[Politics] Liberal SJW professor owned by smart conservative student (and Milo)

[midnight_rendezvous]

If you see someone say something racist call them out by all means. I'll join you.

What about those cases of people being called racist when they haven't said anything racist and arn't racist though? Happens a lot on here.

Could you give me an example? Of course, if someone hasn’t said anything racist then, of course, I wouldn’t say they were racist. However, the issue lies with, as previously stated, that some people have a tendency to lack empathy or the ability to see that “low level” or casual racism isn’t ok. Worse case scenario they are so painfully ignorant they don’t see how what they’ve said is racist.

 

[The Clamp]

Not believing you are a racist doesn't not make you a racist.

 

[dingodan]

Could you give me an example? Of course, if someone hasn’t said anything racist then, of course, I wouldn’t say they were racist. However, the issue lies with, as previously stated, that some people have a tendency to lack empathy or the ability to see that “low level” or casual racism isn’t ok. Worse case scenario they are so painfully ignorant they don’t see how what they’ve said is racist.

Well this thread is about a professor claiming someone is racist, when they clearly aren't racist, and getting called out on it.

The underlying point which was mentioned in the post you responded to was that just being a conservative makes you open to the charge of racism these days. I've seen people get called racist on this board a lot recently, and at the same time I cannot think of one example of racism that I have seen on this board. [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION] saying he won't listen to someone because he "doesn't like Jews" is probably the only example I can think of that comes close, and that may have just been a very poor attempt at humor I don't know.

Also, I don't agree that there is such a thing as "low level" racism or "unconscious" racism, a person (or the things they say) are either racist or not. "Low level" is just an excuse for I can't actually demonstrate your racism or prove that you are racist but I'm sure you are, and that is exactly what I am talking about.

 

[dingodan]

Not believing you are a racist doesn't not make you a racist.

Likewise believing someone is a racist doesn't make them one.

 

[Jim Van Winkle]

Who the F is Milo?

He use to be my cat. Passed away last summer. Cool story I know.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Who the F is Milo?

Not who, but what - it's not very nice.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Well this thread is about a professor claiming someone is racist, when they clearly aren't racist, and getting called out on it.

The underlying point which was mentioned in the post you responded to was that just being a conservative makes you open to the charge of racism these days. I've seen people get called racist on this board a lot recently, and at the same time I cannot think of one example of racism that I have seen on this board. [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION] saying he won't listen to someone because he "doesn't like Jews" is probably the only example I can think of that comes close, and that may have just been a very poor attempt at humor I don't know.

Also, I don't agree that there is such a thing as "low level" racism or "unconscious" racism, a person (or the things they say) are either racist or not. "Low level" is just an excuse for I can't actually demonstrate your racism or prove that you are racist but I'm sure you are, and that is exactly what I am talking about.

I agree, that’s why I put “low level” racism in inverted commas. Racism is racism but in some people’s minds as long as they aren’t dropping the N bomb or using vile language of that ilk they can say whatever they like and it’s fine. I’ve seen some pretty blatant racism and xenophobia on NSC over the last few years, especially on the Brexit threads. And every time immigration is raised some pretty questionable language starts being bandied about.

As regards to being a conservative, of course that doesn’t make you a racist. But at the same time if you harbour racist, xenophobic, sexist, homophobic views and ideals you can’t hide behind ‘I’m not X, I’m just conservative’.

 

[larus]

Could you give me an example? Of course, if someone hasn’t said anything racist then, of course, I wouldn’t say they were racist. However, the issue lies with, as previously stated, that some people have a tendency to lack empathy or the ability to see that “low level” or casual racism isn’t ok. Worse case scenario they are so painfully ignorant they don’t see how what they’ve said is racist.

Go on the Brexit thread. Leave voters are routinely called racist etc. because they have the audacity to not believe in the great European Superstate. I agree that some people who voted to leave would have been racist, but there are lots of others who voted for other reasons.

If a Brexit voter said "I hate Jews" as per [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION], then the liberal types on here would be frothing at the mouth. I've not seen any condemnation of that post from the usual suspects yet!

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Go on the Brexit thread. Leave voters are routinely called racist etc. because they have the audacity to not believe in the great European Superstate. I agree that some people who voted to leave would have been racist, but there are lots of others who voted for other reasons.

If a Brexit voter said "I hate Jews" as per [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION], then the liberal types on here would be frothing at the mouth. I've not seen any condemnation of that post from the usual suspects yet!

As I said in my previous post, I’ve seen a lot of racism and xenophobia on the Brexit threads, almost exclusively from leave voters. Of course that doesn’t mean ALL those who voted leave are racist. But, again, you can’t say racist, xenophobic things and not expect to get called on it.

 

[larus]

As I said in my previous post, I’ve seen a lot of racism and xenophobia on the Brexit threads, almost exclusively from leave voters. Of course that doesn’t mean ALL those who voted leave are racist. But, again, you can’t say racist, xenophobic things and not expect to get called on it.

The problem with your wording is that it reads as though leave voters are racists. The problem is that a small number will say racist things and then it's made into a general accusation.

This doesn't detract from the original point that it's an easy thing for liberals to use the racist card on conservatives as it is very rarely challenged by other liberals. Surely that is just another form of racism (as I've been told that racism is more than ethnicity, it covers lifestyle choice, religion). So making bland accusations of racism towards Brexit voters and/or conservatives (as many Labour voters voted Brexit too), is just another form of racism.

 

[dingodan]

I agree, that’s why I put “low level” racism in inverted commas. Racism is racism but in some people’s minds as long as they aren’t dropping the N bomb or using vile language of that ilk they can say whatever they like and it’s fine. I’ve seen some pretty blatant racism and xenophobia on NSC over the last few years, especially on the Brexit threads. And every time immigration is raised some pretty questionable language starts being bandied about.

As regards to being a conservative, of course that doesn’t make you a racist. But at the same time if you harbour racist, xenophobic, sexist, homophobic views and ideals you can’t hide behind ‘I’m not X, I’m just conservative’.

Show me any actual example of racism and we'll fight it together. Talking about what is "in some peoples minds" and the things they didn't say (like the N bomb) but you think wanted to say is ghost hunting. If you've seen blatant racism then give me an example.

I don't see many people being called racist because they have said something racist, I don't see very much racism these days, and basically none on here. I do see the charge of racism banded about a lot, mostly directed at people because of their political views, views which are completely unrelated to race. Immigration for example is not a racial issue. It's mostly an economic issue, and in some cases a cultural issue, but it's never a racial issue, it's never about skin color except for those claiming racism.

I think racism is repugnant and ugly, obviously, but I also think calling someone a racist when it isn't justified is regnant and ugly too.

When you said that the way to avoid being called a racist is to not say racist things, you were kind of implying that when people are called racist it's because they have said racist things. You've said that you've seen some blatant racism, I'd like to know what you are referring to, but would you also concede that you have seen blatant cases of people being called racist when they clearly are not? Because it happens a lot. Assuming you have seen it, then actually no, not saying racist things is not sufficient to protect you from the charge of racism, and that is my point.

You end by saying of course being a conservative doesn't make you a racist. But then you go on to suggest that being a conservative can somehow be used as a defense of, or cover for, racism. Again, exactly my point.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

The problem with your wording is that it reads as though leave voters are racists. The problem is that a small number will say racist things and then it's made into a general accusation.

This doesn't detract from the original point that it's an easy thing for liberals to use the racist card on conservatives as it is very rarely challenged by other liberals. Surely that is just another form of racism (as I've been told that racism is more than ethnicity, it covers lifestyle choice, religion). So making bland accusations of racism towards Brexit voters and/or conservatives (as many Labour voters voted Brexit too), is just another form of racism.

I said that almost all the things that I have seen on Brexit threads that are racist and xenophobic have come from leave voters. I then immediately said that not all leave voters are racist. It’s a very important distinction. You seem, inadvertently I’m sure, to be creating a victim complex surrounding leave voters and conservatives. It is a tactic I’ve seen used before. Rest assured I’m not accusing you of anything, apart from having a utterly ludicrous final sentence.

 

[Guinness Boy]

I followed Milo's early Twitter rants on his "@Nero" handle and it was an absolute embarrassment from start to finish. Basically just him and his ultra middle class chums and conquests eating fois gras and talking fox hunting and doing down the poor. It was like something one of the Oxbridge kids on the Bambi episode of The Young Ones would have written. He's bullied women writers, defended holocaust jokes and wanted to interview a "legit racist".

https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/2...couraged-alt-right-to-bully-women_a_23236280/

He also ripped off the writers on his tech blog The Kernal and was made to pay outstanding wages as well as being accused of bullying there.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/mar/01/the-kernel

I actually vaguely knew Mic Wright as I used to chat to him on Twitter regularly. By all account Milo acted then and continues to act now like a prize c***.

Apart from that, carry on.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Show me any actual example of racism and we'll fight it together. Talking about what is "in some peoples minds" and the things they didn't say (like the N bomb) but you think wanted to say is ghost hunting. If you've seen blatant racism then give me an example.

I don't see many people being called racist because they have said something racist, I don't see very much racism these days, and basically none on here. I do see the charge of racism banded about a lot, mostly directed at people because of their political views, views which are completely unrelated to race. Immigration for example is not a racial issue. It's mostly an economic issue, and in some cases a cultural issue, but it's never a racial issue, it's never about skin color except for those claiming racism.

I think racism is repugnant and ugly, obviously, but I also think calling someone a racist when it isn't justified is regnant and ugly too.

When you said that the way to avoid being called a racist is to not say racist things, you were kind of implying that when people are called racist it's because they have said racist things. You've said that you've seen some blatant racism, I'd like to know what you are referring to, but would you also concede that you have seen blatant cases of people being called racist when they clearly are not? Because it happens a lot. Assuming you have seen it, then actually no, not saying racist things is not sufficient to protect you from the charge of racism, and that is my point.

You end by saying of course being a conservative doesn't make you a racist. But then you go on to suggest that being a conservative can somehow be used as a defense of, or cover for, racism. Again, exactly my point.

Because conservatism, by its very nature, is promoting traditional social institutions in the context of culture and civilization and prone to attracting those with ‘old fashioned’ views. It is therefore usually those with conservative views that attempt to hide their ideologies behind their conservatism (JRM and homosexuality for instance). That’s not to say it doesn’t exist with liberal ideology (Tim Farron a prime example) but I see far more examples of it happening with conservatives.

Maybe the definition of racism and racist is the issue here, as it can be used as a blanket term to include xenophobia, which is always rife in any discussion on Brexit and immigration on NSC. I’m sure if you read through the threads you’d find ample examples of anti immigrant rhetoric.

 

[larus]

I said that almost all the things that I have seen on Brexit threads that are racist and xenophobic have come from leave voters. I then immediately said that not all leave voters are racist. It’s a very important distinction. You seem, inadvertently I’m sure, to be creating a victim complex surrounding leave voters and conservatives. It is a tactic I’ve seen used before. Rest assured I’m not accusing you of anything, apart from having a utterly ludicrous final sentence.

Why is is ludicrous? Just because you happen to disagree with something does not make it ludicrous. Targeting a group of people based on their beliefs is racism. Why should political beliefs be any different to religious ones? After all, there is not god, so religion is imaginary anyway.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Why is is ludicrous? Just because you happen to disagree with something does not make it ludicrous. Targeting a group of people based on their beliefs is racism. Why should political beliefs be any different to religious ones? After all, there is not god, so religion is imaginary anyway.

Because you are not a race of peoples. You are a group of people who share a political ideology. Maybe my assumption you were creating a victim complex by accident was off the mark...

 

[larus]

Because conservatism, by its very nature, is promoting traditional social institutions in the context of culture and civilization and prone to attracting those with ‘old fashioned’ views. It is therefore usually those with conservative views that attempt to hide their ideologies behind their conservatism (JRM and homosexuality for instance). That’s not to say it doesn’t exist with liberal ideology (Tim Farron a prime example) but I see far more examples of it happening with conservatives.

Maybe the definition of racism and racist is the issue here, as it can be used as a blanket term to include xenophobia, which is always rife in any discussion on Brexit and immigration on NSC. I’m sure if you read through the threads you’d find ample examples of anti immigrant rhetoric.

The problem is that you are determining that anti-immigration (most people are not opposed to immigration BTW, what they are opposed to is the open borders within the EU) is xenophobic. This open border policy has placed huge strains on our infrastructure within this country, be that the NHS, schools or housing. I object to this policy for economic and not xenophobic
reasons.

 

[dingodan]

I followed Milo's early Twitter rants on his "@Nero" handle and it was an absolute embarrassment from start to finish. Basically just him and his ultra middle class chums and conquests eating fois gras and talking fox hunting and doing down the poor. It was like something one of the Oxbridge kids on the Bambi episode of The Young Ones would have written. He's bullied women writers, defended holocaust jokes and wanted to interview a "legit racist".

https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/2...couraged-alt-right-to-bully-women_a_23236280/

He also ripped off the writers on his tech blog The Kernal and was made to pay outstanding wages as well as being accused of bullying there.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/mar/01/the-kernel

I actually vaguely knew Mic Wright as I used to chat to him on Twitter regularly. By all account Milo acted then and continues to act now like a prize c***.

Apart from that, carry on.

Stop reading the guardian.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

The problem is that you are determining that anti-immigration (most people are not opposed to immigration BTW, what they are opposed to is the open borders within the EU) is xenophobic. This open border policy has placed huge strings on our infrastructure within this country, be that the NHS, schools or housing. I object to this policy for economic and not xenophobic
reasons.

But there is ample evidence that suggests that immigration is a massive boost to the economy. The current strains on the NHS, schools and local government are not because of immigration. They’re because of the policies of our current government. Part of the issue is that people don’t want to hear that. They want to hear that immigration and immigrants are making things worse or harder, and that, in spite of all the evidence to the contrary, is when accusations of xenophobia start getting thrown around.

 

[The Clamp]

Go on the Brexit thread. Leave voters are routinely called racist etc. because they have the audacity to not believe in the great European Superstate. I agree that some people who voted to leave would have been racist, but there are lots of others who voted for other reasons.

If a Brexit voter said "I hate Jews" as per [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION], then the liberal types on here would be frothing at the mouth. I've not seen any condemnation of that post from the usual suspects yet!

No. They'd be intelligent enough to realise it was funny. As I suspect you are.