[Sussex] monks farm planning

[brakespear]

The crux being that it's not worth going to IKEA unless you have a car.

I disagree - I don't drive and have been to the one at Southampton successfully in the past If I wanted a wardrobe I'd order one from the website

 

[Superphil]

Here is the plan.

https://www.adur-worthing.gov.uk/media/media,145426,en.pdf

The roundabout will indeed be a bit further west than the Sussex Pad junction. However, according to those plans, that junction will be done away with, and access to the airport from the north, will be via the smaller rounadabout due south of the big A27 roundabout.

Fair enough, I love the way they conveniently just crop off the roundabout for Grinstead lane on that plan. That roundabout is carnage every morning and evening, and for long periods during the day, partly as it is the main route for commercial vehicles being directed to the Lancing Business Park and because is is the main way out of Lancing for commuters.

So you will have 2 major roundabouts within 400m of each other, on a road that is gridlocked every morning for 2 hours, with a couple of hundred extra cars at peak times at least, it just is not going to be any better, it fatalistically can only be worse than it is at the moment.

What is needed is a bypass for Worthing, up over the downs, along Long Furlong, round the back of Findon, behind Sompting Abbots, and then drop down to this new roundabout before going on to the flyover. I guess the lack of profitability and the national park would put a stop to that ever happening, even though that is what is NEEDED.

 

[Superphil]

Definitely not excellent road connections there at rush hour. Although accommodation without any parking should be considered, especially due to location

It's pretty straight forward driving north or west out of Worthing at that time, so long as you plan to keep going north, or West at the A27. If you are ultimately heading East then you're going to get caught up in the mess that is the Lyons Farm/Grinstead lane roundabout/Sussex pad traffic lights debacle.

 

[The Large One]

Fair enough, I love the way they conveniently just crop off the roundabout for Grinstead lane on that plan. That roundabout is carnage every morning and evening, and for long periods during the day, partly as it is the main route for commercial vehicles being directed to the Lancing Business Park and because is is the main way out of Lancing for commuters.

So you will have 2 major roundabouts within 400m of each other, on a road that is gridlocked every morning for 2 hours, with a couple of hundred extra cars at peak times at least, it just is not going to be any better, it fatalistically can only be worse than it is at the moment.

What is needed is a bypass for Worthing, up over the downs, along Long Furlong, round the back of Findon, behind Sompting Abbots, and then drop down to this new roundabout before going on to the flyover. I guess the lack of profitability and the national park would put a stop to that ever happening, even though that is what is NEEDED.

What you're talking about has nothing to do with the development. It's over 3/4 mile from the propose new roundabout (not 400m).

Grinstead Lane roundabout is shite, principally because it's not big enough, and the gridlock is in part caused by an ridiculous junction at the Sussex Pad, and an unfit suburban route north of Lancing / Sompting.

By all means build a bypass around Worthing, but this application - miles away from your suggestion - will have sod all effect in the great scheme of things.

 

[The Large One]

I disagree - I don't drive and have been to the one at Southampton successfully in the past If I wanted a wardrobe I'd order one from the website

In which case, your custom won't count as a number in the traffic.

The vast majority of footfall in IKEA is via people travelling by car. Unless you live at New Monk's Farm, that's pretty much going to be the case here.

 

[Superphil]

What you're talking about has nothing to do with the development. It's over 3/4 mile from the propose new roundabout (not 400m).

Grinstead Lane roundabout is shite, principally because it's not big enough, and the gridlock is in part caused by an ridiculous junction at the Sussex Pad, and an unfit suburban route north of Lancing / Sompting.

By all means build a bypass around Worthing, but this application - miles away from your suggestion - will have sod all effect in the great scheme of things.

Well, as someone who sits in the traffic every morning I shall be delighted when the new roundabout has been built and the lights removed then if you think it will be an improvement.

With more than 50% of the commercial vehicles (Articulated trucks, lorries, vans, and staff commuting) heading to LBP and with 2 roundabouts to negotiate on the A27, less than a mile apart, together with the cars from the new housing estate, and the IKEA commercial vehicles, I just can't see it being an improvement, I can only see it making the traffic congestion worse.

 

[theboybilly]

Do you live in area? Do you spent upwards of an hour a day stuck in traffic on the A27?

The club will do just fine without this development.

As somebody who does the journey along that stretch of the A27 at all times of the day every day I can say with some reliabilty that it takes around 7 minutes to get from the airport lights to Grinstead Lane roundabout in the peak period. The new layout 'should' alleviate even this delay and assist those trying to exit Grinstead Lane. Most of the IKEA traffic will surely be off-peak. At some point that land is surely going to be built on. I think this is the development that will ultimately have the least impact and should be allowed to go through. I say this trying to keep my Albion bias out of it. It's those living further along towards Worthing that will feel the effect of an extra build up of traffic but this might finallly push things towards a bypass.

 

[Superphil]

As somebody who does the journey along that stretch of the A27 at all times of the day every day I can say with some reliabilty that it takes around 7 minutes to get from the airport lights to Grinstead Lane roundabout in the peak period. The new layout 'should' alleviate even this delay and assist those trying to exit Grinstead Lane. Most of the IKEA traffic will surely be off-peak. At some point that land is surely going to be built on. I think this is the development that will ultimately have the least impact and should be allowed to go through. I say this trying to keep my Albion bias out of it. It's those living further along towards Worthing that will feel the effect of an extra build up of traffic but this might finallly push things towards a bypass.

To be fair, it's the hold ups in the other direction that are far worse than the lights to Grinstead lane, all caused by the cumulative bottlenecks of the roundabout and the lights. .

 

[The Large One]

Well, as someone who sits in the traffic every morning I shall be delighted when the new roundabout has been built and the lights removed then if you think it will be an improvement.

With more than 50% of the commercial vehicles (Articulated trucks, lorries, vans, and staff commuting) heading to LBP and with 2 roundabouts to negotiate on the A27, less than a mile apart, together with the cars from the new housing estate, and the IKEA commercial vehicles, I just can't see it being an improvement, I can only see it making the traffic congestion worse.

You seem to be of the opinion that traffic from the New Monk's Farm will be huge and constant. Where does this come from? Two, maybe three IKEA delivery trucks a day - usually in the dead of night. 10 cars a minute from NMF at rush hour.

IKEA doesn't open until 10am, and closes either at 9 or 10pm.

What's LBP?

 

[cardboard]

You seem to be of the opinion that traffic from the New Monk's Farm will be huge and constant. Where does this come from? Two, maybe three IKEA delivery trucks a day - usually in the dead of night. 10 cars a minute from NMF at rush hour.

IKEA doesn't open until 10am, and closes either at 9 or 10pm.

What's LBP?

Lancing Business Park i guess

 

[The Large One]

Lancing Business Park i guess

Got you. Well, that's quite a way from this development too.

 

[Weststander]

Fair enough, I love the way they conveniently just crop off the roundabout for Grinstead lane on that plan. That roundabout is carnage every morning and evening, and for long periods during the day, partly as it is the main route for commercial vehicles being directed to the Lancing Business Park and because is is the main way out of Lancing for commuters.

So you will have 2 major roundabouts within 400m of each other, on a road that is gridlocked every morning for 2 hours, with a couple of hundred extra cars at peak times at least, it just is not going to be any better, it fatalistically can only be worse than it is at the moment.

What is needed is a bypass for Worthing, up over the downs, along Long Furlong, round the back of Findon, behind Sompting Abbots, and then drop down to this new roundabout before going on to the flyover. I guess the lack of profitability and the national park would put a stop to that ever happening, even though that is what is NEEDED.

The South Downs will never be destroyed again in the way parts of the Brighton Bypass did.

A more southerly Worthing bypass might be the only option, with a tunnel or two. Costly.

 

[Weststander]

As a nation we should be more open to building upwards

You're probably right, but people complained on here that everyone's entitled to have their own private garden.

 

[Boys 9d]

The roundabout replacing the traffic lights on the map shown on a previous page seems to do away with access to the Coombes road ?

 

[Seagull73]

The South Downs will never be destroyed again in the way parts of the Brighton Bypass did.

A more southerly Worthing bypass might be the only option, with a tunnel or two. Costly.

South Downs destroyed? Dear oh dear. I sincerely hope you are wrong about Worthing because that is the single biggest barrier to development and progression in this part of the world (OK, the absolute dire situation of the Beddingham to Polegate road is a very close second).

We cannot continue to blithely think that, as our population continues to grow, that we can somehow rely on an outdated strategy of improving public transport. We are a nation of drivers, and sooner or later somebody has to respect that and do the development.

I can only take it you have never lived in Brighton - otherwise you wouldn't make such a daft comment about the bypass. Can you possibly imagine where we would be without it now - the thought is bordering on the vomit-inducing.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Well, as someone who sits in the traffic every morning I shall be delighted when the new roundabout has been built and the lights removed then if you think it will be an improvement.

With more than 50% of the commercial vehicles (Articulated trucks, lorries, vans, and staff commuting) heading to LBP and with 2 roundabouts to negotiate on the A27, less than a mile apart, together with the cars from the new housing estate, and the IKEA commercial vehicles, I just can't see it being an improvement, I can only see it making the traffic congestion worse.

Living where you do, I'm surprised you don't use the A272 & Steyning bypass.

 

[seagulls4ever]

I feel like it's blatantly obvious to say but I'll say it anyway, the benefits are not going to be significant whilst we remain in the Premier League. If you are supremely confident that we will be here indefinitely and/or bounce back immediately within the term of parachute payments OR TB is immortal and will be here forever then I'll glady agree with you. Also, something else blatantly obvious, paying TB back out of the current income we are receiving (as some other moron suggested) is going to directly reduce our chances of remaining in the league and thus continuing to repay him.

This project has the long term sustainability of the club in mind, and will be enormously beneficial if we are pushing again in the Championship without parachute payments. Of course Bloom and Perry are not going to outline exactly how we can 'cook the books' as Gibson at boro and many others have done in the past, just as he isn't going to outline the benefits to us of owning a Belgian club.

The club have directly asked for the fans backing on this, judging by recent history I'm at a loss as to how anyone could possibly believe it's a project of self-interest for TB, even if you do not understand the implications.

This was first proposed when we were in the Championship, when it would have been of greater benefit as you allude to. Possibly the reason why it was originally going through the Albion, rather than through one of TB's other companies, is so that it would allow us to get around FFP and reach the PL and the profits that come with that. Now that we're in the PL, it doesn't seem as vital.

TB is still young. No one knows how long he'll be around for of course, but he has talked about leaving a legacy for his children, so I'm pretty confident we'll be fine whatever happens. Further, his loans are interest free and automatically get converted to shares if they don't get repaid (by 2025 I seem to recall, I may be incorrect).

You say this other poster is a moron for suggesting we pay TB back out of the current income we are receiving, but this will happen regardless. It has already been said that the club will begin to make repayments back to TB now that we are in the PL.

You still haven't explained the enormous benefits to the future of the club, at least not that I can see. MP said said the club will make a not spectacular developer's profit. Presumably this is a one-off profit. How does that contribute to the long-term sustainability of the club?

It sounds like a project of self-interest for TB, because MP said it will allow us to repay some of the loans to him. And if those loans don't get paid off, they get converted to shares. I have no problem with TB wanting to be repaid of course, that's pretty fair considering what he's done for us. There's nothing wrong with that. I don't have an opinion on whether, outside of the Albion, the project's benefits outweigh it's disadvantages, as I haven't been following the proposals and debates closely (although I have seen there have been lots of objections). But people shouldn't just blindly support it, if they would otherwise disagree with the project, simply because it will benefit the Albion and/or TB. That's a bit tribal, IMO.

 

[seagulls4ever]

If there is a housing problem why haven’t they built a few hundred residences at Tevill Gate? It’s been available for development for over 20 years, is on a brownfield site, and has excellent rail and road connections.

TG, which is being renamed to Station Square, is currently being knocked down by the council to speed up its development.

The new development, which they hope to complete by 2021, will contain homes, a supermarket, restaurants/cafes and a gym.

www.ourstationsquare.com

Just the twenty years then

I think planning permission has been granted for other projects in the past, but the developers never followed through.

 

[Superphil]

Living where you do, I'm surprised you don't use the A272 & Steyning bypass.

I do use the steyning bypass, and get on the A27 at shoreham, the queue in towards Lancing is bearable, but it’s the queue the other way that is a farce, every morning the queue joins up all the way to Swandean on the other side of Worthing, all because of the Sussex Pad lights. If they weren’t there, the queue wouldn’t join up and there would be much freer flowing traffic. This was categorically proven when after the shoreham aircrash those lights were closed for a number of weeks, and the traffic flowed massively better, and the queue didn’t join up all along the A27 through to the other side of Worthing.

 

[The Large One]

South Downs destroyed? Dear oh dear. I sincerely hope you are wrong about Worthing because that is the single biggest barrier to development and progression in this part of the world (OK, the absolute dire situation of the Beddingham to Polegate road is a very close second).

We cannot continue to blithely think that, as our population continues to grow, that we can somehow rely on an outdated strategy of improving public transport. We are a nation of drivers, and sooner or later somebody has to respect that and do the development.

I can only take it you have never lived in Brighton - otherwise you wouldn't make such a daft comment about the bypass. Can you possibly imagine where we would be without it now - the thought is bordering on the vomit-inducing.

Brighton desperately needed a bypass - bizarre to think that Viaduct Road and Upper Lewes Road were once part of the A27. They're still part of the A23 and A270 now...

We can improve public transport. Would love to see the Lewes to Uckfield line re-connected (highly unlikely - but that's Beeching for you). The bus network is pretty good in Brighton & Hove, and even getting to you in the sticks is fairly easy. It's also a bit wayward to say we're a nation of drivers - not everyone is.

However, much as a Worthing bypass is needed, its route isn't obvious. To make it worthwhile it has to be a Worthing AND Lancing bypass. And that means going through the South Downs rather than over it. Doable, and even environmentally better than huge great cuttings - but not an expense the government is prepared to foot, sadly.