[Football] Misfiring strikers and midfielders, who is more responsible?

[Stat Brother]

"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.” - Einstein

Luckily, in defence that isn't the case as we don't have the same players. At the time of typing the defence is significantly weaker.

In midfield it is also not the case. On reputation from people who know Mwepu has bags of potential and should be an upgrade on Propper, And it's a good job I have read them and am not as impatient as you actually think, since I've seen him play one game badly, at wingback.

Up front though? With the notable exception of returning Ali J back to a league that actually suits him we're very much in Einstein territory.

Plenty of window left for that to change though

I don't know if it just passed me by but I was amazed to see the team had an identical league record over the last 2 seasons.
As near as you can get as the same players (and manager) providing the same results.

 

[Rinkmaster]

I put other seems to me that everyone is to blame. The transition from defense through midfield to the strikers is far too slow. We are messing about for far too long allowing oppositions defense to stifle any probing from us. This is why I feel Mwepu is going to make a big difference caus when he gets possession it's one or two touches and he offloads the ball

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Not much point in blaming anyone especially before the season has even started

 

[Bold Seagull]

"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.” - Einstein

Luckily, in defence that isn't the case as we don't have the same players. At the time of typing the defence is significantly weaker.

In midfield it is also not the case. On reputation from people who know Mwepu has bags of potential and should be an upgrade on Propper, And it's a good job I have read them and am not as impatient as you actually think, since I've seen him play one game badly, at wingback.

Up front though? With the notable exception of returning Ali J back to a league that actually suits him we're very much in Einstein territory.

Plenty of window left for that to change though

Einstein territory would be to keep signing sub £25m strikers from 2nd tier leagues and expecting them to always be an upgrade on what we already have.

The flip side of quoting the theory is, not signing a striker is doing something differently from the last 4 seasons.

 

[Swansman]

"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.” - Einstein

Luckily, in defence that isn't the case as we don't have the same players. At the time of typing the defence is significantly weaker.

In midfield it is also not the case. On reputation from people who know Mwepu has bags of potential and should be an upgrade on Propper, And it's a good job I have read them and am not as impatient as you actually think, since I've seen him play one game badly, at wingback.

Up front though? With the notable exception of returning Ali J back to a league that actually suits him we're very much in Einstein territory.

Plenty of window left for that to change though

First and foremost - Einstein didnt say that. The quote is from some shite yank 80s novelist that I cant remember the name of.

But if we're heading into Einstein territories (where neither you or I belong): if he failed some experiment or equation, do you think he said "**** this, I'll give up and spend the rest of my days watching Emmerdale" or do you think he tried to improve himself and make a better attempt next time?

People practise stuff (in this case football) and they develop their skills and knowledge. Its possible to improve. Thats why these players are training football every day instead of just playing the games. Thats why kids go to school. Thats why people practise playing guitar or whatever the **** they want to improve at. Just because you cant play a song one day doesnt mean you cant play it after one year of practising it.

 

[Guinness Boy]

First and foremost - Einstein didnt say that. The quote is from some shite yank 80s novelist that I cant remember the name of.

But if we're heading into Einstein territories (where neither you or I belong): if he failed some experiment or equation, do you think he said "**** this, I'll give up and spend the rest of my days watching Emmerdale" or do you think he tried to improve himself and make a better attempt next time?

People practise stuff (in this case football) and they develop their skills and knowledge. Its possible to improve. Thats why these players are training football every day instead of just playing the games. Thats why kids go to school. Thats why people practise playing guitar or whatever the **** they want to improve at. Just because you cant play a song one day doesnt mean you cant play it after one year of practising it.

I love the Emmerdale reference. You're such an Anglophile.

Unfortunately all the other 19 teams also do practice and training and stuff. For a week for so before they play Brighton they probably practice and train to play against Brighton and their slow possession, lack of pace, poor decision making and abject finishing.

 

[beorhthelm]

"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.” - Einstein

Luckily, in defence that isn't the case as we don't have the same players. At the time of typing the defence is significantly weaker.

In midfield it is also not the case. On reputation from people who know Mwepu has bags of potential and should be an upgrade on Propper, And it's a good job I have read them and am not as impatient as you actually think, since I've seen him play one game badly, at wingback.

Up front though? With the notable exception of returning Ali J back to a league that actually suits him we're very much in Einstein territory.

Plenty of window left for that to change though

its not very promising is it. dont think i've been so pessimistic about a season before, as right now i know we are weaker in one area (managable), while no signs of improvement in our weakest area.

 

[Swansman]

I love the Emmerdale reference. You're such an Anglophile.

Unfortunately all the other 19 teams also do practice and training and stuff. For a week for so before they play Brighton they probably practice and train to play against Brighton and their slow possession, lack of pace, poor decision making and abject finishing.

Yes they all practice but your ability to improve most areas diminishes with age (when you are 23 or 24 it turns increasingly difficult to develop the motor skills required to improve technique, and physically you'll usually be at your peak between 25-30 and no sooner or later), which is why if you have a younger squad, they are more likely to improve more than if you have older players. Obviously players can still improve but then it will be more about aquiring experience rather than "actual" improvement (though it may manifest itself as such).

 

[Bry Nylon]

Not much point in blaming anyone especially before the season has even started

Ha! It's great isn't it? The season doesn't even start for another 4 days and already we have a thread asking who is to blame for our lack of goals.

 

[Perkino]

Football is the most entertaining sport because it is such a low scoring affair with very few matches not finishing even or a single goal victory, because of this it is vital that we ensure we make minimal errors and have ways to deal with errors that do occur. The consistency of performances since Sanchez has been in goal has been incredible and the longer the selections and playing style continue to reflect this set up the more natural our game will feel to those involved. If we learn how to beat the sides who will try and park the bus against us we will make the jump to top 10

 

[usernamed]

We have changed all the personnel on the footballing side at the club several times since we started having problems putting the ball in the net. (coaching and playing)

Is it that “Brighton strikers can’t score” has almost become part of Brighton folklore? Arrivals who don’t start strongly, and don’t have unshakable self-confidence, almost get dragged down by it a bit?

I suspect someone like Zlatan (I know we won’t get him) would wander in, be completely unaffected, and bang in goals for fun. Players who aren’t familiar with the league or the country and are sensitive to form though, have a uphill struggle if they don’t come in and score consistently in their first few games.

Welbeck has been a great signing for us (when he’s on the pitch) coz he knows what he’s doing, he knows the league, and he seems a confident lad. We need more like him.

I know in most areas of the pitch we’re looking for future stars, but in attack we either need a wise head, or if we are looking at youngsters, someone with unshakable self-confidence and determination. The kind of player who’s still smiling and convinced they’re going to score their next chance after they’ve spent eighty minutes getting dumped on their arse by opposition defenders and have missed a sitter.

I’d be just as happy with an older, proven goal scorer that wants more game time, as I would taking punts on players that might develop into what we need.


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[BadFish]

Strikers that score lots of goals are rare and expensive.

We could spend 50 mil on one and they still don't perform as we expect.

Overall things are going well at the club, we continue to develop as a club and as a team. We are improving.

While the goalscoring problem should be the next thing to be addressed, I am willing to give the club and manager a little leeway to solve this as they fit (they haven't done badly in the other areas).

Perhaps it is patience we need rather than tossing blame around?

 

[crookie]

Strikers that score lots of goals are rare and expensive.

We could spend 50 mil on one and they still don't perform as we expect.

Overall things are going well at the club, we continue to develop as a club and as a team. We are improving.

While the goalscoring problem should be the next thing to be addressed, I am willing to give the club and manager a little leeway to solve this as they fit (they haven't done badly in the other areas).

Perhaps it is patience we need rather than tossing blame around?

Season starts in 4 days. Our goals scored v XG was abject last season. I was tearing my hair out most games. Most seem to have blind faith that our midfielders and strikers will score more with the simple reasoning that they couldn't do worse. They might do worse, they might do better, there are no real convincing finishers in this squad. For sure there are a few weeks to go in the window, and I have no doubt that our recruitment team are trying, but anyone, at this stage, with our injuries, who claims we are not in a weaker situation that last season, is, deluded. Really hoping some incoming with pace,presence and finishing ability

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[BadFish]

Season starts in 4 days. Our goals scored v XG was abject last season. I was tearing my hair out most games. Most seem to have blind faith that our midfielders and strikers will score more with the simple reasoning that they couldn't do worse. They might do worse, they might do better, there are no real convincing finishers in this squad. For sure there are a few weeks to go in the window, and I have no doubt that our recruitment team are trying, but anyone, at this stage, with our injuries, who claims we are not in a weaker situation that last season, is, deluded. Really hoping some incoming with pace,presence and finishing ability

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Like you say our recruitment team are doing all they can to find the right fit.

We have very limited parameters in place around any prospective forward. We definitely need some new players, we just need to be patient while our recruitment team continue to try and work miracles.

It is what it is and we need to be patient.

I am not sure whatelse people are asking for?

 

[Icy Gull]

Liverpool are apparently willing to offload Shaqiri for 12 million. Wages would clearly be a problem but a signing on fee on top of the 12 million could get around that?

It would be a yes from me if we could convince him and pretty well guarantee game time when fit?

Lyon are interested but the fee is rumoured to be a stumbling block

Yes, I know it’s pie in the sky but sounds a better idea than 30 million Euros on an injured Benfica player who has not set the world alight to me

Not much resale value but then neither did Ali J or Locadia and we KNOW Shaqiri is up to the job as a PL striker/winger, not prolific but with a few assists and playing off one of the other forwards I’d be a fan

 

[Hugo Rune]

70% Misfiring strikers (I include Trossard & AJ in this).
30% Misfiring midfielders (Mainly due Lallana but also due to the fact that Bissouma should not be allowed to shoot from distance, Groß never got in any goal scoring positions and Mac Allister didn’t play enough)

In summary, if our strikers had buried the chances most League One strikers would have, we wouldn’t be turning our attention to the midfielders:

 

[Stat Brother]

70% Misfiring strikers (I include Trossard & AJ in this).
30% Misfiring midfielders (Mainly due Lallana but also due to the fact that Bissouma should not be allowed to shoot from distance, Groß never got in any goal scoring positions and Mac Allister didn’t play enough)

In summary, if our strikers had buried the chances most League One strikers would have, we wouldn’t be turning our attention to the midfielders:

Why don't the club just spend £5m on a couple of league 1 strikers?

 

[Uh_huh_him]

The clubs that finished in the mid-table spots last season (8th - 12th) scored an average of 53 goals. Last season we scored 40 goals and we have not signed any new strikers yet, or disposed of the misfiring ones.

Having sold Ben White I don't see the defence are going to be that much better, therefore if we have any hope of reaching a mid-table position we need an additional 10 goals from somewhere.[/QUOTE]

Whilst I appreciate the argument that we need a more clinical striker, we also need to toughen up in general.

Last season we dropped 23 points having scored, to go ahead, or draw level.
The teams finishing 8th-12th averaged 56 points to our 41.
10 extra goals will matter very little if we concede immediately after each one.

It is the accumulation of points, not necessarily goals, that matters most.

 

[Pavilionaire]

The clubs that finished in the mid-table spots last season (8th - 12th) scored an average of 53 goals. Last season we scored 40 goals and we have not signed any new strikers yet, or disposed of the misfiring ones.

Having sold Ben White I don't see the defence are going to be that much better, therefore if we have any hope of reaching a mid-table position we need an additional 10 goals from somewhere.[/QUOTE]

Whilst I appreciate the argument that we need a more clinical striker, we also need to toughen up in general.

Last season we dropped 23 points having scored, to go ahead, or draw level.
The teams finishing 8th-12th averaged 56 points to our 41.
10 extra goals will matter very little if we concede immediately after each one.

It is the accumulation of points, not necessarily goals, that matters most.

Last season we had the joint 7th best defence in the Premier League. It blatantly, clearly, obviously ISN'T the problem here.

 

[Hugo Rune]

Why don't the club just spend £5m on a couple of league 1 strikers?

Because they don’t have the all round game or skill to be in the right place at the right time to have a good shot. Their finishing might well be superior to messers Maupay & Connolly (20/21 versions) but the rest of their game would mean ultimately, those chances are not created.