[Drinking] Local vineyards

[amexer]

My wife and get through a few bottles every week. Cost of majority bottles in the £8/12 and happy with the quality in this range. Several times have felt should try and support local vineyards but always surprised at the prices anything from £15 to £30. Sure there is an answer but why so expensive compared to wine that has to be transported from France,Spain, Italy etc

 

[Goldstone1976]

Two main reasons, imo.

We don’t have the weather (sun) to produce high volumes. Thus the fixed costs have to be amortised over (way) fewer bottles.

They sell all their production at those prices, so why charge less?

 

[McTavish]

My wife and get through a few bottles every week. Cost of majority bottles in the £8/12 and happy with the quality in this range. Several times have felt should try and support local vineyards but always surprised at the prices anything from £15 to £30. Sure there is an answer but why so expensive compared to wine that has to be transported from France,Spain, Italy etc

Transport is only a tiny factor in the cost of wine (although due to Covid and Brexit it is becoming more of one).

English wines come from much smaller vineyards than cheaper wines from the rest of the world so there are very few economies of scale. All the phases of production tend to be on a much less industrial scale, most harvesting is done by hand, production runs are relatively small and labour intensive.

Yields are much lower and more variable - yields of 80 hectolitres/hectare are not uncommon in some parts of the world whereas English Vineyards average about 20 hl/ha and in a bad year will be less than that. Even quality regions like Chablis have yields up to 60 hl/ha.

Land is also much more expensive in the South East of England than in the vast vineyards of the Languedoc and La Mancha. Yields are much lower and much more variable - yields of 80 hectolitres/hectare are not uncommon in some parts of the world whereas English Vineyards average about 20 hl/ha and in a bad year will be less than that. Even quality regions like Chablis have yields up to 60 hl/ha.

Having said that, prices are coming down as more vineyards are planted and wineries get larger. Tesco have an English White for £11.00 and Waitrose have Denbies Surrey Gold for £9.99.

 

[scoobiewhite]

Bottom end of the expensive scale but Albourne estates Bacchus can be found for £15.

I live on the edge of the vineyard and the investment is enormous.

They had to buy a farm, convert the whole thing to grape production, but all the industrial grade machinery to make the wine.....then wait 2-3 years until you start getting good yields, then figure out how to make the best wine you can.

It’s a minimum 20-30 years before it’s paid itself back, so we are just centuries behind our continental competition.

And the weather, forget reds. Whites and sparkling only.

 

[Wrong-Direction]

Bottom end of the expensive scale but Albourne estates Bacchus can be found for £15.

I live on the edge of the vineyard and the investment is enormous.

They had to buy a farm, convert the whole thing to grape production, but all the industrial grade machinery to make the wine.....then wait 2-3 years until you start getting good yields, then figure out how to make the best wine you can.

It’s a minimum 20-30 years before it’s paid itself back, so we are just centuries behind our continental competition.

And the weather, forget reds. Whites and sparkling only.

Speaking of bottom, I've done a few plumbing jobs for Breaky Bottom vineyard near Rodmell, takes about 15mins to drive there from the main road over dirt tracks!

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[Muhammad - I’m hard - Bruce Lee]

There’s a certain amount of wine snobbery about.
I love my reds (know sod all about white) but adore French, particularly the Rhône region.
Favourite by a country mile is a Châteauneuf-du-Pape.
Decent bottle will set you back in the region of £25.
LIDL do a perfectly drinkable cote du Rhône for less than a fiver.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Much of the above is true. The South Coast provides good quality, low yield sparkling wine. It’s competing with mid range champagne, not Jacobi’s Creek


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[Guinness Boy]

English red is awful btw. It’s why I’ll never go back to Isaac At


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[Elbow750]

Rathffiny at Alfriston is very good. Sparkling at £30 a bottle is right up there with the best, they do more expensive but I've not tried that. Their Red and rosé is very drinkable and can be down to £13 a bottle when on offer and brought in a case of six. I had some brilliant red from Three Choirs in Gloucester a few years back when staying there for a mini break.

I'm no wine snob and will happily drink Aldi Toro Loco at £5 a bottle, but do like to support local english wines occasionally if they are good enough and within my price - never more than £15 for reds and £30 for fizz on a very special occassion.

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

There’s a certain amount of wine snobbery about.
I love my reds (know sod all about white) but adore French, particularly the Rhône region.
Favourite by a country mile is a Châteauneuf-du-Pape.
Decent bottle will set you back in the region of £25.
LIDL do a perfectly drinkable cote du Rhône for less than a fiver.

I am a wine snob as its a hobby and I love Burgundy wine.
However I totally agree with you and the French Merlot from Lidl at under a fiver is also really good, as is the Rioja and Malbec.
It is far easier to find a good cheap red rather than white, I have never found a drinkable white for less than £9, the decent stuff starts at £16.

 

[amexer]

we do knock back 3/4 bottles a week at meal times and cant justify £15/25 a bottle

 

[Dave the OAP]

Transport is only a tiny factor in the cost of wine (although due to Covid and Brexit it is becoming more of one).

English wines come from much smaller vineyards than cheaper wines from the rest of the world so there are very few economies of scale. All the phases of production tend to be on a much less industrial scale, most harvesting is done by hand, production runs are relatively small and labour intensive.

Yields are much lower and more variable - yields of 80 hectolitres/hectare are not uncommon in some parts of the world whereas English Vineyards average about 20 hl/ha and in a bad year will be less than that. Even quality regions like Chablis have yields up to 60 hl/ha.

Land is also much more expensive in the South East of England than in the vast vineyards of the Languedoc and La Mancha. Yields are much lower and much more variable - yields of 80 hectolitres/hectare are not uncommon in some parts of the world whereas English Vineyards average about 20 hl/ha and in a bad year will be less than that. Even quality regions like Chablis have yields up to 60 hl/ha.

Having said that, prices are coming down as more vineyards are planted and wineries get larger. Tesco have an English White for £11.00 and Waitrose have Denbies Surrey Gold for £9.99.

M&S english lily is a tenner and is denbies…very nice wine.

Chapel down from tenterden is our favourite and although not cheap, ridge view from ditching is now recognised as a world leading, expensive, sparkling wine.

Going round denbies a while ago the lady guide said in 10 years Italian grapes will be raisins due to climate change and that is why so many french and italian companies are bu6ing up land in Sussex and Kent. Check out alfriston now…..huge vineyards.

https://rathfinnyestate.com/

 

[jakarta]

Nyetimber not cheap but compare it with similar quality French Fizz and there is a not a lot of difference but probably £20 cheaper. Currently around £30.

Obviously a monthly treat at that price, I seem to remember it going for £15 a bottle in our local Waitrose if you bought 6 which is simply daft - doubt if that offer will be repeated.

As an aside, Nyetimber are slowly but surely buying of loads of South Facing farmland locally to plant vines e.g. West Chiltington Golf Club!

 

[HalfaSeatOn]

Good intent to support local vineyards. Does this localism stretch to supporting spirit distilleries? I like Vodka and there seem to be distilleries such as Blackdown, Chilgrove and Silent Pool (latter more well known for their gins). Worth a purchase?

 

[jakarta]

Good intent to support local vineyards. Does this localism stretch to supporting spirit distilleries? I like Vodka and there seem to be distilleries such as Blackdown, Chilgrove and Silent Pool (latter more well known for their gins). Worth a purchase?

Mrs Jakarta is a Gin drinker and liked the Silent Pool I bought her for Christmas, She is normally a Bombay Sapphire fan.

I'm a bit of a philistine when it comes to spirits - they all taste the same to me especially when the mixer has been added!

 

[Hotchilidog]

Bottom end of the expensive scale but Albourne estates Bacchus can be found for £15.

I live on the edge of the vineyard and the investment is enormous.

They had to buy a farm, convert the whole thing to grape production, but all the industrial grade machinery to make the wine.....then wait 2-3 years until you start getting good yields, then figure out how to make the best wine you can.

It’s a minimum 20-30 years before it’s paid itself back, so we are just centuries behind our continental competition.

And the weather, forget reds. Whites and sparkling only.

Albourne Bacchus is great, very good value in my view.

To celebrate a mates housewarming I splashed out on a Rathfinney Blancs de Blanc, pricey but very nicely.

As has been pointed out there are structural reasons for the price of UK wines but our local vineyards produce some very good wine indeed and it’s nice to push the boat out occasionally.

 

[Pint of Ale and a Burger]

I wonder if it's possible to import the grapes but ferment and bottle in the UK.
Is it possible and would anyone drink it?

 

[Iford Albion]

Speaking of bottom, I've done a few plumbing jobs for Breaky Bottom vineyard near Rodmell, takes about 15mins to drive there from the main road over dirt tracks!

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But worth the drive for the beautiful setting and great wines. Peter started doing it so long ago. Visionary.

 

[albionalbino]

Nutbourne vineyards which is next door to Nyetimber do a delicious white called Sussex Reserve, it's under £15 and tastes like a NZ Sauvignon Blanc.

 

[West Hoathly Seagull]

I wonder if it's possible to import the grapes but ferment and bottle in the UK.
Is it possible and would anyone drink it?

Barnsgate Manor, just outside Crowborough, used to do that with Muller-Thurgau grapes. The winery was owned by the Pieroth company. We used to buy a lot when I was younger. However, Barnsgate Manor has gone bust. I don't know whether the winery was still going, but they were running a wedding and hospitality business there, and I suppose the pandemic finished them off.

Has anyone on here tried the wines from Kingscote Vineyard, just outside East Grinstead? It's very local to me, but it's only my mother and me at home. She can't really drink much wine because of medication, and I'm really a beer drinker.