% corporation tax. Buying a car, house, dental, vetinary treatment has been f***ed up by the finance industry. They make more profits, we end up paying more and more and more. Tax the ****s.

Cut Vat to nothing - inflation from last year removed, lower interest rates, everyone can spend again.

Simple.

RDZ takes Brighton to top of the league.

Next year is gonna be amazing.

 

[sparkie]

Join the Single Market and reap the financial rewards.

Silver-bullet-tastic.

 

[GT49er]

"graduated, of course, so it wouldn't hugely impact the folks paying off a mortgage on their three bedroomed semi"

So which part of that did you fail to comprehend? And who said anything about 10%?

Bonkers.

 

[GT49er]

Utterly stupid idea and impractical on a couple of counts. Firstly the value of a property is only as much as someone will pay. As an example, I'm currently under investigation by HMRC for undervaluing properties in my late parents estate. This despite every single one selling for up to 20% less than the value given, and paid on, for IHT purposes. Some of the drop in value was due to defects in the properties found at survey - how do you account for this on a properties value for tax purposes ?

Been doing it perfectly adequately for rates/Council Tax for donkey's years. Properties are valued quite routinely everyday - and you seem to think valuing properties is a new and impossible concept?

OK...........

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Been doing it perfectly adequately for rates/Council Tax for donkey's years. Properties are valued quite routinely everyday - and you seem to think valuing properties is a new and impossible concept?

OK...........

You don't seem to understand the valuation for council tax purposes. In England, they were on bulk, valued for taxation purposes BUT they weren't individually valued. For example, all the houses in Westfield Crescent in Hollingbury were given a guessitmate value. No account was taken of improvements, defects etc. Council Tax is not based directly on the value of a property - it's based on where, in 1991, the council thought a bulk of houses would value in a quite wide band. Nowadays, thanks to people developing properties and some areas being up and coming the council tax band has no relation to the actual 'value' of the property in question.

The idea of taxing someone on the true value of their property is moronic.

ADDITION - rates were based on rateable value - i.e. what it could be rented for - not property value.

 

[CurbishleyRange]

Do away with gold plated public sector and MPs pension schemes.
Let ‘em join the rest of us plebs and our pension arrangements.
That’ll upset a few on here, no doubt, but could save a a bob or two.

Cut the one perk (already squeezed and squeezed over the years) that the people have who are holding our decimated hospitals, schools and social services departments together. Probably not the best idea in the current climate.
The MPs can do one though

 

[BLOCK F]

Cut the one perk (already squeezed and squeezed over the years) that the people have who are holding our decimated hospitals, schools and social services departments together. Probably not the best idea in the current climate.
The MPs can do one though

Well, it will happen one day.

 

[Bodian]

Do away with gold plated public sector and MPs pension schemes.
Let ‘em join the rest of us plebs and our pension arrangements.
That’ll upset a few on here, no doubt, but could save a a bob or two.

Please take care with the term 'public sector'.

Us in Local Government (ie: part of the public sector) belong to the Local Government Pension Scheme - which is fully funded through contributions. It is far from gold-plated. Especially as it's based on a percentage of our salary - which over the last 10 years or so has fallen way below inflation.

 

[vegster]

There needs to be some way of stopping money being made here and spirited away abroad to avoid taxes...

 

[BLOCK F]

Please take care with the term 'public sector'.

Us in Local Government (ie: part of the public sector) belong to the Local Government Pension Scheme - which is fully funded through contributions. It is far from gold-plated. Especially as it's based on a percentage of our salary - which over the last 10 years or so has fallen way below inflation.

I am certainly no pension expert, but I understand that your scheme is still very generous and according to Mr.Google, you are looking forward to an increase of 6.7% this year.
Quite a bit of our Council Tax goes towards LGPS , but hey, good luck to you whilst it lasts. It is a scheme that most of those on DC schemes that rely on the vagaries of stock market performance would love.
One can argue for and against the fairness of having DB pensions for some whilst the rest have to ‘make do’ with DC schemes, but is it equitable and for how long will it be affordable?
Anyway, I just threw it into the ‘how to raise dosh pot’.

 

[Bodian]

I am certainly no pension expert, but I understand that your scheme is still very generous and according to Mr.Google, you are looking forward to an increase of 6.7% this year.
Quite a bit of our Council Tax goes towards LGPS , but hey, good luck to you whilst it lasts. It is a scheme that most of those on DC schemes that rely on the vagaries of stock market performance would love.
One can argue for and against the fairness of having DB pensions for some whilst the rest have to ‘make do’ with DC schemes, but is it equitable and for how long will it be affordable?
Anyway, I just threw it into the ‘how to raise dosh pot’.

Mr Google must know something that no local government officer knows. Or even the local government chiefs.

We have not even been made an offer of a pay rise for 2024 yet. Despite the financial year having already started.

We'll be lucky to get 3%.

Anyway - scrapping it wouldn't save much money for the Government, which is what the thread is about!

 

[amexer]

Probably because then net losses would need to be tax deductable. Would be more hassle than it's worth to try and sort the admin for that?

Surely you wouldn't be able to deduct say 10% gambling tax on a £100 win if that same person has lost £100 the week before, etc...?

Dont understand why not. Certainly if I had a winning bet would be happy to pay a % in tax. I would also add a tax on the stake.

 

[dazzer6666]

I have never understood why the stake and winnings are both not taxable. Maybe someone can explain the reasons for this exemption.. It cant be to encourage gambling.

The government rakes in around 3 billion a year from gambling…..15% tax on operating profits (including offshore operators licenced here).