[Football] Newcastle fans and YouTuber support Saudi, confront protesters

[Tyrone Biggums]

Then came the cost cutting and abandonment of all sporting ambition.

Which is quite a bit different to cutting up humans.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Weirdly, that view isn't shared by all the people making comments. It's not a problem at all, the rest of the world is out of step.

He lists countless horrible things the Saudis do then tries to wax lyrical how wonderful they really are and that by being nice to them they'll come around.

They really are thick up there.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Saudi Arabia: Man Sentenced to Death for Tweets

A Saudi court has sentenced a man to death based solely on his Twitter and YouTube activity.

www.hrw.org

 

[The Fish]

Which is quite a bit different to cutting up humans.

It is, very different. I'm not sure this is the gotcha you thought it was going to be. I've made it clear, several times, the Saudi state should not have been allowed by the PL, the FA or the UK Government to own a football club.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

It is, very different. I'm not sure this is the gotcha you thought it was going to be. I've made it clear, several times, the Saudi state should not have been allowed by the PL, the FA or the UK Government to own a football club.

No gotcha.

Just a reminder there were plenty of Newcastle fans protesting Ashley constantly. Yet now the club is owned by utter vile humans the lack of protesting is telling.

Given the back slapping that happened when fan power contributed to getting rid of what your fan base perceived as a bad owner I do wonder why now you have worse owners why your fanbase isn't protesting even more?

 

[The Fish]

No gotcha.

Just a reminder there were plenty of Newcastle fans protesting Ashley constantly. Yet now the club is owned by utter vile humans the lack of protesting is telling.

Given the back slapping that happened when fan power contributed to getting rid of what your fan base perceived as a bad owner I do wonder why now you have worse owners why your fanbase isn't protesting even more?

Protests and boycotts did nothing to get rid of the previous owner. The very fact you state that they did shows how little you actually know about the subject. Ashley sold us when, and only when, he received a huge amount of money up front. He couldn't give a toss about the protests.

Also the protests against Ashley were because of how he was running our club, not because of his treatment of his Sports Direct Employees.

By the by, using a youtube vlog as justification to criticise a large and varied group of people would be pretty thick, no?

 

[Uh_huh_him]

I have had a couple of conversations with a Newcastle supporting acquaintance, on the ownership situation.
In all other matters he is a very level headed well informed and sensible commentator.
However on this issue, he resorts to all sorts of whataboutery and finger pointing.

Similarly my left leaning, liberal minded, defender of the oppressed, Man City supporting mate.
Cannot bring himself to question the ownership of his club.

It's difficult to separate your love of your club from the sins of theownership.

 

[The Fish]

I have had a couple of conversations with a Newcastle supporting acquaintance, on the ownership situation.
In all other matters he is a very level headed well informed and sensible commentator.
However on this issue, he resorts to all sorts of whataboutery and finger pointing.

Similarly my left leaning, liberal minded, defender of the oppressed, Man City supporting mate.
Cannot bring himself to question the ownership of his club.

It's difficult to separate your love of your club from the sins of theownership.

Exactly this. My mate who spoke so well about how he felt United with Pride let down the LGBT community, still goes to matches, still gets excited about new signings and all that. I've nothing but respect for those who walked away, but I'm not going to condemn those of us who couldn't/didn't.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Protests and boycotts did nothing to get rid of the previous owner. The very fact you state that they did shows how little you actually know about the subject. Ashley sold us when, and only when, he received a huge amount of money up front. He couldn't give a toss about the protests.

Also the protests against Ashley were because of how he was running our club, not because of his treatment of his Sports Direct Employees.

By the by, using a youtube vlog as justification to criticise a large and varied group of people would be pretty thick, no?

The majority of Newcastle fans are perfectly fine with the Saudis owning them. It's why so many are still going to games.

That's how thick and morally bankrupt the fan base is. That they would let such vile people use their supposed beloved club to sportswash their abhorrent image boggles the mind.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

It is, very different. I'm not sure this is the gotcha you thought it was going to be. I've made it clear, several times, the Saudi state should not have been allowed by the PL, the FA or the UK Government to own a football club.

The Newcastle fans could have stopped it.

Sustained and vociferous protests at the time of the sale would have made the whole point of the exercise (to sports wash) counterproductive.

Instead they were welcomed with open arms, with the promise of a few new players. Such a superficial and ignorant fan base

 

[Papa Lazarou]

The Newcastle fans could have stopped it.

Sustained and vociferous protests at the time of the sale would have made the whole point of the exercise (to sports wash) counterproductive.

Instead they were welcomed with open arms, with the promise of a few new players. Such a superficial and ignorant fan base

Newcastle fans asked to stop wearing Saudi-inspired headdresses and clothing - TNT Sports

Newcastle have asked supporters to stop wearing Saudi-inspired headdress and clothing, which have been seen at St James’ Park since the recent takeover.

www.tntsports.co.uk

 

[TWOCHOICEStom]

Given the back slapping that happened when fan power contributed to getting rid of what your fan base perceived as a bad owner I do wonder why now you have worse owners why your fanbase isn't protesting even more?

Oh I know! I know! Me me me!

 

[The Fish]

The majority of Newcastle fans are perfectly fine with the Saudis owning them. It's why so many are still going to games.

That's how thick and morally bankrupt the fan base is. That they would let such vile people use their supposed beloved club to sportswash their abhorrent image boggles the mind.

No, they're not. The overwhelming majority would much preferred to be owned by a local businessman done good. Unfortunately we don't have a Bloom knocking about. The reason so many are going to games is because Newcastle United existed long before the Saudis owned it and it'll exist long after they've gone. Football may be a hobby that you can pick up and put down easily, but for the majority of Newcastle fans it is not. I'd wager were some awful regime were to buy out your club, you'd find the choice much harder than you make it out to be.

Repeatedly calling an entire fanbase thick and morally bankrupt reveals more about you, than it does us.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

It is, very different. I'm not sure this is the gotcha you thought it was going to be. I've made it clear, several times, the Saudi state should not have been allowed by the PL, the FA or the UK Government to own a football club.

That is quite a convenient line though. ‘ The authorities shouldn’t have let it happen’ (true) ‘so leave us alone to enjoy all the money’ (no, football people won’t do that). If you murder somebody and the authorities let you get away with it on a technicality I’m afraid you can’t expect everyone to absolve you of blame,

 

[The Fish]

The Newcastle fans could have stopped it.

Sustained and vociferous protests at the time of the sale would have made the whole point of the exercise (to sports wash) counterproductive.

Instead they were welcomed with open arms, with the promise of a few new players. Such a superficial and ignorant fan base

No, they couldn't. We couldn't oust the previous owner, despite years of concerted effort on our part. Boycotts, protests, getting the message out in the media, 10k season ticket holders just walking away. What makes you think any similar protests would have stopped this takeover?

The exit of Ashley was celebrated long and hard, that's what the celebrations were genuinely about. I see some wag has put up a picture of a few dickheads in headdresses, I can tell you that there were maybe a dozen idiots wearing that stuff. But of course those few morons were splashed around every website covering the story. Makes good copy, doesn't it?

Again with the petty insults. All a bit childish, isn't it?

 

[rippleman]

Repeatedly calling an entire fanbase thick and morally bankrupt reveals more about you, than it does us.

If the fanbase does not understand how your club has been manipulated by the Saudis for the purposes of sportswashing, it is thick.

If it does understand how your club has been manipulated by the Saudis for the purposes of sportswashing and is perfectly accepting of it, it is morally bankrupt.

Both fair and honest assessments I would say.

 

[The Fish]

That is quite a convenient line though. ‘ The authorities shouldn’t have let it happen’ (true) ‘so leave us alone to enjoy all the money’ (no, football people won’t do that). If you murder somebody and the authorities let you get away with it on a technicality I’m afraid you can’t expect everyone to absolve you of blame,

The second part of the first sentence is doing some pretty heavy lifting there. Every time we make an outlandish purchase sportswashing should absolutely be brought up, if we ever win something it should be brought up, every time Saudi Arabia holds an international friendly it should be talked about. But blaming the fans for something they have little to no power over is insane, especially when, if you're honest, the behaviour of Newcastle fans would have been replicated up and down the country. Even now, Manchester United fans are clamouring for Qatari ownership, some Liverpool fans are so desperate to see their owners gone they'd welcome a similar bid. It is petty partisan horseshit to think Newcastle fans are somehow unique in going to a match after they've been bought out by an horrific regime.

And the second sentence, are you seriously likening supporting a football club with committing murder? If you are, you need to step away from the internet and have a lie down.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

No, they're not. The overwhelming majority would much preferred to be owned by a local businessman done good. Unfortunately we don't have a Bloom knocking about. The reason so many are going to games is because Newcastle United existed long before the Saudis owned it and it'll exist long after they've gone. Football may be a hobby that you can pick up and put down easily, but for the majority of Newcastle fans it is not. I'd wager were some awful regime were to buy out your club, you'd find the choice much harder than you make it out to be.

Repeatedly calling an entire fanbase thick and morally bankrupt reveals more about you, than it does us.

Your fanbase are not thick and morally bankrupt. However individuals within it clearly are. I don’t know how many individuals this amounts to but it looks like a lot on tv. Doubtless if the Saudis bought our club there would be many on here who would behave in the same manner as your fans. They have said so on threads in NSC. They have no right to condemn your fans. Many of us would walk away though because if you know our history you will know how important we view the ownership. What you and your fellow fans cannot pick up and put down easily is success, not your club. If you don’t have a local billionaire then accept whatever place in the pyramid is delivered by an owner that allows you to look at yourself in the mirror each morning. The football authorities approved this ownership because of the money and because your fans demonstrated in favour of it rather than against. It was easy for them to approve the deal. It’s as simple as that.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

The second part of the first sentence is doing some pretty heavy lifting there. Every time we make an outlandish purchase sportswashing should absolutely be brought up, if we ever win something it should be brought up, every time Saudi Arabia holds an international friendly it should be talked about. But blaming the fans for something they have little to no power over is insane, especially when, if you're honest, the behaviour of Newcastle fans would have been replicated up and down the country. Even now, Manchester United fans are clamouring for Qatari ownership, some Liverpool fans are so desperate to see their owners gone they'd welcome a similar bid. It is petty partisan horseshit to think Newcastle fans are somehow unique in going to a match after they've been bought out by an horrific regime.

And the second sentence, are you seriously likening supporting a football club with committing murder? If you are, you need to step away from the internet and have a lie down.

Your last paragraph; no, I was just explaining a point using an example. I could use a different example if you prefer but so could you. I don’t need to step anywhere. Trying to illustrate my point and you’ve called me mad.
I agree that many fans of the clubs you mention (and also Brighton) would be exactly the same as yours. That’s hardly a convincing argument when talking to people who wouldn’t accept such ownership though, is it ?

 

[The Fish]

If the fanbase does not understand how your club has been manipulated by the Saudis for the purposes of sportswashing, it is thick.

If it does understand how your club has been manipulated by the Saudis for the purposes of sportswashing and is perfectly accepting of it, it is morally bankrupt.

Both fair and honest assessments I would say.

How myopic. Life, ironically, is not black and white. People make concessions and compromises all the time.

People are well aware that the Saudis are using us to Sportswash their regime (the efficacy of this plan is very questionable, but that's for another day), they're also well aware that the Saudis are in bed with the government, the PL, the FA, UK business, and myriad organisations across the Western world. Can you explain why it falls to fans of a parochial football club to stand against the tide of whitewashing that regime?

Explain to a grandfather who's been attending matches for 60yrs, taken his son and then his granddaughter to matches for years, explain to him that he must walk away so that some fans of other clubs think better of him? Then explain to 24yr old who's experienced mostly shit under Ashley to walk away the minute we're beginning to be run as an actual sporting concern, explain why he should walk away. Then do that another 51,998 times, explain to each of those distinct people, with distinct reasons for going to the match why they should all walk away from the club they've loved all their lives.

And for what? The temporary and gossamer thin praise from fans of other clubs? At best the Saudis leave and are replaced by a similarly ambitious set of owners. What's the likelihood of that? More likely we get another Ashley, or worse, the Saudis go off and buy another Premier League club whose fans get the same shit, but who don't walk away.