[Albion] Losing Macalister & Caicedo

[Icy Gull]

It is all about money. I'm happy that Bloom won't commit the club to unaffordable contracts. What irritates me is all this guff about 'deserving to play at a higher level' Mac Allister and Caicedo both played in the World Cup Finals this year. They would both be playing European football were they to stay with us next year. They are competing week in week out at the same level as the teams they will be signing for. Technically, if it's about 'playing at a higher level' then the ECL clubs should be the only possible destinations. They are not going to a higher level, they are going to a higher pay packet. Fair enough. You could argue that in a meritocracy, the best players should earn the best wages, but let's stop pretending that this is about 'levels'.

Spot on and you expressed that much better than I did

 

[BluesRockDJ]

Mac Allister and Caceido are off in the summer. I think we all have to accept that.

I never thought we would get an upgrade on Bissouma (I was wrong) I didn’t think we’d be able to replace our player of the season last year (I was wrong), I didn’t think we’d get a better option than Trossard (I was wrong)

I felt the same way when Glenn Murray left, when Bridcutt left, when Dale Stephen’s left…. I could go on.

Moral of the story. Players come and go, we keep being able to replace them, without doubt they are both world class players, but don’t ever write off the exceptional recruitment of our football club and in TB I totally trust to bring in replacements.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

It is all about money. I'm happy that Bloom won't commit the club to unaffordable contracts. What irritates me is all this guff about 'deserving to play at a higher level' Mac Allister and Caicedo both played in the World Cup Finals this year. They would both be playing European football were they to stay with us next year. They are competing week in week out at the same level as the teams they will be signing for. Technically, if it's about 'playing at a higher level' then the ECL clubs should be the only possible destinations. They are not going to a higher level, they are going to a higher pay packet. Fair enough. You could argue that in a meritocracy, the best players should earn the best wages, but let's stop pretending that this is about 'levels'.

I think you do the players a bit of a disservice here. Of course wages are a huge factor, but there is also genuine professional ambition. Players (Harry Kane apart, obviously) want to WIN things. You can argue all you like that (for example) Alexis Mac Allister moving from Brighton to Liverpool, is not a step up in ‘level’ - as the two clubs will play in the same 4 competitions next season - but realistically, one club has a significantly higher chance of winning them, than the other.

 

[seagullwedgee]

I think you do the players a bit of a disservice here. Of course wages are a huge factor, but there is also genuine professional ambition. Players (Harry Kane apart, obviously) want to WIN things. You can argue all you like that (for example) Alexis Mac Allister moving from Brighton to Liverpool, is not a step up in ‘level’ - as the two clubs will play in the same 4 competitions next season - but realistically, one club has a significantly higher chance of winning them, than the other.

You’re right. WE do.

 

[southstandandy]

It is all about money. I'm happy that Bloom won't commit the club to unaffordable contracts. What irritates me is all this guff about 'deserving to play at a higher level' Mac Allister and Caicedo both played in the World Cup Finals this year. They would both be playing European football were they to stay with us next year. They are competing week in week out at the same level as the teams they will be signing for. Technically, if it's about 'playing at a higher level' then the ECL clubs should be the only possible destinations. They are not going to a higher level, they are going to a higher pay packet. Fair enough. You could argue that in a meritocracy, the best players should earn the best wages, but let's stop pretending that this is about 'levels'.

I'm very much with you on this.

Sure, players would like to play in Europe at the highest level but these are only cup competitions that only 1 side will ever win. Caicedo could move to a Champions league club and play only 6 matches if you fail to get beyond the group stages. I personally think 80% of the reason for a move is purely to better themselves financially (which I understand) and don't pay too much attention to the press always spouting on about clubs X, Y, and Z being able to offer Champions League football.

In my opinion with Caidedo (and removing my Blue & White tinted specs) I personally think he would benefit from a full second season with us, playing in Europe and being the lynch pin of our side. Age is well on his side, and I genuinely fear that any move to a so called 'bigger' club could see him possibly being more of a peripheral figure and not necessarily playing regularly. With his improved contract with us I think he would benefit from another year here.

MaCallister though has been here longer, is slightly older and I have no real problem with him moving on assuming we get the fee Bloom wants.

I just hope Caicedo just doesn't jump too soon, and ends up like Cucurella.

 

[Pavilionaire]

but also these high value assets would very likely walk away either 1) reduced, like Bissouma or 2) free like many of Leicester squad

I take that point, but if we make similar big profit on Ferguson, Enciso, Mitoma and Buonanotte to Cucu, White, BIss, Trossard and Mac we'll be a "small club" with £400 million in the bank and a ground and training complex paid for.

 

[Stato]

I think you do the players a bit of a disservice here. Of course wages are a huge factor, but there is also genuine professional ambition. Players (Harry Kane apart, obviously) want to WIN things. You can argue all you like that (for example) Alexis Mac Allister moving from Brighton to Liverpool, is not a step up in ‘level’ - as the two clubs will play in the same 4 competitions next season - but realistically, one club has a significantly higher chance of winning them, than the other.

Yes, but Liverpool only have a better chance because they pay higher wages and Spurs! are one of the destinations considered to be a 'higher level'. Bissouma surely couldn't have gone there to win things. Their most recent trophy is less recent than Leicester's, Wigan's, Swansea's, Portsmouth's etc. The 'higher level' myth protects the advantage of the established (spelled monied) clubs by maintaining the pretense that only they can win things. For players it seems easier to join them than to beat them, especially if they're happy to stuff your mouth with gold. This Brighton squad bolstered and staying together under RDZ could have had the talent needed to challenge, but we'll never know because money.

However, it is the way of the world and I don't hold any grudge against any of our players for taking the opportunity available to them, I'm arguing only for a bit more honesty about prime motivation.

 

[Carbonara]

Is our policy to bring in young and up and coming players or are we just the stingiest team in the Prem.Im amazed we just spent 30m on one player.

 

[Justice]

If Arsenal sign Rice I can’t see them splashing another £80m on Caciedo interesting to see who comes calling.

 

[Justice]

Is our policy to bring in young and up and coming players or are we just the stingiest team in the Prem.Im amazed we just spent 30m on one player.

It’s only the Trossard fee.

 

[Weststander]

It is all about money. I'm happy that Bloom won't commit the club to unaffordable contracts. What irritates me is all this guff about 'deserving to play at a higher level' Mac Allister and Caicedo both played in the World Cup Finals this year. They would both be playing European football were they to stay with us next year. They are competing week in week out at the same level as the teams they will be signing for. Technically, if it's about 'playing at a higher level' then the ECL clubs should be the only possible destinations. They are not going to a higher level, they are going to a higher pay packet. Fair enough. You could argue that in a meritocracy, the best players should earn the best wages, but let's stop pretending that this is about 'levels'.

Or the player/agent takes a slightly longer view than that.

There are no guarantees that Arsenal or Newcastle will be CL for the entirety of their next contract, whilst Chelsea, Liverpool and Tottenham may be CL clubs from 2024/25 as they were this year.

To follow that argument, only players joining ManC are allowed to use the higher level or CL reasons.

 

[Bodian]

Received my Albion+ Membership email for next year....

 

[METALMICKY]

I'm very much with you on this.

Sure, players would like to play in Europe at the highest level but these are only cup competitions that only 1 side will ever win. Caicedo could move to a Champions league club and play only 6 matches if you fail to get beyond the group stages. I personally think 80% of the reason for a move is purely to better themselves financially (which I understand) and don't pay too much attention to the press always spouting on about clubs X, Y, and Z being able to offer Champions League football.

In my opinion with Caidedo (and removing my Blue & White tinted specs) I personally think he would benefit from a full second season with us, playing in Europe and being the lynch pin of our side. Age is well on his side, and I genuinely fear that any move to a so called 'bigger' club could see him possibly being more of a peripheral figure and not necessarily playing regularly. With his improved contract with us I think he would benefit from another year here.

MaCallister though has been here longer, is slightly older and I have no real problem with him moving on assuming we get the fee Bloom wants.

I just hope Caicedo just doesn't jump too soon, and ends up like Cucurella.

That's a pretty accurate assessment and I'm really hoping that Arsenal can bag Rice. Macca is good but just a chance we could keep Moises for more season.

 

[Mancgull]

Received my Albion+ Membership email for next year....

View attachment 161542

Yes, I doubt they’d have a player on it that they definitely knew was leaving.

 

[Wozza]

Tony Bloom's problem is that you cannot keep raising the bar for the targets you set the club whilst simultaneously selling 2 or 3 of your best players every season.

Furthermore, we're selling those players to the Big 6, thus reducing our chances of European qualification.

When Mac and Moises broke into the side they were international players improving a lower mid table side. This next crop need to break into a top 6 side competing in Europe, so more pressure on them and the coaches.

This is true.

We, as fans, have a reponsibility to be realistic. Top 10 next season would be fine.... as long as we get a cup win.

 

[Hiheidi]

 

[Pavilionaire]

This is true.

We, as fans, have a reponsibility to be realistic. Top 10 next season would be fine.... as long as we get a cup win.

Given RDZ's comments about Mac and Caicedo likely to leave this summer then the best case scenario would be to add Colwill, Frattesi and Boey to Joao Pedro, Milner and Dahoud as incomings.

I think 7th, a decent domestic cup run and treat Europe as a learning curve for playing twice per week is a realistic and achievable aim. Chelsea under Pochettino cannot be that bad but Spurs are a mess and Newcastle might struggle with Champions League football if they don't recruit well.

 

[The Fits]

Romano at it again
Maybe get Ampadu in with Colwill, he's a tidy player. Chelsea either have to sell players or get them in cheap so this would be a good option.
Would Caicedo go there? I suspect yes.

 

[Mancgull]

To be fair to Fab I think this is probably true, and why Roberto has been quite open about it so that Moises doesn’t think for one moment we will go back on this verbal agreement.
The caveat is that an offer has to be made which we think is acceptable. If that comes from Chelsea I’d hope that Colwill coming the other way is part of it, plus extra to pay for Frattesi, Sacha B.

 

[PeakGull]

Yes, but Liverpool only have a better chance because they pay higher wages and Spurs! are one of the destinations considered to be a 'higher level'. Bissouma surely couldn't have gone there to win things. Their most recent trophy is less recent than Leicester's, Wigan's, Swansea's, Portsmouth's etc. The 'higher level' myth protects the advantage of the established (spelled monied) clubs by maintaining the pretense that only they can win things. For players it seems easier to join them than to beat them, especially if they're happy to stuff your mouth with gold. This Brighton squad bolstered and staying together under RDZ could have had the talent needed to challenge, but we'll never know because money.

However, it is the way of the world and I don't hold any grudge against any of our players for taking the opportunity available to them, I'm arguing only for a bit more honesty about prime motivation.

Exactly, this constant narrative from the media about big/elite clubs is getting on my nerves more than ever.

Tottenham haven’t won the top division in English football since the 1960-61 season (and have only ever won it twice) and have never won the European Cup/Champions League. Since then, Nottingham Forest have won the top division and the European Cup twice, Villa have won the top division and the European Cup and Derby have won the top division twice. Even Leeds won the old first division three times since then.

What apart from money makes Tottenham and elite club?