Neil Oliver.

[Nitram]

Classic modern historian, not bothering to memorise his dates.

We need to bring back STANDARDS.

Please not another flag waving patriot.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Come on, that’s a bit of a leap, so Neil Oliver is as guilty of that quote as Starkey, is he?

And what I’m talking about throughout this thread is exactly what you are doing here: “the repulsive Toby Young”, “the disgusting Rod Little”. We can no longer have sensible debates without people resorting to insults.

Listen Harry, I’ve always liked you as a poster but you don’t know me, all we have in common is the love of a certain football team, why should we agree on every other subject? And when we don’t agree, why should insults fly? I used the word ‘woke’ in my first answer, in what was meant to be a tongue in cheek way. Granted, it’s nigh on impossible to detect nuance etc in many replies, but I don’t think the vitriol is needed, at all.

As Neil says take the kids and walk away. You have a choice, find a country where the government and the majority of the people agree with you that you're in an abusive relationship, Belarus springs to mind. Peru thought the same for a while, that would be a joy ride. In the meantime countries like New Zealand will keep their head and tread a cautious path to the benefit of their citizens, oh and good luck getting in there, my call would be zero chance

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

Please not another flag waving patriot.

If you thought that was a remotely serious post, that it could pass as such says everything about why I don't bother trying to engage in serious conversation on here anymore.

 

[BenGarfield]

As Neil says take the kids and walk away. You have a choice, find a country where the government and the majority of the people agree with you that you're in an abusive relationship, Belarus springs to mind. Peru thought the same for a while, that would be a joy ride. In the meantime countries like New Zealand will keep their head and tread a cautious path to the benefit of their citizens, oh and good luck getting in there, my call would be zero chance

Of course he could also choose from several other areas which had little or no lockdown and didnt suffer , e.g. Sweden, Croatia, Finland, Texas, Florida, South Dakota

 

[Hampster Gull]

Of course he could also choose from several other areas which had little or no lockdown and didnt suffer , e.g. Sweden, Croatia, Finland, Texas, Florida, South Dakota

Didn’t suffer?

 

[vegster]

Abolutely, but the science of COVID and lockdowns is a disputed one and in the main we only hear one version via the main stream media.

You have to listen to all the reasoning and the pro's and con's of every action the government took or didn't take and try to make an informed choice on what is the greater or lesser evil in all the decisions, As has been pointed out here on various threads at many times, you can always find the science that you agree with if you look hard enough.

There will always be dissenting voices in science, that's how science progresses, by taking odd routes or radical actions. it's not mentioned too much as it is something we prefer not to think about but, science and in particular, medicine, only advances on the experience of failure, ie : Death. When Christian Barnard performed the first heart transplant the patient lived only 18 days, however lessons were learned and survival times are generally a lot longer now, yes people died but in a good cause. Remember, even 20 years ago you could still " Buy " the science that said that smoking did not cause lung cancer.

Remember that convention that the Earth was the centre of the Universe and the Solar system ? people died trying to prove that the Earth orbited the Sun. Anyway, any ideas on the true figures of Covid cases and fatalities in Russia ?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Because I’ve no idea how to do multiple quotes I’ll just use this one. I was just stating what my opinion on Neil Oliver was, indeed I hadn’t even listened to what he was saying here. And no, I don’t agree 100%. My problem is this, we just cannot have gentle discussions anymore it seems. Fine, lots of you didn’t like what he said, but the vitriol against him, come on, really?
I have many friends who’s opinions on certain subjects I disagree with, it doesn’t make me attack them with personal insults. What Oliver is saying is a view held by quite a few people, again, not me. I’m just saying I like the fella and just because he has a different opinion on this subject, that’s his right. I mean, half you people getting enraged about it think GB News is some far-right news organisation that you wouldn’t be found dead watching, so what’s the problem?

Stop digging. And nobody is levelling personal insults at you.

The first mistake you made was to back Oliver, implying that presenting a decent telly programme exonerated him from anything, even though you later state you "hadn’t even listened to what he was saying here". The second was to feign astonishment that people who have listened to what he was saying might take exception to your endorsement. Then there was the 'woke' quip, which may seem to some that you knew exactly what Oliver was doing, and that you agree with it.

The 'free speech doesn't justify personal attacks' line is a bit feeble, frankly. Happy to move on and dismiss your predicament as carelessness. But do stop. Now. Please.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

You have to listen to all the reasoning and the pro's and con's of every action the government took or didn't take and try to make an informed choice on what is the greater or lesser evil in all the decisions, As has been pointed out here on various threads at many times, you can always find the science that you agree with if you look hard enough.

There will always be dissenting voices in science, that's how science progresses, by taking odd routes or radical actions. it's not mentioned too much as it is something we prefer not to think about but, science and in particular, medicine, only advances on the experience of failure, ie : Death. When Christian Barnard performed the first heart transplant the patient lived only 18 days, however lessons were learned and survival times are generally a lot longer now, yes people died but in a good cause. Remember, even 20 years ago you could still " Buy " the science that said that smoking did not cause lung cancer.

Remember that convention that the Earth was the centre of the Universe and the Solar system ? people died trying to prove that the Earth orbited the Sun. Anyway, any ideas on the true figures of Covid cases and fatalities in Russia ?

I suspect you're wasting your breath.

It is the right of every layman to listen to what suits them, draw any conclusion they see fit, then jog on.

What baffles me is that people who have decided to bathe in their own confirmation bias feel the need to go on a football forum and tell everyone else they have it wrong. Just have the confidence in your own certainties and clear off, would be my advice.

The rest of us are perhaps having a conversation to help ourselves through this, just like we try to engage the collective spirit over transfers, managerial appointments and the like.

 

[Dick Head]

If you thought that was a remotely serious post, that it could pass as such says everything about why I don't bother trying to engage in serious conversation on here anymore.

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

View attachment 138994

Hoist by my own petard

 

[Nitram]

Hoist by my own petard

I am disgraced, impeached, and baffled here,
Pierced to the soul with slander's venomed spear.

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

I am disgraced, impeached, and baffled here,
Pierced to the soul with slander's venomed spear.

I prefer to view myself as a Falstaff like figue.

I suspect I'm closer to Arnold Rimmer.

 

[NorthstandRacoon]

Love how someone goes from 'having a brain' to 'not having a brain' because he does not hold the same opinion as you.

Are you so binary with everything in life?

haha no I'm not, however, it's quite clear and easy to understand that lockdowns were necessary at the time at the peak of the pandemic. Those who disagree just don't like being told what to do. I'd agree with him if there was another lockdown though.

 

[OzMike]

He used to piss me off in his documentary programs, all that walking about when talking was annoying, just stand still ffs !

 

[Hampster Gull]

He used to piss me off in his documentary programs, all that walking about when talking was annoying, just stand still ffs !

It was an early insight into his muddled thinking

 

[n1 gull]

Top Man I like him

 

[faoileán]

Top Man I like him

Bottom Man, I hate him

 

[Randy McNob]

Complete loon

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

A champion of free speech and frowned upon by the usual suspects
Regards
DF

 

[Bakero]

A champion of free speech and frowned upon by the usual suspects
Regards
DF

Would you rather those with opposing views just stay quiet? Whatever happened to free speech?