MEP Nigel farage

[Cheshire Cat]

The point of the law is that the interests of the child are paramount, not the interests of the parents which might be completely different.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

This case is no different, it demonstrates how the “rights” of parents is subordinate to the power of doctors.

No, it doesn’t. If you read the law it neither assumes the parent or the doctor is correct. In cases where there is a dispute between the two the courts and experts take over and the child is put first. Besides, you simply can’t assume the parent is always correct; such a default can indirectly permit neglect and abuse. This was a difficult and emotional extreme case but I think the courts got it right.

 

[oneillco]

Farage speaks his mind and tells it how it is. I believe his views are shared by the vast majority of citizens who would describe themselves on the government forms as 'white British' . Generally, for me, the man speaks sense.
Obviously, the lunatic left wing fringe will disagree with that.

"Farage speaks his mind and tells it how it is"... no, Farage is a populist, and so he finds out what people like you think and says it back to you. I don't think he is unintelligent and so he probably realises that much of what he says is rubbish but it appeals to a strata of people who describe themselves as "white British". And that is less than 50% of them according to that suicidal referendum.

 

[cunning fergus]

Which in this case they got absolutely right. It shows the limits of the cult off individual rights.

If Alfie’s parents considered he had a chance in Italy, and it wasn’t going to cost the NHS to transfer, then why couldn’t they just take him? The NHS considered that he had no chance anyway, as it is the NHS won, he stayed in the country and died.

I think that is the right of the parents, if there is a chance elsewhere then let them take it.........as I said let’s hope we are never faced with the dilemma.

 

[cunning fergus]

No, it doesn’t. If you read the law it neither assumes the parent or the doctor is correct. In cases where there is a dispute between the two the courts and experts take over and the child is put first. Besides, you simply can’t assume the parent is always correct; such a default can indirectly permit neglect and abuse. This was a difficult and emotional extreme case but I think the courts got it right.

Yes, not listening to the parents is costing lives.........as the NHS are telling their staff.

https://www.theguardian.com/society...-children-rather-than-tests-nhs-tells-doctors

Still f@ck them eh..........what do they know.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

If Alfie’s parents considered he had a chance in Italy, and it wasn’t going to cost the NHS to transfer, then why couldn’t they just take him? The NHS considered that he had no chance anyway, as it is the NHS won, he stayed in the country and died.

I think that is the right of the parents, if there is a chance elsewhere then let them take it.........as I said let’s hope we are never faced with the dilemma.

I couldn't see the issue either at the time. I can't imagine what these parents must have been going through. Poor parents and poor child, it's all so sad.

 

[vegster]

"Farage speaks his mind and tells it how it is"... no, Farage is a populist, and so he finds out what people like you think and says it back to you. I don't think he is unintelligent and so he probably realises that much of what he says is rubbish but it appeals to a strata of people who describe themselves as "white British". And that is less than 50% of them according to that suicidal referendum.

He is a reasonably smart operator and has managed quite a good living between milking the EU and gladhanding various anti EU millionaires. He seems to be looking post EU as being a shock jock/ talkshow operator to top up his MEP's pension, and, unless he shocks from time to time he isn't going to get far. So, he has to court controversy from time to time in the manner of Holmes and that other " Voice of The people " John Gaunt.....

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Yes, not listening to the parents is costing lives.........as the NHS are telling their staff.

https://www.theguardian.com/society...-children-rather-than-tests-nhs-tells-doctors

Still f@ck them eh..........what do they know.

I’m not sure of your point as the parents in the case we are discussing were listened to, numerous times in fact by many doctors, judges and the media. The point is not that they were not listened to...but more that they were listened and agreement about the future of their vegetative son could not be made.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I can't imagine what these parents must have been going through.

Sadly, and I am not saying this flippantly, it seems it was denial about the inevitable.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

If Alfie’s parents considered he had a chance in Italy, and it wasn’t going to cost the NHS to transfer, then why couldn’t they just take him?

Because it wasn’t felt it was in the child’s best interest. Parents are not always automatically right. The child was a vegetable. What use was it taking him to Italy, or do you believe in papal miracles?

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Really not sure what the fuss is about - even on the Alfie thread on here there's people questioning if it's right a court decides these matters - me being one of them. Problem here is that peoples loathing for Farage clouds their judgement. If the questions had been raised by someone such as Robin Cook or Michael Portillo then people would be going 'yes, this is something worthy of discussion'.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

There's your answer then.

Trump was elected by white men 30-60, because everybody else either didn't vote or couldn't vote for Hilary.
(Trump and Clinton were the only possible candidates who could have lost to the other)

In the recent 'by-elections' everybody voted and the Republican's took a beating.

Not as simple as that. [MENTION=5076]Bevendean Hillbilly[/MENTION] is noting a surprising observation (not a room full of archetypal rednecks). Surprising to Brits anyway. In my experience there are two additional factors. The first is that a large proportion of Americans treat the president like royalty or a deity - 'my president right or wrong' and fnd a positive about even the worst ****tard. The exception being when the president is a democrat... The other factor is the admiration for the self made man in the US that has no equivalent here. Th US would love their equivalent of a cross between Arthur Daley and Alan Sugar, whereas we treat such folk with a mix of suspicion and contempt.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Really not sure what the fuss is about - even on the Alfie thread on here there's people questioning if it's right a court decides these matters - me being one of them. Problem here is that peoples loathing for Farage clouds their judgement. If the questions had been raised by someone such as Robin Cook or Michael Portillo then people would be going 'yes, this is something worthy of discussion'.

Robin Cook or Michael Portillo could raise questions but would do so in a manner which doesn't denigrate the NHS or medical staff. Pandering to the America tv audiences does nobody any favours either side of the Atlantic.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

If Alfie’s parents considered he had a chance in Italy, and it wasn’t going to cost the NHS to transfer, then why couldn’t they just take him? The NHS considered that he had no chance anyway, as it is the NHS won, he stayed in the country and died.

I think that is the right of the parents, if there is a chance elsewhere then let them take it.........as I said let’s hope we are never faced with the dilemma.

What chance was offered in Italy? The European Court of Human Rights looked at that, and decided it was palliative care which was also being offered in Liverpool, and without the added stress of travelling with a very sick child.

 

[Albumen]

I thought he couldn’t get any lower but then he latched his political point seeking to a dying child. I’m far from surprised, I just wonder whether one can actually get any lower.

 

[cunning fergus]

I’m not sure of your point as the parents in the case we are discussing were listened to, numerous times in fact by many doctors, judges and the media. The point is not that they were not listened to...but more that they were listened and agreement about the future of their vegetative son could not be made.

I see, so they were listened to and they took him off to Italy then, and he died there.

Sorry, I got it wrong I thought they couldn’t take him and he died here.

I stand corrected said the man in the oerthapeadic shoe.

 

[cunning fergus]

What chance was offered in Italy? The European Court of Human Rights looked at that, and decided it was palliative care which was also being offered in Liverpool, and without the added stress of travelling with a very sick child.

F**k the European Court of Human Rights......they cause more problems than solutions anyway.

Fact is, he could have gone to Italy for free for treatment.

The Italian Govt was willing to make him a citizen to get him over there quickly with top notch medical care.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-treatment-italy-breathing-pope-a8320996.html


That’s what his parents wanted to do, so I don’t see what business it is of the state to interfere.

You see, I am very liberal minded like that........

 

[Mo Gosfield]

What’s this got to do with Farage? Or is he now a pay-for-quote gob shite?

He has got exactly the same right to comment on the situation as everyone on here having their say.

 

[Mo Gosfield]

Farage speaks his mind and tells it how it is. I believe his views are shared by the vast majority of citizens who would describe themselves on the government forms as 'white British' . Generally, for me, the man speaks sense.
Obviously, the lunatic left wing fringe will disagree with that.

This is a fallacy that Farage only appeals to ' white British ' I have met many people of an ethnic background that agree with a lot of what he says. He tends to offend the white, liberal, chattering classes, those with National insecurity i.e we need Big Brother to protect us and those that are so PC that they are in danger of making an art form out of timidity.

 

[Mo Gosfield]

I thought he couldn’t get any lower but then he latched his political point seeking to a dying child. I’m far from surprised, I just wonder whether one can actually get any lower.

Not on your Christmas Card list, then?