My respect for TB keeps on growing

[Hungry Joe]

It sounds like the Grabban deal has stalled for now because TB is refusing to be played by the agent. Seems we want to buy players to improve this team but not at any cost. If that's the case I couldn't agree with his approach more. It's a sign - along with his investment in infrastructure, commitment to FFP etc - that we're determined to build a club with a healthy, long term, sustainable future. If that means we win the race a little more slowly, but with a damn site more integrity, then I'm all for it. I really do love this football club.

Well said.

 

[chaileyjem]

If we can't buy players of Grabben's pedigree (lets face it, not great) whilst having the highest attendance in the league and being the most expensive team to watch then we may well be in this league for a very long time. Lets hope the new fans are up for the long haul.

There's a big difference between "can't" and "won't"...

 

[B.W.]

It sounds like the Grabban deal has stalled for now because TB is refusing to be played by the agent. Seems we want to buy players to improve this team but not at any cost. If that's the case I couldn't agree with his approach more. It's a sign - along with his investment in infrastructure, commitment to FFP etc - that we're determined to build a club with a healthy, long term, sustainable future. If that means we win the race a little more slowly, but with a damn site more integrity, then I'm all for it. I really do love this football club.

Best post I've seen on here in ages. TB plays a blinder again.

 

[bravohotelalpha]

Not the same though, is it? - different negotiating structure.

On a one to one basis the tools you mention are fine - in a selling or buying situation where there is active competition, not so clever - that's why international businesses have sales forces and negotiators that travel, so decisions can be made immediately - especially where the two parties are in such different timezones as the UK and Australia.

Fair comment - I do have one roaming colleague based overseas - and in order to accommodate time zones we start work early - so it is possible and nothing is insurmountable, even when not dealing one to one eg video conferencing. Let's face it tb is not stupid, having invested so much (and not only his money) he is not going to go to Australia at this time of year if he is not in a position to deal with all this transfer business. Having said that I reckon the only thing more important to tb than the club is his family and his wife is Australian - but even so tb would have the necessaries in place to deal with any transfer matters arising. In short tony in oz is not a problem.

 

[Vegas Seagull]

Fair comment - I do have one roaming colleague based overseas - and in order to accommodate time zones we start work early - so it is possible and nothing is insurmountable, even when not dealing one to one eg video conferencing. Let's face it tb is not stupid, having invested so much (and not only his money) he is not going to go to Australia at this time of year if he is not in a position to deal with all this transfer business. Having said that I reckon the only thing more important to tb than the club is his family and his wife is Australian - but even so tb would have the necessaries in place to deal with any transfer matters arising. In short tony in oz is not a problem.

He's there to play poker, even I have had uninterrupted 9 hour sessions that seem to have only lasted 2, his could well be even longer...

 

[The Fifth Column]

That's the worry - The Albion and maybe a small minority of other Clubs diligently adhere to FFP - but when other Clubs are found to have transgressed the Football League then bottle it and The Premiership close ranks so Clubs that get promoted having splashed the cash get immunity from sanction or just get a petty fine that isn't any deterrent to financial profligacy.

Then there's the parachute money. How are clubs within FFP expected to compete with that clout?

There has been too much willingness by the football authorities to indulge the Prem clubs. If the Premiership could it would ignore the FA and England too and just do its own thing.

Finally there are the agents who bleed money out of footie.

You have to admire Tony Bloom for getting himself in so deep into a business that has such an uneven playing field. I guess his heart has been behind much of his initial generosity but now his head is ruling how he takes us forward.

I'm fairly certain I read somewhere that the parachute payments are not factored into the calculations when considering FFP, the same goes for large sponsorship payouts that are designed to funnel extra money in from companies owned by the clubs rich owners. I believe FFP revolves primarily around club turnover and money the club actually takes in from gate receipts and other legitimate sources, merchandise players being sold etc. I may be completely wrong but I'm sure I read this somewhere before.

 

[bravohotelalpha]

He's there to play poker, even I have had uninterrupted 9 hour sessions that seem to have only lasted 2, his could well be even longer...

Uninterrupted 9 hour sessions - you lucky boy ...

 

[essbee]

I don't want any players who are money-grabbing *******s.

 

[D Block blue]

Great post [MENTION=12295]TRHK[/MENTION]! The future is bright as far as Tony and the Albion are concerned, it's clear he is a very shrewd buisness man. The really big worry is what effect it on those clubs who don't meet FFP. If these clubs think FFP is a double bluff then alot of clubs are going out of buisness. So the future could be smaller leagues, only time will tell i suppose.

 

[Triggaaar]

I'm fairly certain I read somewhere that the parachute payments are not factored into the calculations when considering FFP

I've not heard that before. It doesn't make sense really. The idea of parachute payments is that you don't go bust when relegated, but instead you can still pay the expensive wages of your premiership players. If the parachute payments weren't taken into account, then some relegated clubs would fail to meet FFP rules simply because they're still paying their players wages. Doesn't make sense.

Gus talked about FFP creating a two tier system - those with parachute payments, and those without.

 

[Dave the OAP]

People keep trotting out this line that all these clubs are going to go bust...utter utter bollocks!

Football looks after itself, apart from a minuscule number of clubs who never really hit the big time and had pitiful crowds, hardly any clubs have gone out of business....you can quote Portsmouth as an example of clubs crashing down through the leagues, wolves, Coventry etc, however it is not in the interest of the FA, PL, FL to let big clubs go to the wall. We have just gone through a horrendous financial crash where we couldn't get a loan to build our ground and had to rely on a millionaire to bail us out...like arsenal, like Chelsea etc etc...so how many of the big clubs have gone under...NONE

FFP is all very well as a framework to try and get teams to live within their means outside the PL...but there is no way on earth that clubs are going to let a FFP authority put a club out of business for so called flouting the laws, which have yet to be tested in court. That will be the next big thing...clubs challenging the FFP rules.

At the end of the day, if you want to play with the big boys, ie the PL teams, you have to play their game and spend money...even Palace have realised that and what is the point? To become some yo yo club that get hammered one week and then get a draw against the likes of Fulham.

Sod it, I am happy to stay where we have done for 99% of our history.

 

[nwgull]

I'm fairly certain I read somewhere that the parachute payments are not factored into the calculations when considering FFP, the same goes for large sponsorship payouts that are designed to funnel extra money in from companies owned by the clubs rich owners. I believe FFP revolves primarily around club turnover and money the club actually takes in from gate receipts and other legitimate sources, merchandise players being sold etc. I may be completely wrong but I'm sure I read this somewhere before.

Parachute payments are factored in; if they weren't, the relegated clubs wouldn't stand a chance of meeting FFP - Bolton are going to struggle even with them!

The thing about sponsorship deals is correct. It is stated explicitly in the rules that deals with companies related to the owner must be at market value. So Forrest's sponsorship deal for something like 10m is, hopefully, going to be seen as breaking the rules.

 

[Dave the OAP]

So Forrest's sponsorship deal for something like 10m is, hopefully, going to be seen as breaking the rules.

Why " hopefully"?

You want forest to go out of business for breaking rules that have yet to be tested in court and the guidelines Woolley?

 

[nwgull]

Why " hopefully"?

You want forest to go out of business for breaking rules that have yet to be tested in court and the guidelines Woolley?

Where did I mention going out of business? I want Forrest to have the FFP sanctions imposed on them. This means either a fine, if the go up, or transfer embargo if they don't.

 

[Dave the OAP]

Where did I mention going out of business? I want Forrest to have the FFP sanctions imposed on them. This means either a fine, if the go up, or transfer embargo if they don't.

But the " rules " are yet to be tested!

I think this is more about keeping a tight reign on costs for us than sticking to some proposed rules that may not even be enforceable...some people on here were under the dilusion that as we played the FFP rules " correctly" we were suddenly going to be rewarded with millions of ounds in fine income...then It transpired actually it's a transfer embargo( so people are buying players to bolster their squads now just in case) ....and now it emerges that the " fines" will not go to other clubs, but actually to chariteeee...which one we have yet to be told.

I just think the whole situation is laughable when you have clubs owned by foreign investors.

There is a rumour that Watford will not be subject to FFP as they are toted as actually an Italian club with an offshoot based in England. My Watford supporting mate told me that the club in Spain they also own has some very spurious accounting going on that will mean they pay no taxes on income at all! A bit like Starbucks franchises.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

TB plays a blinder again.

Now I completely agree with the club not budging on our wage structure etc. Certainly don't want to see us breaking the bank to sign players. That is a route best avoided.

BUT

I fail to see how Tony Bloom has played a blinder. He hasn't budged, he hasn't paid over the odds. That is good. I wouldn't him to. But I struggle to see how that adds up to playing a blinder. We went in for a player. We didn't/haven't yet signed him. It is nothing amazing or miraculous. Just the economics of football.

 

[Working class pride]

I don't know the in's and out's but I don't agree with people having a pop at a football agent for doing what he is paid top do and what we all go to work to do - earn money. Its a free market, if someone else wants to pay more then we do then fair enough. If they don't then they don't.

 

[nwgull]

But the " rules " are yet to be tested!

I think this is more about keeping a tight reign on costs for us than sticking to some proposed rules that may not even be enforceable...some people on here were under the dilusion that as we played the FFP rules " correctly" we were suddenly going to be rewarded with millions of ounds in fine income...then It transpired actually it's a transfer embargo( so people are buying players to bolster their squads now just in case) ....and now it emerges that the " fines" will not go to other clubs, but actually to chariteeee...which one we have yet to be told.

I just think the whole situation is laughable when you have clubs owned by foreign investors.

There is a rumour that Watford will not be subject to FFP as they are toted as actually an Italian club with an offshoot based in England. My Watford supporting mate told me that the club in Spain they also own has some very spurious accounting going on that will mean they pay no taxes on income at all! A bit like Starbucks franchises.

Hence my use of the word 'hopefully'.

That rumour about Watford is a load of balls by the way.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

I would love the Albion to be self-sufficient. I would take pride in that.

But we certainly aren't at the moment. Just losing less than others. Annual losses upwards of £8million while getting the best crowds in the division, record sponsorship deals, huge match day pie and drink sales, presumably record merchandise sales is worrying. Not suggesting Tony Bloom isn't running things the right way. The man has put upwards of £100million into this club - I am not going to criticise him. But the club is still a long way off being self sufficient or, I would perhaps argue, sustainable in the long term. I doubt Tony Bloom can KEEP subsidising the club to the tune of millions every year.

Such a difficult balancing act. If the club made £8million of cut backs that would impact on the playing budget and, I imagine, in turn we would lose our 26,000 crowds quite quickly.

 

[Working class pride]

I would love the Albion to be self-sufficient. I would take pride in that.

But we certainly aren't at the moment. Just losing less than others. Annual losses upwards of £8million while getting the best crowds in the division, record sponsorship deals, huge match day pie and drink sales, presumably record merchandise sales is worrying. Not suggesting Tony Bloom isn't running things the right way. The man has put upwards of £100million into this club - I am not going to criticise him. But the club is still a long way off being self sufficient or, I would perhaps argue, sustainable in the long term. I doubt Tony Bloom can KEEP subsidising the club to the tune of millions every year.

Such a difficult balancing act. If the club made £8million of cut backs that would impact on the playing budget and, I imagine, in turn we would lose our 26,000 crowds quite quickly.

The losses are because after the sale of the Goldstone, the Albion had nothing. He had to build from scratch. Give it another 5 years then the club has a very good chance of being self sufficient with the support the Albion has.