Lord Mandelson finally admits we shouldn't join Euro.

[Westdene Seagull]

But the Greek's voted in a pro-EU party, who negotiated a EU deal, which was then put to the people only a few weeks ago and voted in. You can't argue with that.

I was referring to the dodgy deals done to get Greece into the Euro and of course Germany's willingness to continue lending money to Greece, despite knowing they were a financial basket case, just as long as Germany could sell them infrastructure projects. The EU and it's two main members, Germany and France, were complicit in the position Greece got itself in. The EU then manipulated a government change to get a pro-EU Prime Minister installed.

Even when a far left party was finally elected the EU blackmailed them into accepting ever greater austerity. There are now a huge amount of Greeks without jobs and homeless. Greek hospitals can't even afford vital medicines or to clean bedsheets. Their ambulances often run out of fuel. The EU stands by and lets Greeks die but it doesn't care just as long it gets the Greek government to fall into line.

How anyone can think it's viable to belong to such a corrupt, uncaring and over powerful 'club' is beyond me.

 

[glasfryn]

I was referring to the dodgy deals done to get Greece into the Euro and of course Germany's willingness to continue lending money to Greece, despite knowing they were a financial basket case, just as long as Germany could sell them infrastructure projects. The EU and it's two main members, Germany and France, were complicit in the position Greece got itself in. The EU then manipulated a government change to get a pro-EU Prime Minister installed.

Even when a far left party was finally elected the EU blackmailed them into accepting ever greater austerity. There are now a huge amount of Greeks without jobs and homeless. Greek hospitals can't even afford vital medicines or to clean bedsheets. Their ambulances often run out of fuel. The EU stands by and lets Greeks die but it doesn't care just as long it gets the Greek government to fall into line.

How anyone can think it's viable to belong to such a corrupt, uncaring and over powerful 'club' is beyond me.

BLIMEY ......................................I actually agree with you

 

[cunning fergus]

View attachment 69033

Whatever happened to him?

I wouldn't overplay his role, he did previously campaign for us to join.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1432542/Blair-and-Brown-launch-euro-campaign.html

Whether latterly it was an economic epiphany, a political strategy for him to oppose a more pro euro policy from Blair, recognition of the electorate's reticence to embrace the euro, or a combination of these it was nevertheless his job to make the right decisions to protect the country.

He got plenty of decisions wrong, even a blind dog will find a bone every now and then.

 

[Gwylan]

I wouldn't overplay his role, he did previously campaign for us to join.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1432542/Blair-and-Brown-launch-euro-campaign.html

I say unto to you joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance

 

[osgood]

Thanks. Your argument is in-line with many, but it's not one that convinces me. What about the loss of sovereignty courtesy of membership of the UN, WTO, IMF, World Bank, Kyoto Protocol, the City of London, finance, capital, ...? Do any of these bother you? Why is it the EU that always gets singled out on the front, and all others are utterly ignored?

all of the above do not wish to Govern and impose hair-brained and unrealistic, and sometimes unworkable laws the UK.and other states, like the EU does , it is also considerably cheaper, and is to the benefit of the UK to belong to these organisations

 

[osgood]

As the Second World War drew to an end, certain influential Germans decided that if they couldn't control Europe politically, then they would do so economically. By careful management, they have seen the EU grow to 28 member states and their position getting stronger and stronger.
They are the single biggest contributor to the EU and so they should be, as they have the largest economy. If you look a little deeper though, you will see that they are only 9th on the list for contribution per head of population and 24th out of 28 for their contribution as a % of their GDP. Need I say more!
Europe's combined economy has grown in recent years but it has actually shrunk as a percentage of the World economy.
1980.....30%
2015.....17%
Other markets are growing faster.
The powers to be within the EU are so desperate to keep persuading others that membership is vital that they budget up to £4bn annually for EU promotional spending and corporate communication of the political priorities of the union.
In 2013, the European Court of Auditors revealed that the EU had spent £7bn " not according to the rules " on all manner of items but particularly on the direct awarding of contracts with no bidding process.
Corruption is at such a level that accounts cannot be signed off and haven't been for years. The EU plays by its own rules as regards proper accounting practices but still manages to have a direct say in how we run our lives in this country.
Our gross contribution per day to the EU is around £55m and £20bn annually.

..and the "politicians" that are lucky enough to have found employment within this bloated (with our money) organisation, live a high lifestyle that beggars belief , high salaries extremely generous expense accounts , even a large complex in Barbados to "oversee" how and where the EU can best help in the Carribbean , nice !

 

[osgood]

Ive yet to be convinced either way, neither side has put forward a DETAILED, coherent argument presenting their case yet.

would you, or how many others really read 2 x 550 page documents giving contrasting views on the subject ?

 

[osgood]

Aaaah come on there isnt any laudable aspects of the Greeks association with the EU.

They were allowed in on cooked books and then they continue to default and default again whilst the EU financially and politically try and dominate the Greek people.

I have a soft spot for the Greeks, I knew they didnt work very hard or pay their taxes but so did Germany and France yet they still invited them into the land of milk and honey and are then surprised that they didnt pay their dues and continue not to work very hard !!!

The consequence has left a wretched country with their future undecided, its a bodge job initiated by the EU.

Spot on Big Gully !

 

[GT49er]

EROTIC? Am I missing out on a gag here?

Only if you think being royally f u kc e d up by being in the EU is a turn on.

 

[alfredmizen]

would you, or how many others really read 2 x 550 page documents giving contrasting views on the subject ?

No i wouldnt, but im sure i could digest a broadbrush picture from both sides a come to a conclusion as to which way i would vote.