national strike

[beorhthelm]

... And why are the present Govt. obsessed with paying off the Deficit in 5 years instead of 10?

this has nothing to do with the deficit (more fool any politician who says so, they devalue their argument). the last Labour government had started to look at addressing the pensions problem and many of the proposals are what they had already started work on. its been quietly discussed for decades, it hasnt suddenly become a problem, just finally being addressed.

 

[Twinkle Toes]

this has nothing to do with the deficit (more fool any politician who says so, they devalue their argument). the last Labour government had started to look at addressing the pensions problem and many of the proposals are what they had already started work on. its been quietly discussed for decades, it hasnt suddenly become a problem, just finally being addressed.

Well what is 'the pensions problem'? Surely it's about Govt. expenditure & their intention to reduce it? They can dress it up however they like, but the fact of the matter is that State Teacher's Pensions will be reduced as a result of this policy (regardless of what the Ministers are/aren't currently saying). Bearing in mind that ruthlessly reducing expenditure seems to be the way that The Govt. are approching the current economic malaise (allied to their pledge of obsessional reduction of the Nation's current deficit), surely this pensions issue is just part of the bigger picture?

 

[sten_super]

Well what is 'the pensions problem'? Surely it's about Govt. expenditure & their intention to reduce it? They can dress it up however they like, but the fact of the matter is that State Teacher's Pensions will be reduced as a result of this policy (regardless of what the Ministers are/aren't currently saying). Bearing in mind that ruthlessly reducing expenditure seems to be the way that The Govt. are approching the current economic malaise (allied to their pledge of obsessional reduction of the Nation's current deficit), surely this pensions issue is just part of the bigger picture?

Except that, as mentioned earlier, many of the more controversial (with the unions) measures that the government want to introduce are those that were suggested in the Hutton report commissioned by the previous government.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

The most annoying phrase I keep hearing on the radio from callers at the moment is "We need to take it on the chin". I say, why should we take it on the chin, we didn't create this financial meltdown did we?.

From what I can see the banks got greedy, they gambled with our money, they gambled with money they did not have, it backfired on them, then we bailed some of these banks out with tax payers money, and everyone is now suffering because of it. That is probably apart from the few thousand at the top of the chain, who have left their desks before the police arrived. If anyone thinks this is fair, then I really worry about what fair means in society. May be I should be a bit greedier like the banks did and take what I can.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Sorry wrong thread

 

[Curious Orange]

Well what is 'the pensions problem'?

People living too long, and not enough money floating around to actually fund their retirement in anything resembling comfort? It was an obvious problem to anyone working in the pensions/annuities industry ten years ago when I was a lowly annuity administrator - and its still a problem now.

... they really should repeal all those anti-smoking laws you know.

*ducks for cover*

 

[Twinkle Toes]

Except that, as mentioned earlier, many of the more controversial (with the unions) measures that the government want to introduce are those that were suggested in the Hutton report commissioned by the previous government.

Fair comment sten, although it doesn't surprise me in the least that the last administration were at it too. Frankly, I wouldn't trust any of these bastard Politico's any further than I could spit canal water (& I can't see that changing any time soon).

 

[BHAFC_Pandapops]

19! What makes you think you will still be working for the same boss in the next 10 years, let alone when you retire.



And what if you thought that was the age of 65 only to be told as you get close to that age that you will work another 5 years just for the same pension or even less.



How many of those final salary schemes closed because of mismanagement by companies and trustees? Companies taking pension holidays and the like and when the economy takes a downturn, finding they can't meet their liabilities and closing the schemes, (except of course to company directors). The other elephant in the room is of course how ftse directors have seen their salaries rocket over the last few years in a time that was supposedly a recession with the grafters at the bottom of the pile accepting redundancces, wage freezes crap pensions etc etc.

not the same boss drew, ours move on regularly enough. By boss I meant the people who are the top of the top of the company.

 

[beorhthelm]

People living too long, and not enough money floating around to actually fund their retirement in anything resembling comfort? It was an obvious problem to anyone working in the pensions/annuities industry ten years ago when I was a lowly annuity administrator - and its still a problem now.

This. in a nutshell. you dont have to be in the industry to understand, just have use of a calculator and look at the numbers. remove the party partisan politics and anti-banker rhetoric, this is the biggest long term cconomic problem we face.

 

[Twinkle Toes]

People living too long, and not enough money floating around to actually fund their retirement in anything resembling comfort? It was an obvious problem to anyone working in the pensions/annuities industry ten years ago when I was a lowly annuity administrator - and its still a problem now.

... they really should repeal all those anti-smoking laws you know.



*ducks for cover*

I'm surprised the Euthanasia Lobbyists haven't been heralded as society's new saviours in this brave new world - where the elderly are seen as useless, financial liabilities...

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I'm not public sector and support the strike, although I feel in a minority about it and feel the government will win the PR war. Divide and Conquer as the guy above said

I remember the right-wingers in my life banging on about Blair and Brown raiding their pensions, and I was sympathetic to them at the time, rather annoyed that they now have the opposite opinion about public-sector pensions.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Indeed it is.

ps My Sister (who's a teacher) is out on Wednesday - & fair play to her. The all-new pension rules that the Govt. are railroading are a f***ing disgrace. I bet they won't be attempting to introduce similar draconion measures for bleedin' MP's & their greedy mates in The City.

MPs pensions I agree with you but I'm really not sure how you link pensions in the city to this dispute ? While there might be a populist view that the city / bankers caused the current financial situation it was combined with poor government. The people in the city have to pay for their own pensions and their employers contributions rarely match what the public sectors employer pay ( i.e. the government ).

In my mind it's very simple - a pension scheme HAS to be self sufficient. The public sector pots might be able to claim that at the moment but they won't be in the future. The schemes need sorting now or they will end up in the same mess as the private sectors final salary schemes at which point we'll be able to welcome all public sector workers to the hell that is the private pension scheme. Public sector employees need to explain how they expect their pensions to be funded if it isn't from their own pocket - and more taxpayers money is NOT the answer.

 

[Lenny Rider]

Whilst strike action is not necessarily allways the answer, I do have sympathy with anyone who feels strongly enough to miss a days work.

The honest hardworking people in this country, some of whom will strike tomorrow, must look at the under class who continually sponge off the welfare state and the mega rich at the other end of the scale with all their loopholes, dodges and tax effieciency schemes, and think 'We're getting shafted from both ends"

 

[beorhthelm]

Public sector employees need to explain how they expect their pensions to be funded if it isn't from their own pocket - and more taxpayers money is NOT the answer.

i dont expect the employees to explain anything. i do expect the unions to explain the situation to their members and negotiate suitable deals. that resolves the long term issues, rather than simply create a road block. when i saw the deal offered the other week i was surprised how good it was, how far it has moved. but the unions seem to not want any compromise, no change is their only accepted outcome. thats just not viable.

 

[The Auctioneer]

Sorry if this has been said before but bit of a long thread. No work ...no pay! Is that the case? If so, strike for as long as you like. If I do not work, I do not get paid. Enough said.

 

[Monsieur Le Plonk]

What if they changed it when you were 50 after 30 years of contributions, to be told that firstly you'll pay more in contributions, secondly you'll get a worse pension, and thirdly you'll have to work 6-8 years longer before you can get that pension. Cos that's what they are doing.

I suspect your tune might change.

Do you really expect the world to be the same as it was 50 years ago. Blame the bankers, blame the politicians, blame the Euro, blame who you like for the current situation. But realise that we live in a different and fecked up world and things HAVE changed.

People living too long, and not enough money floating around to actually fund their retirement in anything resembling comfort? It was an obvious problem to anyone working in the pensions/annuities industry ten years ago when I was a lowly annuity administrator - and its still a problem now.

Completely agree.

 

[sten_super]

Sorry if this has been said before but bit of a long thread. No work ...no pay! Is that the case? If so, strike for as long as you like. If I do not work, I do not get paid. Enough said.

Yes, that is the case - anyone on strike tomorrow will not get paid. However, those that aren't on strike but are unable to work (e.g. teachers with a non-striking union whose school has been closed) will be paid as normal.

 

[The Auctioneer]

Too many people going to university instead of paying taxes.
Less university,
More taxes,
I retire early,(Thus more jobs)
You can have my job,
Pay more taxes
I live comfortably ever after.
Solved...except for the Unions who still want more.
Is this a chicken/egg story?
Back to my lunchtime beer.........Job? Only kidding.

 

[Dr Q]

My missus (a Teacher) is on strike tomorrow, and good on her! She will lose a days pay, although she'll probably be marking or lesson planning anyway. This strike is probably a futile effort, as I doubt it will change things, but its their right to strike and I fully support it.

Oddly enough, her Union rep didn't vote to strike. I doubt they'll be in that role much longer!

 

[jackanada]

No contributions are made by the military towards their pensions. Any public sector bashers want to take on that one? Bonus points if you can remain logically consistent with your other views.